[News] Tom Daley announces baby news

Taybha · Feb 16, 2018

Well i think it's wonderful , whoever the lucky child is , they can be sure of a terrific set of abs .

pb21 · Feb 16, 2018

Creaky said:
That’s the first opinion page by Littlejohn I’ve read in years and surprisingly I agreed with much of which he wrote!

My only criticism of the article is the lingering feeling I have that had the subject been a mixed gender couple who were paying a surrogate mother to bear a child for them then it would never have been written - certainly not in such great length.

Littlejohn said:
I still cling to the belief that children benefit most from being brought up by a man and a woman.

I still cling to the belief that children benefit most from being brought up by an ideal man and an ideal woman. On that basis I think that 99.9%+ of people shouldn't raise children.

His opinion is fundamentally and logically flawed.

Creaky · Feb 16, 2018

pb21 said:
I still cling to the belief that children benefit most from being brought up by an ideal man and an ideal woman. On that basis I think that 99.9%+ of people shouldn't raise children.

His opinion is fundamentally and logically flawed.

My opinion as well and not really flawed at all. Comparing like with like as regards parental abilities and attributes I believe that children benefit more, (or if you like suffer less), from being brought up by a man and a woman.

If you want to put every individual through an assessment program similar to the one prospective adoptive parents go through, (as described earlier), then that is a totally different argument.

pb21 · Feb 16, 2018

Creaky said:
My opinion as well and not really flawed at all. Comparing like with like as regards parental abilities and attributes I believe that children benefit more, (or if you like suffer less), from being brought up by a man and a woman.

If you want to put every individual through an assessment program similar to the one prospective adoptive parents go through, (as described earlier), then that is a totally different argument.

I guess you could be of the opinion that the ideal familial setup includes a perfect male and a perfect female as parents who are able to naturally conceive. That may be the case, I don't know if it is and I suspect it couldn't be proved or disproved.

However if you are then of the opinion that two same sex people shouldn't adopt or raise children (I don't know if you are?) because they don't meet that ideal, then you either apply the same logic to apply to everyone (i.e. only ideal men and women who can naturally conceive should raise children), or if not you are differentiating between people solely on the basis of their sexuality.

Creaky · Feb 16, 2018

pb21 said:
I guess you could be of the opinion that the ideal familial setup includes a perfect male and a perfect female as parents who are able to naturally conceive. That may be the case, I don't know if it is and I suspect it couldn't be proved or disproved.

However if you are then of the opinion that two same sex people shouldn't adopt or raise children (I don't know if you are?) because they don't meet that ideal, then you either apply the same logic to apply to everyone (i.e. only ideal men and women who can naturally conceive should raise children), or if not you are differentiating between people solely on the basis of their sexuality.

I really don’t see what sexuality has to do with the subject at all - I’ve only ever mentioned gender.

I have nothing at all against any individual, no matter what relationship they may or may not be in, fostering, adopting or conceiving children based on their gender.

I do believe though that in general children with mixed gender parents have an advantage over those whose parents are the same gender, whether that be single parents or same gender couples. Of course that doesn’t mean that in individual cases single parents or same gender couples wouldn’t offer a child better opportunities.

LlcoolJ · Feb 16, 2018

wellquickwoody said:
Cristiano Ronaldo is a very talented footballer, he is also a ****.

You meanwhile, are just a ****

I don't mind being called a **** but putting me in the same bracket as that **** is fighting talk.

Robinjakarta · Feb 16, 2018

dazzer6666 said:
Vegans ?

No idea as don't know any that I know of. I know a few vegetarians and we get on fine.

JC Footy Genius · Feb 16, 2018

Quick question. Which one is going to be the biological father? Or do they get two pots of love juice, mix em up and whack it up her :shrug:

Buzzer · Feb 16, 2018

Hotchilidog said:
As someone who was successfully raised by an amazing single parent, spare me the every child needs a mother and father bollocks, it is quite frankly offensive.

It may be your opinion, but it is categorically wrong and whether intentionally or not it cast aspersions on those not brought up in the "traditional family unit".

If you do not like being called out for a bigoted opinion then think before you speak.

And as someone who just about survived growing up in a really horrible and abusive environment with a mother/father and then a mother/stepfather, I can confirm that the traditional family unit sometimes isn't all it's cracked up to be.

It really doesn't matter who brings a child up as long as they show them love and give them a happy, safe childhood. The rest is all mere detail.

Hotchilidog · Feb 16, 2018

Buzzer said:
And as someone who just about survived growing up in a really horrible and abusive environment with a mother/father and then a mother/stepfather, I can confirm that the traditional family unit sometimes isn't all it's cracked up to be.

It really doesn't matter who brings a child up as long as they show them love and give them a happy, safe childhood. The rest is all mere detail.

This! Quality not quantity.

dazzer6666 · Feb 16, 2018

Robinjakarta said:
No idea as don't know any that I know of. I know a few vegetarians and we get on fine.

I'm not bothered either way but there seems to be an increasing number of 'vegan crusaders' on social media constantly posting anti-meat/dairy propaganda and a far more aggressive way

Seagull73 · Feb 16, 2018

Creaky said:
I really don’t see what sexuality has to do with the subject at all - I’ve only ever mentioned gender.

I have nothing at all against any individual, no matter what relationship they may or may not be in, fostering, adopting or conceiving children based on their gender.

I do believe though that in general children with mixed gender parents have an advantage over those whose parents are the same gender, whether that be single parents or same gender couples. Of course that doesn’t mean that in individual cases single parents or same gender couples wouldn’t offer a child better opportunities.

What do you base your general beliefs on? That assumption can only be made when there is enough evidence from both spectrums to support the theory, and yet same-sex parents in any kind of number is still as a relatively new phenomenon, and therefore it cannot be an evidence-based belief. You may not have mentioned sexuality as a cause for your belief - so what else is there to consider?

Creaky · Feb 16, 2018

Seagull73 said:
What do you base your general beliefs on? That assumption can only be made when there is enough evidence from both spectrums to support the theory, and yet same-sex parents in any kind of number is still as a relatively new phenomenon, and therefore it cannot be an evidence-based belief. You may not have mentioned sexuality as a cause for your belief - so what else is there to consider?

There is plenty of evidence to show the benefits to children of both male and female role models in a family.

I quoted earlier the experiences of children with either a single parent or same sex parents who suffered bullying from their peers.

What has any of that to do with the sexuality, or lack of it, of parents?

A large sample of an exception to a ‘rule’ is not necessary to show the advantages or disadvantages of the majority. In any case there is a huge sample of children being raised by a single parent.

Mackenzie · Feb 16, 2018

Taybha said:
Well i think it's wonderful , whoever the lucky child is , they can be sure of a terrific set of abs .

Well dressed too.

Raleigh Chopper · Feb 16, 2018

Mackenzie said:
Well dressed too.

And a great haircut.

Raleigh Chopper · Feb 16, 2018

Goldstone1976 said:
Top, top post. I wish you and your family all the very best.

I have two sets of friends who have adopted - both went through a nightmare selection process too. It seems as though that’s a common experience. I was the employer of on of them and the local authority interviewed me face to face for an hour on my thoughts as to the suitability of my employee as a prospective adoptive parent. Some of the questions were, frankly, unbelievably intrusive.

Adopting is absolutely not the easy process that those who have no experience of it think it is. It takes a massive toll on the parents, and subjects the child to, typically, two years more of uncertainty about where they’re going to live and who their parents will be. It’s a very flawed system. Safeguards have to be in place, obviously, but so does consideration for the child’s long term mental health.

We adopted a girl from foster care that was taken from the mother at birth, she was just over 1 year old when we took her home.
No father, Mother is a drug addict/alcoholic and living on the streets somewhere in london.
Our kid was born addicted to crack and alcohol.
She is great but we are experiencing problems that you would expect from a 13 year old but also her background problems too but we have been to enough seminars to know what to expect and how to deal with it.
Adopted kids just want to be loved, feel safe and secure and as much as you can insist that they will never be rejected by us.
Bullying and rejection at school is multiplied by 100 and very difficult to deal with.
If you can provide the above it does not matter if you are single, gay, straight or Australian, some posts on here are worrying and upsetting.
I know of a (rare) example whereas a straight husband and wife adopted a kid and sent him back after 6 months because he could not hold his knife and fork properly FFS, it would have crucified the poor kid.
I have met Tom Daley a few times, he is a totally nice bloke, he/ they will do a great job I am sure.
I think people who have no experience of adoption should really say nothing, they have no idea.
I have not regretted a single moment, difficult to explain but I saw her and loved her as my own from day one.
To call adoption a fad is so wrong, a small dog that fits in a handbag is a fad, not a child.

Thunder Bolt · Feb 16, 2018

Stat Brother said:
Back to the point in hand:-

[tweet]964408111401283584[/tweet]

Again for me it's easy to work out how I feel about a particular story.
If Littlejohn & The Daily Mail are prepared to do a full page against something...

...I clearly agree with the opposite opinion.

Up to press, seven companies have said they are withdrawing from advertising in the DM, because of that article.

worthingseagull123 · Feb 16, 2018

goldstone said:
The British Olympic diver and his husband Dustin Lance Black shared the news on social media.

There is no way gay people should be permitted to have children by whatever bizarre means they acquire them. The incontrovertible fact is that it takes a male and a female to produce babies. If you don't wish to participate in that activity because you prefer your own sex, then hard bloody luck. Guess what? No babies. Can't have it both ways. Heterosexual ... OK you can have kids. Homosexual ... sorry, you can't.

And the guy isn't his "husband", he's his gay partner.

Why is this news? Gay couple decide to have kids.

No different to straight couple.

He is no superstar, why are we so, so called celebrity, obsessed in the UK.

Psychobilly freakout · Feb 16, 2018

Buzzer said:
And as someone who just about survived growing up in a really horrible and abusive environment with a mother/father and then a mother/stepfather, I can confirm that the traditional family unit sometimes isn't all it's cracked up to be.

It really doesn't matter who brings a child up as long as they show them love and give them a happy, safe childhood. The rest is all mere detail.

Sorry to hear that Buzzer, My mum left after six months and I had a complicated up bringing including foster homes in the most important years. Looking back I would have given anything for someone to “love & care” for me then, be it two women, two men, one man, one woman. Which is why your last paragraph hits the nail on the head, and basically anyone who tries to find a reason to argue against that is not getting the point and any further discussion is futile.

Scappa · Feb 17, 2018

worthingseagull123 said:
Why is this news? Gay couple decide to have kids.

No different to straight couple.

He is no superstar, why are we so, so called celebrity, obsessed in the UK.

And, almost as pertinently, intent on destroying/belittling anyone who has a modicum of celebrity or success in their lives

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[News] Tom Daley announces baby news

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