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Question Time - BBC1 22:45



Blackadder

Blackadder

Brighton Bhuna Boy
Jul 6, 2003
16,077
Haywards Heath
Weststander said:
QT next week should comprise the dream team of

David Starkey
Peter Hitchens
Katie Hopkins
Will Self
George Galloway
Diane Abbott
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blue'n'white said:
Think there should be an extra space for Chakrabarti and of course we mustn't forget Joey Barton
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JB could take the place of JD and chair it. When the likes of Katie Hopkins and Diane Abbott start waffling, he can stub a cigar out on them!
 




C

cunning fergus

Well-known member
Jan 18, 2009
4,745
JCL666 said:
well done on your glib answer.

I'm not implying that I think flying planes into buildings and murdering people is acceptable or justifiable. I don't at all.

I asked if you think that foreign policy had nothing to do with 9/11. If you don't then I suggest you have a look at the possible motives.

While you're at it, have a look at the estimated impact of things like sanctions against irag (there's a clue there regarding motives).
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I am not sure how old you are, however I can tell you that the first encounter I (and many others in this country) had with Muslim extremists was in the aftermath of the publication of the Satanic Verses.

That was in 1988.

From that point on this country has been dealing with a growing population of muslims, and the consequences of that are a litany of terror related events, Manchester being the most recent.

The simple facts are that many within the Muslim population consider western society and its values as beneath contempt. It's why they largely separate themselves from it.

That has nothing to do with this country's foreign or domestic policy, albeit Iraq etc has created a convenient excuse for them to deploy in seeking to justify their murderous acts.

If we had not gone to Iraq terrorist acts like Manchester would still be happening. Germany has had its own Islamic terrorist violence and they have got a largely clean record (in contemporary times anyway.

Anyone who thinks otherwise is delusional, and they are part of the problem.

We were warned about the extremism that some Muslim people living amongst us had in 1988, we didn't do anything about it, we are reaping the whirlwind.
 
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rocker959

rocker959

Well-known member
Jan 22, 2011
2,802
Plovdiv Bulgaria
cunning fergus said:
I am not sure how old you are, however I can tell you that the first encounter I (and many others in this country) had with Muslim extremists was in the aftermath of the publication of the Satanic Verses.

That was in 1988.

From that point on this country has been dealing with a growing population of muslims, and the consequences of that are a litany of terror related events, Manchester being the most recent.

The simple facts are that many within the Muslim population consider western society and its values as beneath contempt. It's why they largely separate themselves from it.

That has nothing to do with this country's foreign or domestic policy, albeit Iraq etc has created a convenient excuse for them to deploy in seeking to justify their murderous acts.

If we had not gone to Iraq terrorist acts like Manchester would still be happening. Germany has had its own Islamic terrorist violence and they have got a largely clean record (in contemporary times anyway.

Anyone who thinks otherwise is delusional, and they are part of the problem.

We were warned about the extremism that some Muslim people living amongst us had in 1988, we didn't do anything about it, we are reaping the whirlwind.
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Well said .
 


Ernest

Ernest

Stupid IDIOT
Nov 8, 2003
42,739
LOONEY BIN
cunning fergus said:
I am not sure how old you are, however I can tell you that the first encounter I (and many others in this country) had with Muslim extremists was connected with Islamic extremists and intolerance was in the aftermath of the publication of the Satanic Verses.

That was in 1988.

From that point on this country has been dealing with a growing population of muslims, and the consequences of that are a litany of terror related events, Manchester being the most recent.

The simple facts are that many within the Muslim population consider western society and its values as beneath contempt. It's why they largely separate themselves from it.

That has nothing to do with this country's foreign or domestic policy, albeit Iraq etc has created a convenient excuse for them to deploy in seeking to justify their murderous acts.

If we had not gone to Iraq terrorist acts like Manchester would still be happening. Germany has had its own Islamic terrorist violence and they have got a largely clean record (in contemporary times anyway.

Anyone who thinks otherwise is delusional, and they are part of the problem.

We were warned about the extremism that some Muslim people living amongst us had in 1988, we didn't do anything about it, we are reaping the whirlwind.
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If you remember Norman Tebbit's cricket test about how generations of Pakistanis and Indians who had lived here for decades yet still considered themselves to be Indian or Pakistani which follows on that their religion is far more important than trying to consider themselves as British and follow the British way of life.
This has been brewing for as long as you say if not longer , now it is a lot easier to spread messages of hate and for gullible dupes to lap it up and hate their neighbours and try to destroy them
 


C

cunning fergus

Well-known member
Jan 18, 2009
4,745
Ernest said:
If you remember Norman Tebbit's cricket test about how generations of Pakistanis and Indians who had lived here for decades yet still considered themselves to be Indian or Pakistani which follows on that their religion is far more important than trying to consider themselves as British and follow the British way of life.
This has been brewing for as long as you say if not longer , now it is a lot easier to spread messages of hate and for gullible dupes to lap it up and hate their neighbours and try to destroy them
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Yes I do remember it.

This was at a time when we understood clearly what British values were and when the narrative that this country was a mongrel nation of immigrants had not taken root.

Our political classes have a lot to answer for.
 




JCL666

JCL666

absurdism
Sep 23, 2011
2,190
cunning fergus said:
I am not sure how old you are, however I can tell you that the first encounter I (and many others in this country) had with Muslim extremists was in the aftermath of the publication of the Satanic Verses.

That was in 1988.

From that point on this country has been dealing with a growing population of muslims, and the consequences of that are a litany of terror related events, Manchester being the most recent.

The simple facts are that many within the Muslim population consider western society and its values as beneath contempt. It's why they largely separate themselves from it.

That has nothing to do with this country's foreign or domestic policy, albeit Iraq etc has created a convenient excuse for them to deploy in seeking to justify their murderous acts.

If we had not gone to Iraq terrorist acts like Manchester would still be happening. Germany has had its own Islamic terrorist violence and they have got a largely clean record (in contemporary times anyway.

Anyone who thinks otherwise is delusional, and they are part of the problem.

We were warned about the extremism that some Muslim people living amongst us had in 1988, we didn't do anything about it, we are reaping the whirlwind.
Click to expand...

I'm delusional because i think that western foreign policy in the middle east has nothing to do with why some people hate us?

Yeah whatever.
 


Bladders

Bladders

Twats everywhere
Jun 22, 2012
13,672
The Troubadour
JCL666 said:
I'm delusional because i think that western foreign policy in the middle east has nothing to do with why some people hate us?

Yeah whatever.
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Which bit? Because the West has had foreign policy there in some shape of form for decades and decades.
 


M

Mo Gosfield

Well-known member
Aug 11, 2010
6,284
portlock seagull said:
Precisely. It might as well have been 'Can we all just pretend it didn't happen? "Yep, all sorted then...ok, that's great everyone thank you. Next week we're in Taunton..."

The elephant in the room just got a bit bigger. Civil war coming to the UK circa 2050 anyone?
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I would suggest that it could be a lot closer than that.
At grass roots level, amongst normal working class people, there has been a simmering undercurrent of tension growing for some time now. Its a little like a pressure cooker boiling away and just occasionally letting off steam until the pot is ignored for too long and blows like a volcano. It will happen and this country will never be the same again.
 






Weststander

Weststander

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 25, 2011
63,909
Withdean area
Bladders said:
Which bit? Because the West has had foreign policy there in some shape of form for decades and decades.
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I'm delusional too. I imagined that Islamic fundamentalists had murdered in Sweden, Spain, Belgium, Chad, Cameroon, Indonesia and Bangladesh. They couldn't possibly have, because the also innocent people in those countries and their governments got involved in the Middle East. In addition, they're not all Christian.
 








M

Mo Gosfield

Well-known member
Aug 11, 2010
6,284
portlock seagull said:
We are terrified of offending people, it's in our DNA. A peculiarly British trait lies at the very root of the problem rather ironically! Could be the death of us all perhaps?
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It is in our DNA and goes right back to the feudal system in the Middle Ages. The serf was taught to know his place and tugged his forelock at the Lord of the Manor, who took the majority of the serf's output for himself, leaving the serf with a pittance to live on. So, exactly what still goes on today. The poor old serf was terrified to speak out, for fear of being punished. Exactly what goes on today, with people terrified of offending by speaking out.
A lot of people are subservient by nature and actually like the comfort of Big Brother controlling their lives. They like the status quo and feel uncomfortable with change. It has been bred into people for hundreds of years and it is difficult for many to throw off the shackles and be a free spirit and indulge in free speech. We have been conditioned into being offended by almost everything. Our tolerant society has become intolerant, as what is perceived to be permissible, becomes more and more limited.
 


Pavilionaire

Pavilionaire

Well-known member
Jul 7, 2003
30,566
QT was night was disappointing. Rudd and Burnham were never going to get feisty so soon after the bombing, and there was a general avoidance of the key issues here about policy towards taking refugees from the likes of Libya, failure to act on verbal reports of radicalisation, the uncontrolled and huge numbers of immigrants from non-EU countries in our country, failure to assimilate.

The elephant in the room was ignored.
 




D

Deleted member 22389

Guest
Pavilionaire said:
QT was night was disappointing. Rudd and Burnham were never going to get feisty so soon after the bombing, and there was a general avoidance of the key issues here about policy towards taking refugees from the likes of Libya, failure to act on verbal reports of radicalisation, the uncontrolled and huge numbers of immigrants from non-EU countries in our country, failure to assimilate.

The elephant in the room was ignored.
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As always.
 


symyjym

symyjym

Banned
Nov 2, 2009
13,138
Brighton / Hove actually
Pavilionaire said:
QT was night was disappointing. Rudd and Burnham were never going to get feisty so soon after the bombing, and there was a general avoidance of the key issues here about policy towards taking refugees from the likes of Libya, failure to act on verbal reports of radicalisation, the uncontrolled and huge numbers of immigrants from non-EU countries in our country, failure to assimilate.

The elephant in the room was ignored.
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No one dared to mention the character of Muhammad and who all extremists aspire to emulate. Discussing Islam without Muhammad is like fishing in a sandpit.
 


Bry Nylon

Bry Nylon

Test your smoke alarm
Helpful Moderator
Jul 21, 2003
19,844
Playing snooker
These community leaders, Imams, elders and such-like need to be told to sort their shit out very, very quickly. If they can't, or won't, they need to understand it will be sorted out for them by the security services and the special forces.
 


K

knocky1

Well-known member
Jan 20, 2010
12,963
cunning fergus said:
Yes I do remember it.

This was at a time when we understood clearly what British values were and when the narrative that this country was a mongrel nation of immigrants had not taken root.

Our political classes have a lot to answer for.
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I did not agree with what you understood to be British values at the time of Tebbit's cricket test. I have always fought hard to not be racist. Britain was multicultural to me, from late 70's onwards. You can stick your Roman, Viking, French and whatever mixed, British pedigree up your arse. Mongrel.
 








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