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[Politics] Tonight,s EU vote and the margin of defeat ?





DFL JCL

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2016
790
Has anyone agreed what would happen if a second referendum produced the same scores on the doors? EU playing hardball and all that?


Someone would be praying a remain win, just for an easy way out.

That would need to be factored into whatever the question put to the people would be. I imagine it would be a 2 part question along the lines of 1) Leave or Remain 2) If we are to Leave would you prefer (a) May's Deal (b) No deal.
 


Is it PotG?

Thrifty non-licker
Feb 20, 2017
23,102
Sussex by the Sea
That would need to be factored into whatever the question put to the people would be. I imagine it would be a 2 part question along the lines of 1) Leave or Remain 2) If we are to Leave would you prefer (a) May's Deal (b) No deal.

It should be like a 2 leg Euro fixture, the result of the first referendum being carried over.
 


Bold Seagull

strong and stable with me, or...
Mar 18, 2010
29,719
Hove
None of them can be trusted to deliver what we voted for. It's a disgrace, and everyone is now bored to hell with it.

Why is it a disgrace? What did you vote for, no deal, hard or soft brexit? Should the government have gone the soft route to ensure a Parliamentary majority to bring the remain leaning MPs on board?
 








Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
49,989
Goldstone
If she is (like parliament seemingly are) dead set against no deal. And a compromise can't be agreed with both parliament/the EU. I fail to see what other options she will have other than a second referendum or quittng.
I'm also struggling to see the alternatives. She might just play brinkmanship with house and repeat the vote again, leaving it so late that there's the threat of 'no deal' is she loses. But I don't believe the MPs will fall for it. She'd lose the vote again, and then she'll be faced with no deal or come up with an alternative, and surely at that point she'll have to come up with an alternative (referendum or election).
 


DFL JCL

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2016
790
I'm also struggling to see the alternatives. She might just play brinkmanship with house and repeat the vote again, leaving it so late that there's the threat of 'no deal' is she loses. But I don't believe the MPs will fall for it. She'd lose the vote again, and then she'll be faced with no deal or come up with an alternative, and surely at that point she'll have to come up with an alternative (referendum or election).

I think half her cabinet will walk if she maintains the threat of NoDeal.
 




Simster

"the man's an arse"
Jul 7, 2003
54,110
Surrey
Shambolic ruling only matched by the opposition - a party also at odds on Europe internally, with a pro-Brexit leader who's pretending not to be for the time being. If we get rid of our current crap party for decades you'll see just how far Britain can fall.
None of that has any basis in fact, it's all supposition because you don't like Labour. Meanwhile, we've had 10 years of evidence that this conservative government have been absolutely DIRE.
 


Sussex Nomad

Well-known member
Aug 26, 2010
18,185
EP
None of that has any basis in fact, it's all supposition because you don't like Labour. Meanwhile, we've had 10 years of evidence that this conservative government have been absolutely DIRE.

Well that's enlightening if it's all supposition. So two years down the line since the referendum and no-one is any better off about where Labour stand on this. Tells me all I need to know about the Brexit/Labour opposition.
 


hans kraay fan club

The voice of reason.
Helpful Moderator
Mar 16, 2005
61,094
Chandlers Ford
None of them can be trusted to deliver what we voted for. It's a disgrace.

"Is that Dominos? I demand to speak to the manager. I rang and ordered 'a big pizza'. Why have you sent me a thin and crispy, when I prefer deep pan? And where the **** are my anchovies?"
 




Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
49,989
Goldstone
None of that has any basis in fact
No, it is a fact that Corbyn is anti-EU, and against his party on the issue.
it's all supposition because you don't like Labour. Meanwhile, we've had 10 years of evidence that this conservative government have been absolutely DIRE.
The main problems we have now are due to the fact that our MPs are against the result of the referendum. You just blame everything on the Tories because you don't like them.
 


Iggle Piggle

Well-known member
Sep 3, 2010
5,281
A few points in no particular order

1. Conservatives are ‘Brexit means Brexit’ and the Labour party have an issue in that most of their MPS constituencies voted leave so are reluctant to bet the house on Remain. A 3rd party containing the centre can’t be far off, A Labour MP has already said today that they’ve given up trying to steer the ship implying they will abandon it. Then again, if this was such a popular option, why have the Lib dems – the only party who are categorically pro remain – got next to no voters in all the polls? The numbers don't add up
2. Anyone wheeled out for Labour looks like they are fresh out of uni. The lack of experience and talent on both sides is frightening. The Neill interviews last night were compulsive watching for the cluelessness on all sides. I’ve heard better excuses from my 10 year old about why he has forgotten his homework again.
3. Another referendum creates as many issues at is solves. Suppose Leave wins again? Then what? Best of 5? If remain wins, the fervent leave voters will then kick off. The die is cast and the split is there whichever route we go down. Cameron bet the house and lost. There is no going back.
4. Corbyn is no strategist. What does he expect the no confidence vote to achieve? He is exposing as many Labour divisions as Tory ones and has about a 5% chance of working.

What an absolute cluster.
 


CHAPPERS

DISCO SPENG
Jul 5, 2003
44,757
No, it is a fact that Corbyn is anti-EU, and against his party on the issue.
The main problems we have now are due to the fact that our MPs are against the result of the referendum. You just blame everything on the Tories because you don't like them.

It's a bit disingenuous to say that are against the result of the referendum. They are against the deal that has been negotiated and also against letting us leave without a deal because of the consequences.

And it's easy to blame the Tories here considering they are in government.
 




Simster

"the man's an arse"
Jul 7, 2003
54,110
Surrey
No, it is a fact that Corbyn is anti-EU, and against his party on the issue.
On balance, I agree with this.

The main problems we have now are due to the fact that our MPs are against the result of the referendum.[/QUOTE]This needn't be the major problem you are making out. I maintain that our MPs would vote for a Brexit deal if it was even half-way decent as to be considered in the nation's interest. Clearly, it isn't in their view, and it's not as if you didn't have the chance to vote for an MP who was an advocate of a no-deal Brexit - after all we had a GE shortly after the referendum.

You just blame everything on the Tories because you don't like them.
Complete drivel, and you're only saying it because that's how I responded to your assertion that Labour were somehow worse than this dreadful government. I blame the Tories because, er, they're in government. To clarify, we've had proof of Tory incompetence for several years now whereas Labour haven't been in power for years. So you saying Labour are worse is mere supposition, whereas I just cannot believe ANY government could be any worse than this one. They're useless.
 


Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
49,989
Goldstone
It's a bit disingenuous to say that are against the result of the referendum.
It isn't, the MPs simply don't want us to leave.
They are against the deal that has been negotiated and also against letting us leave without a deal because of the consequences.
Yes I know, but then none of them can get us a better deal, so it's the same thing.

And it's easy to blame the Tories here considering they are in government.
Sure, but you're kidding yourselves if you think this would be better under Labour.

This needn't be the major problem you are making out. I maintain that our MPs would vote for a Brexit deal if it was even half-way decent as to be considered in the nation's interest.
Sure, but no one is capable of agreeing a deal which is decent and in the nation's interest, which is one of the main arguments of the remainers.
Clearly, it isn't in their view, and it's not as if you didn't have the chance to vote for an MP who was an advocate of a no-deal Brexit - after all we had a GE shortly after the referendum.
Eh? It doesn't matter what choices of MP I was given, the fact is that the current group of MPs were elected and they're mostly anti-Brexit.

Complete drivel, and you're only saying it because that's how I responded to your assertion that Labour were somehow worse than this dreadful government. I blame the Tories because, er, they're in government. To clarify, we've had proof of Tory incompetence for several years now whereas Labour haven't been in power for years. So you saying Labour are worse is mere supposition, whereas I just cannot believe ANY government could be any worse than this one. They're useless.
And you suggesting Labour would be better is also supposition. When did you last vote Tory?
 




Chicken Run

Member Since Jul 2003
NSC Patreon
Jul 17, 2003
18,278
Valley of Hangleton
Only a died in the wool Tory would consider that they could be any worse than the incompetent tossers we currently have "running" the country. I'm not saying this lightly, but I honestly believe a cabinet made up of Corbyn, O'Donnell and Abbot would do no worse than May, Gove and Grayling - and they wouldn't be so arrogant in office as to treat the opposition with complete contempt until it's too late either.

If only I could have shown you the above when you started the Anti Corbyn thread [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23] The U turn kid [emoji106]
 




Simster

"the man's an arse"
Jul 7, 2003
54,110
Surrey
Eh? It doesn't matter what choices of MP I was given, the fact is that the current group of MPs were elected and they're mostly anti-Brexit.
That's right, they were elected. Had their positions on Brexit been considered an issue by the electorate, they wouldn't have voted for them.

And you suggesting Labour would be better is also supposition. When did you last vote Tory?
I didn't suggest Labour, I said they wouldn't do any worse. Or more accurately I'm taking issue with anyone who, when the Tories are accused of incompetence or worse, says "yeah but Labour would be worse" because I doubt that somehow seeing as this is probably the worst government I can remember. As for my voting, you're right - I've never voted Tory but would vote for Ken Clarke at a stroke. I even used to live a mile from his constituency as a student and would have done the same then if the boundaries had taken me in. Furthermore, I've only voted Labour once or twice (in the 90s, pre-Iraq).
 


Simster

"the man's an arse"
Jul 7, 2003
54,110
Surrey
If only I could have shown you the above when you started the Anti Corbyn thread [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23] The U turn kid [emoji106]
:lolol:

I wouldn't vote for Corbyn, he's a dreadful choice of leader. I believe Labour will only ever be elected if they can unite the left of centre vote pragmatically. But to repeat myself, I don't think he'd actually be any worse than the current clueless incumbents. The high taxation I could live with for 5 years if it meant we retained access to the single market.
 



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