Hampster Gull
New member
- Dec 22, 2010
- 13,462
Under Labour we have experienceof no being able to pay our debts. At the time it was the biggest ask on IMF resources
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General Election 2015
- Thread starter Herr Tubthumper
- Start date
Under Labour we have experienceof no being able to pay our debts. At the time it was the biggest ask on IMF resources
Yes, in the 1970s, nearly half a century ago. I agree. Equally, the NHS was built on Labour's watch. Without them, people would still be dying from tetanus after treading on a rusty nail - which is what happened to my great grandfather in the 20s apparently.
However, the plaudits Labour gain from the birth of the NHS are about as relevant as the fact they overspent in 1974. Now do you want me to list all the deficiencies we've seen under Tory governments since before most people on here were born, or shall we just stick to the more relevant facts - which are performance in the past decade or so, and policies for this election? I know what I'd prefer. And your nonsensical scaremongering to suit your argument has no place here.
Bold Seagull
strong and stable with me, or...
From '97 to '08 there wasn't a huge deficit prior to the global crash. In 2007 it was a lower deficit than the Tories had it in 1995.
From '97 to '08 there wasn't a huge deficit prior to the global crash. In 2007 it was a lower deficit than the Tories had it in 1995.
I wonder whether Hampster was writing letters into GullsEye in 1995 to tell anyone who would listen that the Tories had left the country "in an absolute mess"?
Rather than thumbsdown me for this post [MENTION=22389]bashlsdir[/MENTION], let's hear from you about how the increased dependency on food banks is a good thing? Or how Labour would be a disaster?
Hampster Gull
New member
- Dec 22, 2010
- 13,462
nonsensical? I an eminently qualified to talk in this field, but accept some will not agree with me.
Scaremongering? Really? You obviously disagree with what i am saying but many dont
no place here? Are you for real? Please put me forward for a ban Your Highness.
Hampster Gull
New member
- Dec 22, 2010
- 13,462
From '97 to '08 there wasn't a huge deficit prior to the global crash. In 2007 it was a lower deficit than the Tories had it in 1995.
Oh dear. It was based on an unsustainable tax tax. When the times are good you run a surplus, when the times are bad you run a deficit. Lost on many.
Hampster Gull
New member
- Dec 22, 2010
- 13,462
According to the FT the economy was "well into its third year of recovery"
alfredmizen
Banned
- Mar 11, 2015
- 6,342
It didn't for your guide, this has been a far worse recession, and the reason for repossessions is the difference in interest rates, tell me, how long were rates at 15% for ?
Bold Seagull
strong and stable with me, or...
That mantra left us with millions of kids across the country learning in temporary classrooms as we went into the '90's. Spending on education at the start of the '90's was half what it was in the '70's and it showed. The Tories knew this and knew drastic spending was needed. I was part of a nationwide review of all school accommodation in 1995, and it demonstrated that our building infrastructure needed drastic investment and spending. This could be similarly applied across our public sector building stock and infrastructure.
You can't have a period of not spending anything, then look at your real estate and realise that 15 years of under investment means you have some serious repair bills on your hands. The economy is not just our balance sheet, as Simster said earlier we own a huge amount of actual stuff that needs looking after.
The same thing will happen again after this period. All these cuts will appear to be achieving their goal, but by 2020 say, we'll realise that many of our schools, hospitals, emergency services etc. will need investment after a period of neglect. That is what is lost on many.
alfredmizen
Banned
- Mar 11, 2015
- 6,342
the 'dependency' on food banks is down to human nature, if it's offered , people will take it, no more , no less.
Agreed, it amazes mean that some people on here think that debt interest of £1 billion pound a week twice the defence budget is okay,so many problems could be solved If we just halved the debt.Also is it fair that we hand this debt on to future generations
We're all qualified to talk in this field, but it would be useful if you could reign in the hyperbole and plain bullshit. You seem to have backtracked on this stupid idea that Labour left the country "in an absolute mess" in 2010, because clearly they didn't. They left a level of debt some were uncomfortable with, and the solution appears to have been to slash the benefit state which has unfortunately left many people in dire straights if those food bank figures are anything to go by.
And please, read what I wrote. I didn't say there was no place for you here, I said there was no place for your scaremongering clap trap on this thread. So wind your neck in, put your knickers back on, and refrain from attempting to take the moral high ground on me.
Words fail me.
The bit I've highlighted in bold is what always seems to pass Tory cost cutting apologists by. Here is another analogy that explains the problem:
We have millions of miles of roads in this country. Several harsh winters lead to pot holes appearing, year on year. Fixing them appears expensive. However, we could always cut public spending by not fixing them.
Unfortunately though, this means that the country ends up paying a lot more because of the cost of blown tyres to people's cars, and the time cost associated with roads that mean we have to travel more slowly. And then of course, when we decide we can afford to fix the pot holes, we have to import pot hole fixers from abroad because we've put all our pot hole fillers out of business by not employing them for the previous few years, which is far more expensive to the country, not least because those British workers are now being paid to sit on the dole.
Bold Seagull
strong and stable with me, or...
Sept '88 interest rates reached 12% and didn't go back down to 10% to Sept '91. During that 3 year period, they went to 15% or higher from Oct '89 to Oct '90.
Then we had Black Wednesday and we dropped out of the ERM. Sept '92 interest rates went back up to 12%, however they did steadily fall over the coming months.
Ernest
Stupid IDIOT
Under a Conservative government, still this myth goes round about their economic competence, Norman Lamont singing in the bath sums that up
somerset
New member
With interest rates strangled by the European financial entities, most countries had no choice,......the exit from the ERM prompted a steady reduction to manageable levels.
Simster has addressed 2010 but this myth also needs to be examined too. The UK had been borrowing from the IMF to meet shortfalls (or to pay its bills as HG puts it) since the Tory government of 1956, so it's not just a Labour phenomenon (see here for some detail)
Admittedly the 1976 crisis was a bigger scale of borrowing and for a longer period but that's an indication of the deep malaise in the UK economy at the time. However, Balogh, the chief economic adviser to the Wilson government suggested that applying to the IMF would probably be necessary in December 1975, just a couple of months after Wilson had his majority government. The idea that any government, Labour or otherwise, could reduce an economy to penury in just a few weeks is laughable. Balogh pinned the blame on the boom-bust policies of the Heath government - in particular on Barber.
It's true that Healey's talk of squeezing the rich until their pips squeak would have scared off investors and not helped the economy and it's true that the unions were pushing for inflation busting pay rises. But the Labour government was doing pretty well in bringing inflation down and the IMF loan provided some stability for the process.
The Labour government wasn't the total disaster that people seem to think it was. Thatcher won a narrow victory but that was almost certainly due to the levels of industrial action in the winter of that year (and the exceptionally harsh winter). Don't forget that opinion polls at the end of 1978 had Labour narrowly in the lead, scarcely a reflection of economic chaos
- Thread starter
- #2,739
This is astonishing. 40% of new teachers quit within a year under a Tory watch. I dread to think how much money this chaos is costing us, and the effect it has on the children. It's a shocking figure.
http://www.theguardian.com/education/2015/mar/31/four-in-10-new-teachers-quit-within-a-year
http://www.theguardian.com/education/2015/mar/31/four-in-10-new-teachers-quit-within-a-year
D
Deleted member 22389
Guest
It takes a special type of person to teach and be able to teach effectively and not crack under pressure. A lot depends on what school you end up at as well. If you have nightmare kids it makes the job even harder on top of the governments interference. Doesn't matter what party it is, they keep messing around with things and moving the goal posts. How about doing something simple and sticking to it, like asking the teachers what they need and keeping bloody politicians out of the classrooms.