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Advice needed from landlords of the good NSC family.



*Gullsworth*

My Hair is like his hair
Jan 20, 2006
9,351
West...West.......WEST SUSSEX
I have received a letter from my management company informing me that I require a Legionella Risk Assessment certificate every two years to comply with new legislation that now covers residential properties as well as industrial facilities. It has become a legal requirement approved by health & safety with the consent of the Secretary of state making a legal duty to landlords to provide a certificate every two years.
I have been quoted £125 plus vat for providing this certificate (ACOP L8) by my management company.
My question is who can provide these tests and certificates? Would your local plumber be qualified to provide you with this risk assessment certificate? Would it be any cheaper?
I have told my wife spending hours on NSC is not all football, football , football and is a real help in many different ways.. Thanks for any info in advance, off to have a sausage for tea!:D
*Gullsworth*
 

Rowdey

Well-known member
Jul 7, 2003
2,528
Herne Hill
Although we're taught about Legionella's and how to prevent/assess potential risk, i think this is a fairly new cert, and wouldn't come under trained plumbers qualification (unless it been added since my exams a good few years ago..)

Depending upon how many neighbors you have who also need it, at £350/450 for the course it could be worthwhile taking said course and making some bucks in the process..
 

Greyrun

New member
Feb 23, 2009
1,074
As a landlord this is news to me and I am with a management company,if you google ACOP L8 it takes you to the health and safety website.It does not suggest on there that it is compulsory to have a certificate, sounds as if they have thought of a new way of screwing a few more pounds out of you.
 

nwgull

Well-known member
Jul 25, 2003
13,632
Manchester
The requirement on this seems to be a bit ambiguous. I know that my property is very low risk: the shower is electric (and rinses through with cold water when turned off), and the boiler is a combi. However, it's unclear where or not I need a professional to tell me this for £150.
 

BN9 BHA

DOCKERS
NSC Licker Extraordinaire
Jul 14, 2013
21,391
Newhaven
[MENTION=4368]*Gullsworth*[/MENTION]
Have a word with TSS Facilities Ltd of Hove, they Legionella testing in schools and council sports changing rooms etc, hopefully they can advise you on this.
 


looney

Banned
Jul 7, 2003
15,652
Another virtually non existent solution to a virtually non existent problem.
 

PILTDOWN MAN

Well-known member
NSC Licker Extraordinaire
Sep 15, 2004
18,573
Hurst Green
Having had a quick read. While I'm not qualified so to speak about plumbing I used to a Health & Safety Manager for British Airways. Ben's Grandad will tell you I know my stuff as I helped him.

A lot of HSE leaflets and legislation use terms, competent person, were practicable and so on. These deliberately cause ambiguity.

Reading the info it now appears since the removal of the 300 L rule that all tenants (residential inc) require a risk assessment. This assessment can be done by a competent person. Now you may consider yourself competent but as there's very little info (as always) on who the HSE deem unless you are specifically trained I would suggest you're not.

However from what I can see there's no certificate but a live risk assessment. (Meaning its not closed and revisited) Unless I've missed something it doesn't state two years, I'll keep looking.

Here's the important bit.




Organisations, or self-employed individuals, who provide residential accommodation or who are responsible for the water system(s) in their premises, are responsible for ensuring that the risk of exposure to legionella in those premises is properly assessed and controlled. All water systems require an assessment of the risk which they can carry out themselves if they are competent, or employ somebody who is.

In most residential settings, a simple assessment may show that the risks are low and no further action may be necessary. (An example of a typical lower risk situation may be found in a small building (eg housing unit) with small domestic-type water systems, where daily water usage is inevitable and sufficient to turn over the entire system; where cold water is directly from a wholesome mains supply (no stored water tanks); where hot water is fed from instantaneous heaters or low volume water heaters (supplying outlets at 50 °C); and where the only outlets are toilets and wash hand basins). If the assessment shows the risks are low and are being properly managed, no further action is needed but it is important to review the assessment regularly in case anything changes in the system.

Simple control measures can help control the risk of exposure to legionella such as:

flushing out the system prior to letting the property
avoiding debris getting into the system (eg ensure the cold water tanks, where fitted, have a tight fitting lid)
setting control parameters (eg setting the temperature of the calorifier to ensure water is stored at 60°C)
make sure any redundant pipework identified is removed.

Tenants should be advised of any control measures put in place that should be maintained eg not to adjust the temperature setting of the calorifier, to regularly clean showerheads and to inform the landlord if the hot water is not heating properly or there are any other problems with the system so that appropriate action can be taken. If there are difficulties gaining access to occupied housing units, appropriate checks can be made by carrying out inspections of the water system, for example, when undertaking mandatory visits such as gas safety checks or routine maintenance visits.

Where showers are installed, these have the means of creating and dispersing water droplets which may be inhaled causing a foreseeable risk of exposure to legionella. However, if used regularly (as in the majority of most domestic settings) the risks are reduced but in any case, tenants should be advised to regularly clean and disinfect showerheads. Instantaneous electric showers pose less of a risk as they are generally coldwater-fed and heat only small volumes of water during operation.
It is important that water is not allowed to stagnate within the water system and so there should be careful management of dwellings that are vacant for extended periods (eg student accommodation left empty over the summer vacation). As a general principle, outlets on hot and cold water systems should be used at least once a week to maintain a degree of water flow and minimise the chances if stagnation. To manage the risks during non-occupancy, consideration should be given to implementing a suitable flushing regime or other measures such as draining the system if it is to remain vacant for long periods.


It again suggests you can do it. After all it's normally a simple system. You can virtually write an assessment pointing out the need to run all taps etc on a regular basis and to keep them clean. There you go I've done it!

Good one here http://rla.org.uk/landlord/guides/legionnaires_disease.shtml suggests if you competent (there we go again) you'll be ok, I would say looking at that most of us would actually be deemed to be.
 

Brighton Mod

Its All Too Beautiful
I've never heard of this and have no plans to implement it, as an addendum to this my insurance company recently quoted me terrorism insurance on my properties. Landlords are seen as a soft touch by authorities being forced to spend money by others who are not footing the bill. I reckon they're having you over.
 


PILTDOWN MAN

Well-known member
NSC Licker Extraordinaire
Sep 15, 2004
18,573
Hurst Green
I've never heard of this and have no plans to implement it, as an addendum to this my insurance company recently quoted me terrorism insurance on my properties. Landlords are seen as a soft touch by authorities being forced to spend money by others who are not footing the bill. I reckon they're having you over.

The management company maybe but the law states you have to.
 

Giraffe

VERY part time moderator
Helpful Moderator
NSC Licker Extraordinaire
Aug 8, 2005
26,421
It is currently a grey area, with some letting agents interpreting it as a legal requirement to get it done (the same as a gas safety certificate) and others taking a more pragmatic approach as the risks are significantly less than those if you don't get the gas safety certificate done.

It seems your agent has taken the most cautious approach, and will be making a bit of money to boot.
 


*Gullsworth*

My Hair is like his hair
Jan 20, 2006
9,351
West...West.......WEST SUSSEX


MMmmmm still looks a very grey area. Thanks for all your thoughts and comments. From the Landlord zone website it is clear the management company I use is not the only one to offer their services for around 120 quid. Having said that although it is mentioned that it is law not many people seem to be rushing to satisfy the legal requirements. From what I can see from comments viewpoints and guesswork you would only be liable if someone contracted Legionella and you were deemed responsible for not acting as a responsible landlord in safeguarding the tenants safety but it is not illegal to rent your property without the said certificate of safety.
 

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