[Politics] The Tories hit new LOWS with the Windrush situation

Thunder Bolt · Apr 17, 2018

pastafarian said:
I am, she has been told she is legal and not illegal, she has until 2024 to follow up on her legal status and claim the citizenship she is entitled to

She is a British citizen. It's not up to her to claim it anymore than it is for you to claim it.
The other government departments will have records of tax and NI payments, so let the brand new snazzy team Amber Rudd has set up do their work properly.
The Home Office had enough civil servants to identify her as an 'illegal' so now let them provide the documents they will already have.

Westdene Seagull · Apr 17, 2018

pastafarian said:
its been a while since the I.D. debate.
The world has changed a lot
If even Herr T is calling for a national register, is anyone still against an all encompassing ID scheme nowadays.......would sort out many issues

How exactly ? I'm anything but a 'liberal leftie' but I fail to see how an ID card would help me in my life over and above my driving licence and passport ? I certainly wouldn't be paying nearly £100 for one and I absolutely don't want to give the government the data they were considering for the last one - they can't be trusted with it.

Westdene Seagull · Apr 17, 2018

The Antikythera Mechanism said:
I’d go for identity cards. Would solve a plethora of issues unless you’ve got something to hide.

Oh, this poor pathetic argument of 'nothing to hide'. No I don't, I assume neither do you. Why don't we implement random stop and searches or even random house searches by the authorities ? After all, if you have nothing to hide you having nothing to worry about ?

Thunder Bolt · Apr 17, 2018

Westdene Seagull said:
I partly agree with you - human mistakes will always happen BUT it's the response from ministers, government departments and civil servants that is a key measure. Nearly always they only back down AFTER being shown publicly to be wrong. Even the statements coming out now aren't 'Yes, we got this entirely wrong and we'll do anything to put it right' - all the apologies seem forced, not real. Try dealing with HMRC or the DWP and see how quickly you get the 'We're right and you're wrong attitude'.

100% correct. Red tape rules in the Civil Service, and that's coming from a retired civil servant.

Westdene Seagull · Apr 17, 2018

pastafarian said:
I am, she has been told she is legal and not illegal, she has until 2024 to follow up on her legal status and claim the citizenship she is entitled to

Or the Home Office could actually do something useful for a change and now give her the correct status FOR LIFE.

alfredmizen · Apr 17, 2018

Herr Tubthumper said:
This is a 60 year old lady, show some compassion and understanding please.

Like you did when margaret thatcher died ?

dejavuatbtn · Apr 17, 2018

Westdene Seagull said:
How exactly ? I'm anything but a 'liberal leftie' but I fail to see how an ID card would help me in my life over and above my driving licence and passport ? I certainly wouldn't be paying nearly £100 for one and I absolutely don't want to give the government the data they were considering for the last one - they can't be trusted with it.

Ah, a passport eh? Isn’t that like an international ID card? The amount of personal information given up on these must be acceptable to you - perhaps everyone should be made to get one.

ManOfSussex · Apr 17, 2018

bashlsdir said:
All I remember was that the identity card went against peoples human rights, which is utterly pathetic. Whoever said what, introducing an identity card in the future would solve a load of problems.

A timeline for ID cards to their scrapping in 2010 by The Tories and Lib Dems is here - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10164331

As is pointed out in it, they were oversold as being a critical aide to national security and counter terrorism, then 7/7 happened.

LamieRobertson · Apr 17, 2018

dejavuatbtn said:
Ah, a passport eh? Isn’t that like an international ID card? The amount of personal information given up on these must be acceptable to you - perhaps everyone should be made to get one.

or perhaps not

Westdene Seagull · Apr 17, 2018

dejavuatbtn said:
Ah, a passport eh? Isn’t that like an international ID card? The amount of personal information given up on these must be acceptable to you - perhaps everyone should be made to get one.

A passport is optional and contains a very small amount of data - much less than was proposed for the ID card.

hans kraay fan club · Apr 17, 2018

alfredmizen said:
Like you did when margaret thatcher died ?

Anyone who reserved their compassion when Mrs Thatcher passed away, did so based on their opinions of her past actions, policies, and dare I say, her own perceived lack of compassion.

Not really comparable to this situation, where this lady, being held up as an example of those wronged, has done nothing wrong whatsoever, and is being upset / hurt / inconvenienced purely through the mistakes of our government / civil service.

Westdene Seagull · Apr 17, 2018

ManOfSussex said:
A timeline for ID cards to their scrapping in 2010 by The Tories and Lib Dems is here - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10164331

As is pointed out in it, they were oversold as being a critical aide to national security and counter terrorism, then 7/7 happened.

And Spain had ID cards ..... and then the Madrid bombings happened.

Saladpack Seagull · Apr 17, 2018

This whole thing is absolutely appalling. If the Government feel no shame, then I certainly do. People came here by invitation and in good faith and helped us build up post-War necessities such as the NHS and the transport infrastructure whilst being subjected to racial discrimination and a form of second-class citizenship. Instead of being grateful for their contribution to this country those in power have betrayed and disowned their children, many of whom are (like me) in their 60's. They are as British as I am and many (like me) have carried rifle and pack and worn the military and civilian uniforms of our country with pride. I am utterly shocked that they should be so betrayed and hope that my insignificant voice can somehow add to those already calling for justice and common decency. I hope, as our Government reps stand at the Cenotaph this year, they will take notice of the West Indian ex-servicemen and see that they wear with pride the same medals as the rest of us. That they and their children should be treated so shabbily really upsets me.

ManOfSussex · Apr 17, 2018

Westdene Seagull said:
And Spain had ID cards ..... and then the Madrid bombings happened.

Very true. Were the Madrid bombers all Spanish citizens in the way all the 7/7 ones were British though?

Thunder Bolt · Apr 17, 2018

hans kraay fan club said:
Anyone who reserved their compassion when Mrs Thatcher passed away, did so based on their opinions of her past actions, policies, and dare I say, her own perceived lack of compassion.

Not really comparable to this situation, where this lady, being held up as an example of those wronged, has done nothing wrong whatsoever, and is being upset / hurt / inconvenienced purely through the mistakes of our government / civil service.

This is interesting.
https://twitter.com/ChidiObihara/status/986162841546842112

[tweet]986162841546842112[/tweet]

Thunder Bolt · Apr 17, 2018

Thunder Bolt said:
A very moving interview on BBC Breakfast this morning with Paulette, a lady in her 60s, who came here as a 10 year old.
She got a letter out of the blue, last year telling her she was illegal, and she had just six weeks to prove she was legal. She ended up in a detention centre.
She has now been to the Home Office and has a card saying she is legal BUT it only lasts until 2024. She is very shaken, hurt and upset by all this, when she has done nothing wrong. She may have to go all through this again.
She said the apology from Amber Rudd is only a very small part of what has to be put right.

Here we are.

Paulette Wilson aged 61. She actually worked in the House of Commons serving food to MPs. You don't get a job in a secure building in Westminster without checks, and yet years later, she is being questioned like a criminal in Wolverhampton.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/16/windrush-u-turn-welcome-but-theresa-may-policy-cruel

ManOfSussex · Apr 17, 2018

Thunder Bolt said:
Here we are.

Paulette Wilson aged 61. She actually worked in the House of Commons serving food to MPs. You don't get a job in a secure building in Westminster without checks, and yet years later, she is being questioned like a criminal in Wolverhampton.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/16/windrush-u-turn-welcome-but-theresa-may-policy-cruel

There's an article here from the autumn when she was released from Yarl's Wood. What sort of country locks up a 61 year old woman who's lived here for 50 years?- http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-41749426

Begs the question, why wasn't Amber Rudd's task-force set up yesterday, set up then? Clueless cretins the lot of them. :rant:

Thunder Bolt · Apr 17, 2018

ManOfSussex said:
There's an article here from the autumn when she was released from Yarl's Wood. What sort of country locks up a 61 year old woman who's lived here for 50 years?- http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-41749426

Begs the question, why wasn't Amber Rudd's task-force set up yesterday, set up then? Clueless cretins the lot of them.

Exactly the point I was trying to make yesterday. The press especially Ch4news, and David Lammy have brought it all out into the open over the weekend, but as recently as yesterday morning, Theresa May was refusing to meet the Commonwealth leaders tomorrow to discuss it.
She changed her mind in the afternoon, but was she made to? I think so.

If these people hadn't kept fighting for justice, who would have heard of it? Shameful is the right word.

ManOfSussex · Apr 17, 2018

Thunder Bolt said:
Exactly the point I was trying to make yesterday. The press especially Ch4news, and David Lammy have brought it all out into the open over the weekend, but as recently as yesterday morning, Theresa May was refusing to meet the Commonwealth leaders tomorrow to discuss it.
She changed her mind in the afternoon, but was she made to? I think so.

If these people hadn't kept fighting for justice, who would have heard of it? Shameful is the right word.

On Newsnight last night they interviewed Sonia Williams below - she had her Drivers License removed, lost her job and right to claim benefits and was told back in 2014 she didn't have Indefinite Leave To Remain! Utterly shameful.

[tweet]985999432687632384[/tweet]

Gwylan · Apr 17, 2018

Thunder Bolt said:
Exactly the point I was trying to make yesterday. The press especially Ch4news, and David Lammy have brought it all out into the open over the weekend,

I know that it has a low reputation on NSC, but it's The Guardian, specifically Amelia Gentleman, who first alerted us to this problem last autumn, it's taken about six months for the rest of the media to catch up with the story.

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[Politics] The Tories hit new LOWS with the Windrush situation

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