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[Politics] Absolute poverty



FIVESTEPS

Well-known member
Nov 3, 2014
357
Chuka Umunna on newsnight last night said 1 in 5 people(14million) in this country live in absolute poverty Personally i do not know anyone to whom this term applies and i do not consider my lifestyle to be over privileged,so how accurate is Mr Umannas statement.
 


wellquickwoody

Many More Voting Years
NSC Patreon
Aug 10, 2007
13,585
Melbourne
Absolute total king boxxocks. No doubt a left winger funded by others who needs to justify their funding, and in their eyes, any bull shit will do. Should have funding withdrawn and work in the real world rather than avoid actually funding their own lifestyle.
 


Bold Seagull

strong and stable with me, or...
Mar 18, 2010
29,719
Hove
Absolute total king boxxocks. No doubt a left winger funded by others who needs to justify their funding, and in their eyes, any bull shit will do. Should have funding withdrawn and work in the real world rather than avoid actually funding their own lifestyle.

:facepalm: you obviously know your stuff! How can we confirm or not whether he's a left winger and how he's funded? :lolol:
 


PILTDOWN MAN

Well-known member
NSC Patreon
Sep 15, 2004
18,608
Hurst Green
:facepalm: you obviously know your stuff! How can we confirm or not whether he's a left winger and how he's funded? :lolol:

At a guess closer to fact than his crap
 


wellquickwoody

Many More Voting Years
NSC Patreon
Aug 10, 2007
13,585
Melbourne
:facepalm: you obviously know your stuff! How can we confirm or not whether he's a left winger and how he's funded? :lolol:

I am daring to make an assumption, you know, the mother of all fxxk ups, makes an ass of you & me etc etc, but not illegal. So if you actually believe that 1 in 5 live in 'absolute' poverty and can demonstrate it, then go ahead, make my day. If not, shut up. :smile:
 




beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,265
unfortunately the official UK use of "absolute poverty" doesn't literally mean what you think the words mean, it has been given a fairly arbitrary definition. relative poverty is living in a household with income below 60% median earnings. absolute poverty is living in a household with income 60% below the 2010/2011 median. So the claim is probably true, but what you think of as absolute poverty, no food, clothing, shelter, is not what is meant.

Then to confuse the matter even more, the number of people in the household, adults and children, will adjust the relative and absolute numbers further. there's also perversions such as having a child may move you from non-poverty to poverty overnight, because your income didn't change but you're now in another category and dont earn enough.

see fullfact for some nice graphs on the matter, which show, generally, things have been steady for years.
 
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Da Man Clay

T'Blades
Dec 16, 2004
16,254
unfortunately the official UK use of "absolute poverty" doesn't literally mean what you think the words mean, it has been given a fairly arbitrary definition. relative poverty is living in a houshold with income below 60% median earnings. absolute poverty is living in a household with income 60% below the 2010/2011 median. So the claim is probably true, but what you think of as absolute poverty, no food, clothing shelter, is not what is meant.
Then to confuse the matter even more, the number of people in the household, adults and children, will adjust the relative and absolute numbers further. this leads to perversion such as having a child may move you from non-poverty to poverty overnight, because your income didn't change but your now in another category and dont earn enough.

see fullfact for some nice graphs on the matter (which show, generally, things have been steady for years).

Some actual proper research instead of ‘its from the left so must be nonsense’. A huge surprise that WQW is wide of the mark.
 


Bold Seagull

strong and stable with me, or...
Mar 18, 2010
29,719
Hove
I am daring to make an assumption, you know, the mother of all fxxk ups, makes an ass of you & me etc etc, but not illegal. So if you actually believe that 1 in 5 live in 'absolute' poverty and can demonstrate it, then go ahead, make my day. If not, shut up. :smile:

As soon as we can confirm if this Umunna person is from the left or not, we can move on to the poverty issue.
 




dazzer6666

Well-known member
NSC Patreon
Mar 27, 2013
52,030
Burgess Hill
Good post by [MENTION=599]beorhthelm[/MENTION]. It's a relative measure against median (UK) income, so whilst he is probably quoting facts, the description doesn't really fit the reality - 'absolute' poverty for me can be seen on the streets of, say, Mumbai, not on South London (for example) council estates where those suffering still have the latest HDTV and the kids still have enough money to buy flares and balaclavas (but not tickets for football matches). Great for the headlines though.
 


Wardy's twin

Well-known member
Oct 21, 2014
8,402
unfortunately the official UK use of "absolute poverty" doesn't literally mean what you think the words mean, it has been given a fairly arbitrary definition. relative poverty is living in a household with income below 60% median earnings. absolute poverty is living in a household with income 60% below the 2010/2011 median. So the claim is probably true, but what you think of as absolute poverty, no food, clothing, shelter, is not what is meant.

Then to confuse the matter even more, the number of people in the household, adults and children, will adjust the relative and absolute numbers further. this leads to perversions such as having a child may move you from non-poverty to poverty overnight, because your income didn't change but you're now in another category and dont earn enough.

see fullfact for some nice graphs on the matter, which show, generally, things have been steady for years.

Thanks for bringing some focus to the debate rather than people arbitrarily slagging each other off. I did not see the programme last night so did anyone actually qualify what he said.

What I guess this does highlight is what should the state provide and why.
 


Tom Hark Preston Park

Will Post For Cash
Jul 6, 2003
69,891
Good post by [MENTION=599]beorhthelm[/MENTION]. It's a relative measure against median (UK) income, so whilst he is probably quoting facts, the description doesn't really fit the reality - 'absolute' poverty for me can be seen on the streets of, say, Mumbai, not on South London (for example) council estates where those suffering still have the latest HDTV and the kids still have enough money to buy flares and balaclavas (but not tickets for football matches). Great for the headlines though.

Was just about to post much the same. The definition of 'asolute poverty' is only relative to the living standards in this country. Judged against the living standards of many other countries, the notion of anybody living in this country in absolute poverty is laughable. Relative poverty maybe.
 






Simster

"the man's an arse"
Jul 7, 2003
54,110
Surrey
Some actual proper research instead of ‘its from the left so must be nonsense’. A huge surprise that WQW is wide of the mark.
My thoughts exactly. Nicely clarified by beorhthelm, unlike WDW who time after time is the mouthy dick in the pub that everyone spends all evening trying to avoid.
 


Gazwag

5 millionth post poster
Mar 4, 2004
30,093
Bexhill-on-Sea
Good post by [MENTION=599]beorhthelm[/MENTION]. It's a relative measure against median (UK) income, so whilst he is probably quoting facts, the description doesn't really fit the reality - 'absolute' poverty for me can be seen on the streets of, say, Mumbai, not on South London (for example) council estates where those suffering still have the latest HDTV and the kids still have enough money to buy flares and balaclavas (but not tickets for football matches). Great for the headlines though.

Quite, I wonder how many people in absolute poverty in the UK are now sitting in front their 50" TV watching Jeremy Kyle while posting a photo of their 5th child eating a macdonald's breakfast on facebook using their £50 a month iPhone.
 






Simster

"the man's an arse"
Jul 7, 2003
54,110
Surrey
Quite, I wonder how many people in absolute poverty in the UK are now sitting in front their 50" TV watching Jeremy Kyle while posting a photo of their 5th child eating a macdonald's breakfast on facebook using their £50 a month iPhone.
Seeing as it's a relative measure based on having only 60% of the medium level of income in this country, not many I'd guess.
 


Westdene Seagull

aka Cap'n Carl Firecrotch
NSC Patreon
Oct 27, 2003
20,938
The arse end of Hangleton
Chuka Umunna on newsnight last night said 1 in 5 people(14million) in this country live in absolute poverty Personally i do not know anyone to whom this term applies and i do not consider my lifestyle to be over privileged,so how accurate is Mr Umannas statement.

Absolute total king boxxocks. No doubt a left winger funded by others who needs to justify their funding, and in their eyes, any bull shit will do. Should have funding withdrawn and work in the real world rather than avoid actually funding their own lifestyle.

I know quite a number of elderly people that can't afford to heat their houses in winter - I'd suggest not being warm is considered 'absolute poverty'. I know a number of people that have had to use food banks - once again, something I'd consider 'absolute poverty'. I find it remarkable that just because people don't know anyone in absolute poverty means they dismiss it actually exists - especially those privileged enough to f**k off to warm climates.
 


Bold Seagull

strong and stable with me, or...
Mar 18, 2010
29,719
Hove
Quite, I wonder how many people in absolute poverty in the UK are now sitting in front their 50" TV watching Jeremy Kyle while posting a photo of their 5th child eating a macdonald's breakfast on facebook using their £50 a month iPhone.

Is this the Paul Dacre measure of poverty I wonder?
 




Simster

"the man's an arse"
Jul 7, 2003
54,110
Surrey
Chuka Umunna on newsnight last night said 1 in 5 people(14million) in this country live in absolute poverty Personally i do not know anyone to whom this term applies and i do not consider my lifestyle to be over privileged,so how accurate is Mr Umannas statement.

Going back to the original statement, I think I know of a few people this applies to. Ultimately it seems to me to be a measure of how effective our redistribution of wealth is, and it has to be said, that is rarely anything to write home about on the Tory watch.
 


hopkins

Banned
Nov 6, 2003
1,189
Brighton
Reminds me of a post on twitter yesterday on Noel Gallaghers quote about Jeremy Corben. Somebody said that now Noel isn’t poor he’s forgotten his roots. Poor ! Makes me laugh, I bet he had clothes on his back, holidays and food every day. It’s ridiculous.
 



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