police dealing with incident on London bridge.,

PILTDOWN MAN · Jun 4, 2017

I'm fed up with watching the News with presenters, MP's and so on wearing black in mourning for innocent people.

May is right is time for change. The so called community leaders from the Islamic areas need to be taken to task. They defend their way of life but fail to defend ours. It's their people doing this. Time for the PC brigade to shut the f@@k up and let the right questions to be asked and by any means. As other posters have written, declare war on them thus adding powers to the authorities to deal with them.

Islam is a radical religion irrelevant of how moderate some followers are they are all still open to becoming extremists due to the ideology.

Enough is enough.

Tyrone Biggums · Jun 4, 2017

bn1&bn3 Albion said:
Oh but I thought you had to taught evil from birth? You never mentioned they could be mentally ill.. Like I said, extremist leaders target people who aren't all there mentally because they know they are easy to brainwash.

Maybe I need to word it again. When the start of your whole belief system begins with a person who was a brutal warlord in his actions and thoughts then nothing good can ever come of it.

The prophet Muhammad WAS an extremist.

I'd love for you to tell me how an ideology created by an extremist is not going to produce extremists far easier than ideologies from people with far more peaceful messages.

martin tyler · Jun 4, 2017

Bladders said:
Declaring war on Islamic State would be a start, then anyone affiliated with it can be treated as enemy combatants , spy's etc and fall under the rules and engagement of wartime . Easily removed from the streets and interned indefinitely, just like we did during wartime .

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Have to agree with this.
We have allowed this to go on to long. A number of years ago we allowed so called preachers to preach hatred on our streets to young impressionable isolated young Muslim men. Instead of nipping that in the butt society is to scared to tackle the issue and "freedom of speech" is used as a good excuse to allow it to continue. Concerns were raised that immigrants were not being checked properly all ignored. 12000 on a watched list and growing. Almost impossible job now to now keep an eye on all 12000 of them.
I do believe 99% of Muslims are peaceful but does anyone really know what is said behind closed doors. If we are ever to root this out it needs the Muslim community to assist. Inform pass information over to security councils. If anyone is likely to know what is happening it will be them. I can't believe for a minute that no one in the Muslim community was not aware of something last night. Likewise the same as Manchester. If they were why was something not said. Don't say we are peaceful yet turn a blind eye to terror.
Declare was on IS and remove the virus from the streets to stop it infecting more minds.
Enough of this bull shit of leave them to it don't be nasty to them, don't hate ect ect. That has got us no where. Time to take some positive action

PILTDOWN MAN · Jun 4, 2017

bn1&bn3 Albion said:
Oh but I thought you had to taught evil from birth? You never mentioned they could be mentally ill.. Like I said, extremist leaders target people who aren't all there mentally because they know they are easy to brainwash.

And doctors like the Glasgow Airport attack, yep sure he was ill, not.

Wellesley · Jun 4, 2017

Bladders said:
I genuinely couldnt give a **** now.

anyone who uses this as part of their argument has already lost imo.

This is the point. I want these extremists eradicated from our society. Not through racism, hate or being a bigot, but because of LOVE. Love of my children, my wife and my country and wanting to keep them safe. Things I would fight for to the death.

easynow · Jun 4, 2017

Seagulltonian said:
The embarrassing conversations that need to be had are the one's with the arms seller's, that equip both sides to have this ever perpetual war that cost's money and lives!
But, as we are the 2nd biggest arms exporter in the world, do you believe that's really going to happen?

These wars we have in Muslim countries, to supposedly protect the innocent civilians from "despot dictors" are all a front to rape the country for it's mineral and oil wealth, that the Western society still needs to survive in this consumer-driven planet that we now live on!
We have been trying to enforce our will on them for centuries and centuries, remember the Crusades! (Well I don't personally!)
And now they're fighting back to impose Islam on us!
I really can't see this ending well.and that's the sad part in these supposed "Enlightened" times

If you haven't read "1984" by George Orwell, I urge you to do so, to see where the "Elites" are trying to push us

Unfortunately that is the sad truth. All the collateral damage/deaths from those middle east wars just creates breeding grounds for radical terrorism in those countries.

bn1&bn3 Albion · Jun 4, 2017

Tyrone Biggums said:
Maybe I need to word it again. When the start of your whole belief system begins with a person who was a brutal warlord in his actions and thoughts then nothing good can ever come of it.

The prophet Muhammad WAS an extremist.

I'd love for you to tell me how an ideology created by an extremist is not going to produce extremists far easier than ideologies from people with far more peaceful messages.

Now that I can agree with.

Justice · Jun 4, 2017

Sussaxon said:
What an absolutely ridiculous statement to make!! Can I remind you that Beram Kayal is a Muslim. What the f**k has Beram done to deserve to be deported?!? This has f**k all to do with Beram and the vast majority of Muslims. Please take your 1930s comments elsewhere!

Indeed, my teenage daughter's best friend is Muslim she often come's on our family outings a kind caring young girl. She is as horrified by the attacks as anyone else. To see a teenage girl who has lived here her whole life now terrified of being victimised is heart breaking. Some should think before they speak.

Leighgull · Jun 4, 2017

Seagulltonian said:
The embarrassing conversations that need to be had are the one's with the arms seller's, that equip both sides to have this ever perpetual war that cost's money and lives!
But, as we are the 2nd biggest arms exporter in the world, do you believe that's really going to happen?

These wars we have in Muslim countries, to supposedly protect the innocent civilians from "despot dictors" are all a front to rape the country for it's mineral and oil wealth, that the Western society still needs to survive in this consumer-driven planet that we now live on!
We have been trying to enforce our will on them for centuries and centuries, remember the Crusades! (Well I don't personally!)
And now they're fighting back to impose Islam on us!
I really can't see this ending well.and that's the sad part in these supposed "Enlightened" times

If you haven't read "1984" by George Orwell, I urge you to do so, to see where the "Elites" are trying to push us

You clearly don't understand the issue here.

Consider this statement from Al Baghdadi the Islamic state "caliph" in January of this year.

"You infidels will blame your foreign policy for the fact that we hate you. Your foreign policy is not our fundamental issue. We hate you despite of your military attacks. We hate you for what you are. We hate you for your lack of modesty, we hate you for your secularism, we hate you for your democracy and refusal to bend to the will of Allah. Even if you withdrew your armies from our lands we would hate you still."

How can you fail to see the problem here is one of cultural dissonance? Islam is the problem and liberal apologists have convinced millions in the west that the truth is s something other than it is.

crookie · Jun 4, 2017

It was fortunate that they chose to make their attack in a city and area that is saturated with armed police and anti-terrorist officers. If an act happened somewhere like Tunbridge Wells where I live, or Crowborough where i was brought up, or indeed any small/medium sized town around the country, how long would it take the emergency services and armed police to respond in such numbers. Hours I should think. Imagine the slaughter that could happen in the meantime. Frightening. I guess they do it in London because it's high profile, but thousands of softer undefended targets about.

Gary1 · Jun 4, 2017

Brighton4Cambridge3 said:
I've been critical of May - but she smashed that statement.

Action needs to be stronger than words. Will it be action or is it all talk - saying what people want to hear. Do they know what to do or how to actually stop this happening or are the politicians trotting out soundbites. Time will tell.

cheshunt seagull · Jun 4, 2017

Leighgull said:
You clearly don't understand the issue here.

Consider this statement from Al Baghdadi the Islamic state "caliph" in January of this year.

"You infidels will blame your foreign policy for the fact that we hate you. Your foreign policy is not our fundamental issue. We hate you despite of your military attacks. We hate you for what you are. We hate you for your lack of modesty, we hate you for your secularism, we hate you for your democracy and refusal to bend to the will of Allah. Even if you withdrew your armies from our lands we would hate you still."

How can you fail to see the problem here is one of cultural dissonance? Islam is the problem and liberal apologists have convinced millions in the west that the truth is s something other than it is.

I agree that it is clear that the sole motivation of ISIS is the creation of a Caliphate and that they will pursue this regardless of any action we take. I also agree that many in the West need to be a lot more honest about the obvious role that a version (not neccessarily a distortion) of Islam is playing in this. However although the ISIS leaders will have no interest in children dying in bombing raids, drone strikes etc they will see them as a very useful recruitment tool and the power vacuums left by Western action provide the ideal conditions for them to grow their power base. Any response has to take into account both aspects of this and not be prepared to address some cultural dissonance issues as you put it but nether dismiss the consequences of our actions..

There is a lot of talk on here about liberal lefties etc. being in denial about the nature of Islam and its role in this. I don't think I am and I would welcome a more open debate but I have no interest in seeing it turned into a simplistic attack on all Muslims, which is where this often leads and this always puts me off.

Gazwag · Jun 4, 2017

Mackenzie said:
8 minutes from starting the attack to being shot.....bravo the police. Bravo.

Shame they will probably now be stopped from working until an investigation takes place and they have to justify their actions.

sjamesb3466 · Jun 4, 2017

Getting rid of religious schools would be a start. How in this day and age we still have schools that teach religion over science and segregate our communities further is a crime. Unfortunately the present system of free schools is only making this worse and anyone can set up a religious school with very little oversight that can brainwash kids from a young age.

crookie · Jun 4, 2017

sjamesb3466 said:
Getting rid of religious schools would be a start. How in this day and age we still have schools that teach religion over science and segregate our communities further is a crime. Unfortunately the present system of free schools is only making this worse and anyone can set up a religious school with very little oversight that can brainwash kids from a young age.

Yes totally agree. Hardly the sign of a modern progressive inclusive society when education is based on imaginary friends that there is no scientific evidence for. A massive step backwards.

Icy Gull · Jun 4, 2017

At least the police shot the perpetrators dead, rather than trying to arrest them, move in the right direction imo.

crookie · Jun 4, 2017

Icy Gull said:
At least the police shot the perpetrators dead, rather than trying to arrest them, move in the right direction imo.

On the contrary, initial reports were that one had survived, would have been good to prosecute through the legal system and leave them to rot in jail for the rest of their lives. They want martyrdom and the 80 virgins in paradise. Give them 50 years in a maximum security jail to reflect on the joys of their ideology

e77 · Jun 4, 2017

crookie said:
I can guarantee that 100% of Christians, Sikhs, Hindus, Jews, Buddhists etc will be appalled by these attacks. Even if 99% of Muslims are appalled, that still leaves approximately 28000 who aren't. A real 5th column that need ruthlessly to be weeded out. Not an easy task.

Then deal with that small percentage and not an entire religion.

Would you have thrown all Irish people out of the mainland UK during the troubles?

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cheshunt seagull · Jun 4, 2017

sjamesb3466 said:
Getting rid of religious schools would be a start. How in this day and age we still have schools that teach religion over science and segregate our communities further is a crime. Unfortunately the present system of free schools is only making this worse and anyone can set up a religious school with very little oversight that can brainwash kids from a young age.

Agreed. I have no problem at all with any adult choosing to believe the most irrational nonsense but they can't be free to do so if they have been brainwashed from birth.

e77 · Jun 4, 2017

GT49er said:
But that's the trouble. No lies or anything, but we don't actually know this, do we. Some - like yourself - choose to believe it, and obviously many claim this is the case.........but, the truth is, we don't know.
During the Irish troubles, how many Irish Catholics, who never committed any acts of violence, and who never joined the IRA, would, when pushed condemn 'All violence' (although never condemning specific murders by the IRA or the provos) still actually shared the ultimate ambitions of the terrorists, namely a united independent (and Catholic) Ireland?
So how many of the moderate moslems, appalled by tonight's atrocities, nonetheless share the ultimate ambitions of the cvnts who do these things? - replacement of UK law by Sharia law, Britain becoming a moslem country, with Christianity not allowed (and for all those who jump up and say we're not a Christian country nowadays anyway, yes, you have a point, but in the moslem world atheism and agnosticism don't go down too well either!)

Sorry but there is a huge amount of what ifs in there. The Muslim organisations are usually the first to condemn these things.

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