Tony Meolas Loan Spell
Slut Faced Whores
Spot on. Was it a case of Sami accepting the job knowing we had a man with a champ manager database or was he sold a dud "oh no you cant have him he isnt on our spreadsheet"
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At what stage does Bloom question the recruitment set up?
- Thread starter Giraffe
- Start date
Spot on. Was it a case of Sami accepting the job knowing we had a man with a champ manager database or was he sold a dud "oh no you cant have him he isnt on our spreadsheet"
GT49er
Well-known member
He certainly should be questioning should he ditch it! This is based on judging its performance on September 1st, as repeatedly requested (and reviewed in mid November).
Some bits from a Steve Parish interview I read over the last week that suddenly seem pertinent and worth sharing. Some have been using Crystal Palace as a good example, I believe...
Parish, a youthful 45-year-old divorced father of two, says: “The most important thing in football is the ability to say ‘no’. When it comes to managers wanting players, it’s not said often enough.
“It isn’t acceptable for anyone to spend money on a whim. There is a new professionalism, a new diligence in clubs like Southampton and Swansea where the structure doesn’t fall apart when a manager leaves.
“We don’t say no gratuitously, we just say no to stupid ideas. I can bring in a manager who signs Carlos Fandango and for three days everyone is saying what a brilliant move it’s been. Then it all falls apart and who’s the idiot for allowing it to happen? Me.
“There was not a manager who came to Crystal Palace who didn’t know the budget. I bought 16 players for £20m for Ian, breaking the transfer record three times. Tony got all the players he wanted in the January transfer window but we missed out on a couple in the summer.
“If the Smalling and Fletcher thing did happen, it shows that at least we had a go. Tony and I never had a cross word about transfers and there was money available. Of course it surprised me he went — he was only seven months into a three-year contract. But you can’t keep someone who doesn’t want to be there.
“Tony’s a nice guy, very hard-working and he did great things for the club. But the way people like me see where football is heading with directors of football and different ways of doing things might not have been his thing. That doesn’t mean I believe we should take player recruitment out of the manager’s hands. He should still be a large part of the process. But if you fixate on buying a player, you overpay.
“I want players like the ones we have, old-fashioned ones in a way who really care about the club. I have to run Palace prudently. Sadly you cannot always do that but we are still far more prudent than most."
.....and a final bit....
“At the training ground we probably have a dozen people on the sports science side alone, 170 boys in the Academy and umpteen coaches. We have to decide just how we are going to play all the way from the Academy to the senior side and how are we going to find the managers who fit the way we want to play.
“Then there’s the new training ground we want to buy and who goes where and in what space, how does it work, all the recruitment here and overseas."
Parish, a youthful 45-year-old divorced father of two, says: “The most important thing in football is the ability to say ‘no’. When it comes to managers wanting players, it’s not said often enough.
“It isn’t acceptable for anyone to spend money on a whim. There is a new professionalism, a new diligence in clubs like Southampton and Swansea where the structure doesn’t fall apart when a manager leaves.
“We don’t say no gratuitously, we just say no to stupid ideas. I can bring in a manager who signs Carlos Fandango and for three days everyone is saying what a brilliant move it’s been. Then it all falls apart and who’s the idiot for allowing it to happen? Me.
“There was not a manager who came to Crystal Palace who didn’t know the budget. I bought 16 players for £20m for Ian, breaking the transfer record three times. Tony got all the players he wanted in the January transfer window but we missed out on a couple in the summer.
“If the Smalling and Fletcher thing did happen, it shows that at least we had a go. Tony and I never had a cross word about transfers and there was money available. Of course it surprised me he went — he was only seven months into a three-year contract. But you can’t keep someone who doesn’t want to be there.
“Tony’s a nice guy, very hard-working and he did great things for the club. But the way people like me see where football is heading with directors of football and different ways of doing things might not have been his thing. That doesn’t mean I believe we should take player recruitment out of the manager’s hands. He should still be a large part of the process. But if you fixate on buying a player, you overpay.
“I want players like the ones we have, old-fashioned ones in a way who really care about the club. I have to run Palace prudently. Sadly you cannot always do that but we are still far more prudent than most."
.....and a final bit....
“At the training ground we probably have a dozen people on the sports science side alone, 170 boys in the Academy and umpteen coaches. We have to decide just how we are going to play all the way from the Academy to the senior side and how are we going to find the managers who fit the way we want to play.
“Then there’s the new training ground we want to buy and who goes where and in what space, how does it work, all the recruitment here and overseas."
GT49er
Well-known member
I don't know if we do know; it seems to be TB, or PB, or DB or SH - depending on who the poster wants to blame at any given time. That's a lot of people who may or may not be involved / have the final say.
Two clichés spring to mind: "A camel is a horse designed by a committee", and "Too many cooks........"
- Jun 27, 2012
- 13,911
All clubs of our size now have this system, and there's little evidence to suggest as [MENTION=1416]Ernest[/MENTION] does that English managers refuse to work under it as these three quick examples prove.
Whats not working well at Forest ? Having an English manager, his tactics/coaching ?, A Head of Recruitment ? or the players they signed this summer ?.
Ernest
Stupid IDIOT
Seeing the Bloom, BERK and co were PURRING on August 30th about the QUALITY of the new signings I can only guess (sorry) that the manager/head coach is not good enough to work with them or develop a system and tactics that brings out the best in such quality signings
westsussexseagulls
New member
- Sep 22, 2008
- 319
Criticism and questions asked are perfectly natural consider we have been in the play offs 2 seasons running and now dangerously looking at the relegation zone. I noticed from Paul Barber's programme notes on saturday regarding FFP and there was a line where he mentioned 'if we are playing in either the championship or premiership'! so as to suggest relegation is not even a serious thought, judging by recent performances I this is dangerously complacent. The Fans have every right to question decisions at the moment.
Still a bit odd that we went through with it given:
a) his disinterest in transfer dealings
b) he wanted to leave anyway
Absolutely and I agree with every word.
(I meant almost everything I write seems to be criticised as defending the club currently)
London Irish
Well-known member
Bloom must have personally sanctioned paying the ridiculous figure of £2m for Baldock - plenty of blame to go round
RE Toko, I am pretty sure having played 143 games for Grasshoppers first team he would have been expecting to play for the first team or be on the bench at least. I dont remember it being said he was development squad. However as he was bought before the new manager was here, it appears Sami doesnt like him. How JFC is keeping Holla out of the team is another mystery. Colonga, 2 goals in a year another peice of quality work from Burke and co. It seems that our recruitment policy both managers and players is in a complete mess. The football we played in the first two years at the amex bares no comparison to what i have seen this season. Its so clear to see that in terms of quality of players the club has gone backwards. Its sad to see. I am sure Bloom can see it too, the real question is now does he have the cash and the desire to change it? This is not a dig in the slightest against the man who has invested somewhere in the region of £200,000,000. This is an expensive hobby. That dark night in may two years ago really haunts me...
GT49er
Well-known member
I do wonder if they all have the same balance of power between the manager and the head of recruitment. It all gets a bit fuzzy and management speak really - is the Head of Recruitment the equivalent of a Director of Football, or a bigged up Chief Scout? I suspect both models are in use - same 'Head of Recruitment' post, but quite a difference in roles and responsibilities.
As to it not working well at Forest, well something is not going well there, that is undeniable. Same as here really - which is why TB should, IMHO, be looking at that part of the set-up very closely (and as has been pointed out on here before, he's no mug, so he may already be doing so).
GT49er
Well-known member
That dark night in May two years ago really haunts me...
It still haunts the club - and may continue to do so for some time.
Brighton TID
New member
I have to say that the manager is to blame for our failure. A good manager will use his craft to identify the key attributes of a squad and play to its strengths. Not play players in a fixed system which does not bring the best out of them.
For instance, we should be using our best and most creative player (Paddy) in a number 10 role behind Baldock or CMS in a 4-4-1-1 formation. Paddy should be our play maker. Build the team around him and we will win games. Currently, we have our best player on the bench and there is only one person who makes this decision.
For instance, we should be using our best and most creative player (Paddy) in a number 10 role behind Baldock or CMS in a 4-4-1-1 formation. Paddy should be our play maker. Build the team around him and we will win games. Currently, we have our best player on the bench and there is only one person who makes this decision.
But all of Paddy McC's managers have used him from the bench, so it's not just SH that has chosen to use him in that way.
GT49er
Well-known member
I can imagine the phone calls........
"Hi Sascha / Sammy - Sami Hyypia here, how are you doing?"
"Fine Sami mate, how's yourself?"
"Great. I've just been appointed manager at Brighton. We've got a fabulous new stadium, and a brilliant mantra of 'Premier League Ready' "
"Sounds great man - what's the playing side like? Any good players? Any ideas who you are going to get in?"
"No idea - the club employs a bloke called Burke to do all that stuff. Do you want to be my assistant?"
"No!"
Spot on. There was an entire thread around Toko at the time he signed. Not one person suggested he was a dev squad signing including those ITK. To be fair to both Bozza and the club there were plenty of replies to the Palace fans laughing at us signing a player when we had no manager stating that the negotiations with Grasshoppers and the player had started before Oscar left. So he's technically an Oscar player but not intended for the dev squad in a million years.
As for the stats they can be twisted any way that you want. However the strength of our permanent signings can best be gathered by forming a starting XI in your head made up only of players NOT on loan. So you would need to drop both Bennetts, Al-Habsi, Gardner, Teixeira and Halford. I'd suggest that would be even less competitive than we currently are however you sliced and diced it.
Blue Valkyrie
Not seen such Bravery!
The transfer dealings at Forest can't really be criticised too much. In fact they displayed genius in the transfer window, by selling 2 players to Newcastle for millions, and getting them loaned back for the season with Newcastle paying 100% of the wages.
We'd have been pretty pleased if we'd got that type of deal for Ulloa.
Same as last year if you took out Ward, Lingard and Andrews? The season before with Upson, Bridge and Hammond?
Long-term loans have been a feature of our first XIs for a while now.