Thunder Bolt
Silly old bat
QPR have opened up Loftus Road for facilities for now.
Got something to say or just want fewer pesky ads? Join us... 😊
Massive fire in London - Grenfell Tower in Shepherds Bush
- Thread starter Dick Head
- Start date
QPR have opened up Loftus Road for facilities for now.
Dr. Notthenineo'clocknews
Remainer
Yeah I heard and I agree with you, perhaps it was some of those she interviewed seemed to make light of it (perhaps they were in shock)
Ⓩ-Ⓐ-Ⓜ-Ⓞ-Ⓡ-Ⓐ
Hove / Παρος
There was no fire escape or alternative route out of the building other than the main stairwell. In new builds this wouldn't pass planning as it contravenes basic building regulations, so I'm surprised that during a renovation this wasn't addressed as a requirement. They should have been required to provide AT LEAST one alternative means of escape, in this case something like an retrofitted external staircase would have been required.
Lankyseagull
One Step Beyond
I agree. I am an Architectural Technologist and work on large scale residential developments for national housebuilder clients. In my 28 year career, I have only dealt with one development of apartments in which a sprinkler system was installed (at the time, the late 90's it was the first development in Surrey to include one). The only reason it was included was because it was the only way to achieve Building Regulation compliance for the design.
You have to remember that the Building Regulations set out the MINIMUM standards that buildings must be constructed to. Most developers see that as the benchmark and anything else is "guilding the lily". The current Part B documents do include references to sprinklers however they only come into play if certain other criteria cannot be met - more often than not, you can make a building safe from fire spread by applying the minimum standards.
There is also no requirement to install a communal fire alarm system - only smoke/heat detectors within individual flats - and 'stay put' policy is normal.
Most tower blocks being designed these days will include the services of a Fire Engineering Consultant to ensure that the design of a building not only complies with the regulations, but exceeds them - sometimes professional engineering not only provides a compliant solution, but can represent a saving to the developer on a design that complies with the minimum standards.
My personal view is that we will see the Building Regulations updated to make sprinkler systems mandatory. Unfortunately, it has taken a catastrophic & tragic event such as this to start the process.
symyjym
Banned
It seems it is not mandatory for sprinklers systems but fire alarms are different. I don’t think leaving fire alarm as an option to fit individual ones yourself. The twist in this is that the advice to shut yourself in and not try to escape anyway, which would mean that if they had an official fire alarm system put in, the advice is basically to stay put. It looks like when a building is designed to contain a fire a main fire alarm system isn’t required? I would question though that surely with just fire containment in mind in the design, a sprinkler system would rationally be part of the safety regulations.
DavidRyder
Well-known member
- Jul 23, 2013
- 2,888
God this is awful news. I hadn't found out until 10 mins after the fixtures came out. Perspective well and truly put in place. Hope these people get the support they'll need.
symyjym
Banned
Thanks. So in these flats they have gone for minimum standard of fire containment, similar to the water containment for the Titanic and not providing enough lifeboats.
It's also the "stay where you are and shut the door message" that makes the safety procedures absurd which negates the requirement of fire alarms.
Sussex Nomad
Well-known member
I used to get off at Latimer Road and worked half a mile away at Monsoon Accessorize HQ when I lived in Camden. I saw that block of flats every day.
brightn'ove
cringe
You're damn right.
Thanks for the response.
junior
Well-known member
....
Curious Orange
Punxsatawney Phil
Absolutely, I hope that people will look at the recent terrorist incidents in a new light too - the numbers who died in this fire could well be significant, though let us hope not.
Leekbrookgull
Well-known member
Perhaps we should all think about our safety a lot more in as much as do you have a Fire Extinguisher in your home or car ? What about a Smash Glass Hammer and knife (cut the seatbelts) what about smoke alarm ? Power surge or that power box that trips out ?
Leekbrookgull
Well-known member
So Lanky we can have a school with plenty of rooms and people and when the Fire Bell goes its all out wherever you are and yet tower block plenty of rooms and people doesn't need a central Fire Bell ?
pearl
Well-known member
just heard that too
clapham_gull
Legacy Fan
- Aug 20, 2003
- 25,338
If anyone wants to donate money this is how I have been suggested to do so.
https://thekandcfoundation.com/donate/
I work just opposite and we were all emailed this earlier. PM me if you want further guarantee.
https://thekandcfoundation.com/donate/
I work just opposite and we were all emailed this earlier. PM me if you want further guarantee.
Last edited:
Lankyseagull
One Step Beyond
Yes. That just about sums it up.
The thing is that with a school, which I believe is classed as an 'assembly' building, you have a collection of rooms that exit onto a common corridor - there are generally no other rooms contained within a classroom. With a flat, you have a number of rooms with different functions which are arranged around a protected hallway within the flat (i.e. the walls and doors around the hall all perform to a minimum of 30 minutes fire resistance if the doors are closed), the main entrance door to the flat is required to be 60 minutes fire resistant. Effectively this means that a fire can be first contained within the room it breaks out in and then within the confines of the flat and this gives the occupants sufficient time to escape. Providing all doors are closed, the fire should be contained for at least 90 minutes allowing fire brigade to arrive and deal with the situation, including arranging evacuation of the whole building, without being impeded by dozens of people all moving in the opposite direction to them, hence the 'stay put' directive.
symyjym
Banned
It's the sort of disaster we expect to see in a poor third world country.