Gus Poyet...

Easy 10 · Oct 20, 2015

alfredmizen said:
Whatever you think about poyet the manager , poyet the person is a tosser , this is the man who left Chelsea for Spurs (on a par with Murray for palace if you're a Chelsea fan) and kissed the Tottenham badge in front of our fans when they scored against us.

And ?

I don't care if he pulls the wings off flies, forgets his mums birthday and throws bagged-up kittens into rivers. As long as he could get the team I follow to play good soccerball and win lots of games, frankly that's all I was bothered about.

mejonaNO12 aka riskit · Oct 20, 2015

Easy 10 said:
Anyway, I see the usual revisionists are out in force again on a Gus thread, rewriting history because they can't get over the sour ending. We were fantastic under Poyet, it was three and a half years where the club progressed and grew out of all recognition from the pitiful level it had sank to. A new stadium on the horizon and TB's backing never guaranteed that would happen - certainly not at the rate it did. Gus got it right, brilliantly right on the pitch for us. His infectious enthusiasm, belief and charisma helped land us some truly memorable players, and the spine of the squad he built stood us in good stead long after he'd gone.

Yes his ego eventually took over, but he still gave me some of the best years (and games) I've ever had as a supporter of this club. Calling our promotion "unexciting" and bemoaning a style of play that swept us from the arse-end of L1 to the brink of the PL is the sourest, sourest of grapes. He's one of the best managers we've ever had, probably THE best bar Mullery. Deal with it.

It's funny, isn't it.

Imagine looking from the outside. Currently Oldham are struggling in league One.

If someone took over Oldham, got them safe this season. Then got them STORMING league one ALL season and promoted (playing a passing brand of football), then got them settled in the Championship and then got them the playoffs - We would think their fans were MAD for not recognising that was pretty damn good.

alfredmizen · Oct 20, 2015

Easy 10 said:
And ?

I don't care if he pulls the wings off flies, forgets his mums birthday and throws bagged-up kittens into rivers. As long as he could get the team I follow to play good soccerball and win lots of games, frankly that's all I was bothered about.

and the sort of person he is will have a bearing on the sort of manager he is , I.E showing a lack of respect for the club at a crucial time such as a premier league play off semi final and the subsequent fall out from that .

8ace · Oct 20, 2015

alfredmizen said:
Irish !

I think you'll find he's a TRIED and TESTED ENGLISH manager :thumbsup:

Man of Harveys · Oct 20, 2015

Easy 10 said:
Yes his ego eventually took over.

Rather than that, I'd say that Poyet was also forced to start having to deal every day with a newly appointed prickly megalomaniac equally fond of the limelight and with whom he'd also had previous.

Easy 10 · Oct 20, 2015

mejonaNO12 aka riskit said:
It's funny, isn't it.

Imagine looking from the outside. Currently Oldham are struggling in league One.

If someone took over Oldham, got them safe this season. Then got them STORMING league one ALL season and promoted (playing a passing brand of football), then got them settled in the Championship and then got them the playoffs - We would think their fans were MAD for not recognising that was pretty damn good.

I do find it amazing.

Once he'd binned Salde, if Bloom had then made the wrong appointment, then who's to say WHERE we would've been in the League by the time we moved in at the Amex. We might have been scuffling in L2. There was certainly every chance we could still have been a L1 club. Instead Bloom got it SPECTACULARLY right in bringing in Gus, and the rest is history.

It ended in disappointment, bitterness and recriminations, but none of that should detract from where he took us from, to where it finished.

Easy 10 · Oct 20, 2015

alfredmizen said:
and the sort of person he is will have a bearing on the sort of manager he is , I.E showing a lack of respect for the club at a crucial time such as a premier league play off semi final and the subsequent fall out from that .

Which apparently completely erases all other achievements prior to that evening. Apparently.

Easy 10 · Oct 20, 2015

[edit] duplicated

SweatyMexican · Oct 20, 2015

Easy 10 said:
How can you be surprised? Leeds is a complete CIRCUS of a club now.

Ah, I didn't think of that.

Easy 10 said:
Anyway, I see the usual revisionists are out in force again on a Gus thread, rewriting history because they can't get over the sour ending. We were fantastic under Poyet, it was three and a half years where the club progressed and grew out of all recognition from the pitiful level it had sank to. A new stadium on the horizon and TB's backing never guaranteed that would happen - certainly not at the rate it did. Gus got it right, brilliantly right on the pitch for us. His infectious enthusiasm, belief and charisma helped land us some truly memorable players, and the spine of the squad he built stood us in good stead long after he'd gone.

Yes his ego eventually took over, but he still gave me some of the best years (and games) I've ever had as a supporter of this club. Calling our promotion "unexciting" and bemoaning a style of play that swept us from the arse-end of L1 to the brink of the PL is the sourest, sourest of grapes. He's one of the best managers we've ever had, probably THE best bar Mullery. Deal with it.

You have me wrong. I loved Gus, and I wished him well when he left. And like you, I had some of the best years I've ever had as a supporter. I gave a fair statement about Gus' love of Leeds, and that doesn't give away any opinion of dislike for him on my part.

Perry Milkins · Oct 20, 2015

Easy 10 said:
And ?

I don't care if he pulls the wings off flies, forgets his mums birthday and throws bagged-up kittens into rivers. As long as he could get the team I follow to play good soccerball and win lots of games, frankly that's all I was bothered about.

Says the guy who wanted to plot to throw sticky syrupy cakes at Steve Coppell..

Bwian · Oct 20, 2015

mejonaNO12 aka riskit said:
It's funny, isn't it.

Imagine looking from the outside. Currently Oldham are struggling in league One.

If someone took over Oldham, got them safe this season. Then got them STORMING league one ALL season and promoted (playing a passing brand of football), then got them settled in the Championship and then got them the playoffs - We would think their fans were MAD for not recognising that was pretty damn good.

Your Gus Goggles are filtering out a few key ingredients that had as much impact on how the Albion progressed during that period. Of course Poyet did a good job before he started listening to his ego but other things were happening too.

I wonder how things would have progressed without the momentum of the new stadium and the massive season ticket sales? Those 2 factors alone made the club attractive to players. Poyet had one of the best jobs in football during that period of time but he was too stupid to see that. He was not solely responsible for the club's upward trajectory-he was right at the heart of things but others could have done just as well.

We saw some great games under Poyet, saw some dire shite too. Everything changed after he wasn't allowed to join Reading and for me that sours all of the good he did. THE single most important period for The Albion, the club who gave him, an inexperienced manager, one of the best jobs outside of the top 6 PL clubs, and just when we needed everything working together he was wanting to join another club. He should have finished the job he started then he would have been much closer to his dream job(s), we would be in our 3rd(?) season in the PL and talking about Poyet the hero. As it is now, he is just another ex-Albion manager, nothing special.

Easy 10 · Oct 20, 2015

SweatyMexican said:
You have me wrong. I loved Gus, and I wished him well when he left. And like you, I had some of the best years I've ever had as a supporter. I gave a fair statement about Gus' love of Leeds, and that doesn't give away any opinion of dislike for him on my part.

Sorry, the "deal with it" signoff wasn't directed at you at all, just at the usual revisionists on this thread.

Bwian · Oct 20, 2015

Easy 10 said:
I do find it amazing.

Once he'd binned Salde, if Bloom had then made the wrong appointment, then who's to say WHERE we would've been in the League by the time we moved in at the Amex. We might have been scuffling in L2. There was certainly every chance we could still have been a L1 club. Instead Bloom got it SPECTACULARLY right in bringing in Gus, and the rest is history.

It ended in disappointment, bitterness and recriminations, but none of that should detract from where he took us from, to where it finished.

Take your Gus Goggles off for a minute.

Poyet was one part of the whole that was The Albion at that time. Everything came together in exactly the right order and it all worked perfectly to get us to within touching distance of the PL and of course Poyet had a major part in all of that. Bloom had given the keys to his £100,000,000+ project to a man in his first managerial role and backed him accordingly. It was all moving along perfectly, both learning as they went about their business. We will probably never know the whole story but clearly something changed the dynamic of the club and the rest, as they say, is history. Palace got the Star Prize, we got FFP compliance.

Easy 10 · Oct 20, 2015

Blind Pugh said:
Says the guy who wanted to plot to throw sticky syrupy cakes at Steve Coppell..

Christ that's going back a bit. I have vague memories of that conversation, but absolutely no idea how it came about!

mejonaNO12 aka riskit · Oct 20, 2015

Bwian said:
Take your Gus Goggles off for a minute.

Poyet was one part of the whole that was The Albion at that time. Everything came together in exactly the right order and it all worked perfectly to get us to within touching distance of the PL and of course Poyet had a major part in all of that..

Seems odd to say anyone who thinks Gus was a good manager has "gus goggles" on.............and then to follow it up with comments which are CLEARLY praising Gus for the job he did (which is what we are doing).

It seems those who are anti Gus often start their logic with "yes we were good under him...and we got promoted...but...."

Whereas those who recognise him as a positive era at the club stop at the word "but".

Easy 10 · Oct 20, 2015

Bwian said:
Your Gus Goggles are filtering out a few key ingredients that had as much impact on how the Albion progressed during that period. Of course Poyet did a good job before he started listening to his ego but other things were happening too.

I wonder how things would have progressed without the momentum of the new stadium and the massive season ticket sales? Those 2 factors alone made the club attractive to players. Poyet had one of the best jobs in football during that period of time but he was too stupid to see that. He was not solely responsible for the club's upward trajectory-he was right at the heart of things but others could have done just as well.

We saw some great games under Poyet, saw some dire shite too. Everything changed after he wasn't allowed to join Reading and for me that sours all of the good he did. THE single most important period for The Albion, the club who gave him, an inexperienced manager, one of the best jobs outside of the top 6 PL clubs, and just when we needed everything working together he was wanting to join another club. He should have finished the job he started then he would have been much closer to his dream job(s), we would be in our 3rd(?) season in the PL and talking about Poyet the hero. As it is now, he is just another ex-Albion manager, nothing special.

Bwian said:
Take your Gus Goggles off for a minute.

Poyet was one part of the whole that was The Albion at that time. Everything came together in exactly the right order and it all worked perfectly to get us to within touching distance of the PL and of course Poyet had a major part in all of that. Bloom had given the keys to his £100,000,000+ project to a man in his first managerial role and backed him accordingly. It was all moving along perfectly, both learning as they went about their business. We will probably never know the whole story but clearly something changed the dynamic of the club and the rest, as they say, is history. Palace got the Star Prize, we got FFP compliance.

See this is where I disagree. I think its quite a dangerous assumption to think that "others could have done just as well". You're right in saying that Gus wasn't the SOLE factor in our survival and then total CLOBBERING of L1 - but he played such a huge role in it that I think its impossible to overstate. Bloom could have gone for a "safe" pair of hands, someone tried-and-tested, an experienced manager with a track record of getting clubs promoted. Someone from the established old merry-go-round. But instead he gambled on an eccentric, volatile blabbermouth who'd never managed before in his life and had only ever been a No2. He was the catalyst, and boy did it pay off.

And players don't sign because of stadiums, or season ticket sales. They sign firstly for money, and next on the list is the guy they'll be working for. Gus had an infectious enthusiasm and personality, with a genuine charisma. Players will buy into that, which was, I believe, a BIG factor in the calibre of some of the players we had coming through the door. He then harnessed all of that, designed a style of play, gave the team an identity and instilled the confidence and belief that side needed in order to conquer the division in such style. And he carried it on for another 2 seasons.

Could ANYONE have come in and done that, or better ? Tall order. I think the stars aligned, he was exactly the right man at the right time. So many people choose to forget all that now though, because of how it ended.

Alex Alex Dawson oo! oo! · Oct 20, 2015

Easy 10 said:
I do find it amazing.

Once he'd binned Salde, if Bloom had then made the wrong appointment, then who's to say WHERE we would've been in the League by the time we moved in at the Amex. We might have been scuffling in L2. There was certainly every chance we could still have been a L1 club. Instead Bloom got it SPECTACULARLY right in bringing in Gus, and the rest is history.

It ended in disappointment, bitterness and recriminations, but none of that should detract from where he took us from, to where it finished.

It ended with either deliberate wrongdoing or gross negligence by GP which was so serious that it fundamentally undermined the relationship of trust and confidence between him and his employer; for this (gross misconduct) he was fired. Whether previous personal performance and achievement etc can in any way mitigate/excuse such behaviour is a matter of individual opinion I guess.

One Teddy Maybank · Oct 20, 2015

Bwian said:
We saw some great games under Poyet, saw some dire shite too. Everything changed after he wasn't allowed to join Reading and for me that sours all of the good he did. THE single most important period for The Albion, the club who gave him, an inexperienced manager, one of the best jobs outside of the top 6 PL clubs, and just when we needed everything working together he was wanting to join another club. He should have finished the job he started then he would have been much closer to his dream job(s), we would be in our 3rd(?) season in the PL and talking about Poyet the hero. As it is now, he is just another ex-Albion manager, nothing special.[/]
[MENTION=459]Bwian[/MENTION]

I think it was after he turned down Reading, we went on our best run of the season, which cemented our play-off position.

It was only the second leg he got badly wrong.

In terms of poor games, of course there were some, but IMO a lot less than what followed from Garcia and Hyypia.

Bwian · Oct 20, 2015

mejonaNO12 aka riskit said:
Seems odd to say anyone who thinks Gus was a good manager has "gus goggles" on.............and then to follow it up with comments which are CLEARLY praising Gus for the job he did (which is what we are doing).

It seems those who are anti Gus often start their logic with "yes we were good under him...and we got promoted...but...."

Whereas those who recognise him as a positive era at the club stop at the word "but".

Let's be honest here, whenever there is anything remotely negative about Poyet we can rely on you (and a couple of others) to get the rose tinted paint box out.

Poyet was neither great nor shit. He was part of a momentum that any reasonable manager would have taken advantage of-probably to the level all of that energy deserved. He screwed up and handed Palace the opportunity which, unsurprisingly, they grabbed and haven't looked back since.

I can't see Hughton doing anything like that should he get us that close.

Man of Harveys · Oct 20, 2015

Alex said:
It ended with either deliberate wrongdoing or gross negligence by GP which was so serious that it fundamentally undermined the relationship of trust and confidence between him and his employer; for this (gross misconduct) he was fired. Whether previous personal performance and achievement etc can in any way mitigate/excuse such behaviour is a matter of individual opinion I guess.

Some of us recognized a good stitch-up on the HR and employment law a**e-saving front when we saw one.

After all, we've all done it: cobbled together lists of ammo to be used against people that we just don't like as employees any more. Obviously that isn't enough of a reason to give, so you dredge up all sorts of minor things that normally get ignored but that come in handy when it's been decided that their face doesn't fit any more. That's exactly what happened to Gus.

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