[Football] England's friendlies v Germany & Brazil.

Arthur · Nov 7, 2017

1066familyman said:
Yep. Gerrard was always the same too, and to some extent, Rooney.

Peter Shilton 125 caps
Wayne Rooney 119 caps
David Beckham 115 caps
Steven Gerrard 114 caps

Just to bring that into perspective Ryan Giggs won 64 caps for Wales yet played about 150 more league games than both Gerrard and Beckham and currently about 200 more than Rooney.

Easy 10 · Nov 7, 2017

Mellotron said:
You clearly haven't watched England for very long.

We will draw and win these games (playing quick, Prem style footy, you know, the exact way we SHOULD play, a la the Germany 3-2 last year), and someone will ask Rashford if we can win the World Cup. He will give a vaguely non-committal answer that will get printed on the back pages as a YES and massive pressure will be put on the 14-year-old (whatever) Rashford to take us all the way to the trophy next summer.

Then we will play Egypt or Iran in a group game and we will look like we have LITERALLY never been on a football pitch before.

Lets just see what results the England stiffs get against the Germans and Brazilians this time then. If you're convinced we're going to sweep them aside under the wise and watchful guidance of that drippy Palace fishlips, then you might want to get a cheeky double on at Billy Hills. You'd probably get about 12/1.

Kinky Gerbil · Nov 7, 2017

jamie the seagull said:
Wonder what would happen if Spurs had a game this weekend........

So Spurs risked dropping points against Palace and took Winks/Kane off and left Alli out?

LlcoolJ · Nov 7, 2017

Arthur said:
Peter Shilton 125 caps
Wayne Rooney 119 caps
David Beckham 115 caps
Steven Gerrard 114 caps

Just to bring that into perspective Ryan Giggs won 64 caps for Wales yet played about 150 more league games than both Gerrard and Beckham and currently about 200 more than Rooney.

Giggs was the ultimate culprit for always being "injured" for international games but then playing the next one for Man U.

Mellotron · Nov 7, 2017

Easy 10 said:
Lets just see what results the England stiffs get against the Germans and Brazilians this time then. If you're convinced we're going to sweep them aside under the wise and watchful guidance of that drippy Palace fishlips, then you might want to get a cheeky double on at Billy Hills. You'd probably get about 12/1.

I didn't say we'd sweep them aside - I didn't even say we'd win both! But we pretty much never get battered in friendlies. You'd have to go back quite a few years for much more than a 3-0 loss I reckon.

Easy 10 · Nov 7, 2017

Mellotron said:
I didn't say we'd sweep them aside - I didn't even say we'd win both! But we pretty much never get battered in friendlies. You'd have to go back quite a few years for much more than a 3-0 loss I reckon.

We pretty much never get battered full stop. For a 3 goal defeat I think you have to go back to the 2010 World Cup, when the Germans dry-humped us 4-1.

There was that Sweden friendly in 2012 that we lost 4-2. But that game was batshit mental, with Ibrahimovich scoring all 4 goals, including the greatest goal ever scored in the history of the world. When the team contained Steven Caulker, Ryan Shawcross, Leon Osman, Wilfried Zaha and Carl Jenkinson, I suppose we were asking for it.

Mellotron · Nov 7, 2017

Easy 10 said:
We pretty much never get battered full stop. For a 3 goal defeat I think you have to go back to the 2010 World Cup, when Germany dry-humped us 4-1.

There was that Sweden friendly in 2012 that we lost 4-2. But that game was batshit mental, with Ibrahimovich scoring all 4 goals, including the greatest goal ever scored in the history of the world. But then when the team contained Steven Caulker, Ryan Shawcross, Leon Osman, Wilfried Zaha and Carl Jenkinson, I suppose we were asking for it.

Also I don't think I'd realised quite how BARE BONES we were for this weekend. I'm far more excited about the WC playoffs anyway, those games are usually high drama crackers.

jamie the seagull · Nov 7, 2017

Kinky Gerbils said:
So Spurs risked dropping points against Palace and took Winks/Kane off and left Alli out?

Poch reckoned whatever side he chose would beat Palace...3rd choice keeper too...just got away with it...

Easy 10 · Nov 7, 2017

Mellotron said:
Also I don't think I'd realised quite how BARE BONES we were for this weekend. I'm far more excited about the WC playoffs anyway, those games are usually high drama crackers.

The World Cup playoffs are not usually all that entertaining are they ? The stakes are so high that both teams are usually just terrified of losing. I don't think any of the 4 ties look particularly appetising. Certainly the 1st legs I think will all be very tight. I'm looking forward to them, as they are inevitably dramatic just because of whats at stake, but I'm certainly not expecting any classics.

Scandanavian teams in particular are always pretty dour.

Easy 10 · Nov 7, 2017

jamie the seagull said:
Poch reckoned whatever side he chose would beat Palace...3rd choice keeper too...just got away with it...

Spurs were dead lucky, only Palace's chronic ineptitude and rampant incompetence in front of goal saved them. I hope they play the same against us.

MattBackHome · Nov 7, 2017

Easy 10 said:
The World Cup playoffs are not usually all that entertaining are they ? The stakes are so high that both teams are usually just terrified of losing. I don't think any of the 4 ties look particularly appetising. Certainly the 1st legs I think will all be very tight. I'm looking forward to them, as they are inevitably dramatic just because of whats at stake, but I'm certainly not expecting any classics.

Scandanavian teams in particular are always pretty dour.

There was that Ronaldo vs Ibrahimovic classic - where both of them decided that football was no longer a team game and just decided to go mano a mano with each other.

AmexRuislip · Nov 7, 2017

Haven't been to England play, since this little ditty

Mellotron · Nov 7, 2017

Easy 10 said:
The World Cup playoffs are not usually all that entertaining are they ? The stakes are so high that both teams are usually just terrified of losing. I don't think any of the 4 ties look particularly appetising. Certainly the 1st legs I think will all be very tight. I'm looking forward to them, as they are inevitably dramatic just because of whats at stake, but I'm certainly not expecting any classics.

Scandanavian teams in particular are always pretty dour.

I mean the last 10 minutes of course. I just love how high the stakes are. Also I very much enjoy how blood and thunder most of the Home Nations play, and I can cheer them on (bar Scotland obviously) without it affecting me whatsoever if they don't make it.

mejonaNO12 aka riskit · Nov 7, 2017

You get to a tournament, lose to a big team, and the fans say "it's because we have such easy qualifiers"

You then organise big friendlies against the best teams and people say "what's the point, we will lose".

Can't win.

Mellotron · Nov 7, 2017

MattBackHome said:
There was that Ronaldo vs Ibrahimovic classic - where both of them decided that football was no longer a team game and just decided to go mano a mano with each other.

That was phenomenal. Genuinely the most a football match has ever been like a boxing match. There were only 2 people on the pitch.

1066familyman · Nov 7, 2017

Arthur said:
Peter Shilton 125 caps
Wayne Rooney 119 caps
David Beckham 115 caps
Steven Gerrard 114 caps

Just to bring that into perspective Ryan Giggs won 64 caps for Wales yet played about 150 more league games than both Gerrard and Beckham and currently about 200 more than Rooney.

To be honest, I was working from my perception rather than stats. I'll hold my hands up if my perception is way off the mark.

Your Giggs stats are good and suggest I really am wide of the mark. But to confirm it, have you got any stats for % of friendlies Gerrard and Rooney played by any chance?

Remember Wales qualified for far far fewer tournaments than England in that time, so you'd expect Gerrard and Rooney to have more caps than Giggs, even if they still missed a shed load of friendlies.

Arthur · Nov 7, 2017

1066familyman said:
To be honest, I was working from my perception rather than stats. I'll hold my hands up if my perception is way off the mark.

Fair play.

1066familyman said:
Your Giggs stats are good and suggest I really am wide of the mark. But to confirm it, have you got any stats for % of friendlies Gerrard and Rooney played by any chance?

Rooney 45/119. Gerrard 44/114.

http://www.englandfootballonline.com/TeamPlyrsBios/PlayersR/BioRooneyW.html
http://www.englandfootballonline.com/TeamPlyrsBios/PlayersG/BioGerrardS.html

1066familyman said:
Remember Wales qualified for far far fewer tournaments than England in that time, so you'd expect Gerrard and Rooney to have more caps than Giggs, even if they still missed a shed load of friendlies.

Appreciate that but Giggs seemed to play for ever so the two would surely even each other out.

Wales are probably a better side now than they were when Giggs was playing but at least Bale seems interested in playing international football (he already has more caps than Giggs). You do have to wonder if that would have been the case if he'd played under Ferguson.

Herr Tubthumper · Nov 7, 2017

mejonaNO12 aka riskit said:
You get to a tournament, lose to a big team, and the fans say "it's because we have such easy qualifiers"

You then organise big friendlies against the best teams and people say "what's the point, we will lose".

Can't win.

From previous experience Germany and Brazil will both be in city-break mode. Unless Germany are contracted to I doubt they’ll even bother sending a strong team. There’s every chance England can win one of these games.

Pavilionaire · Nov 7, 2017

I've now got to the stage where I hate international friendlies, indeed I resent them.

The top players can't be bothered, and with the plethora of sport on TV who has time to watch stuff where there's nothing at stake?

If we beat a top nation in a friendly it only turns into a false dawn, while if we lose it just gets everybody down. It's strange because we seem to play Germany or Brazil annually but it feels like a non-event, whereas the rugby union autumn internationals against the Southern Hemisphere sides are also friendlies but I look forward to those so much more.

I think that's because the big players want to play in those matches and they are - in effect - the qualifying matches for the World Cup as far as the players are concerned.

1066familyman · Nov 7, 2017

Arthur said:
Fair play.

Rooney 45/119. Gerrard 44/114.

http://www.englandfootballonline.com/TeamPlyrsBios/PlayersR/BioRooneyW.html
http://www.englandfootballonline.com/TeamPlyrsBios/PlayersG/BioGerrardS.html

Appreciate that but Giggs seemed to play for ever so the two would surely even each other out.

Wales are probably a better side now than they were when Giggs was playing but at least Bale seems interested in playing international football (he already has more caps than Giggs). You do have to wonder if that would have been the case if he'd played under Ferguson.

Thanks. Fair few friendlies there for Gerrard and Rooney so I'll hold my hands up.

I agree with what you say about Giggs & Bale - the latter does appear to be more interested. I also think clubs sometimes might be more the culprit than the player, hence I put clubs in brackets in my initial post.

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[Football] England's friendlies v Germany & Brazil.

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