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The Last 15, was it really necessary to be sooo negative....



GT49er

GT49er

Well-known member
Feb 1, 2009
46,703
Gloucester
Bold Seagull said:
Why do people always think WE DECIDED to shut up shop? There is another team on a football pitch whose own play can dictate what happens. I don't think we intentionally 'close shop' at all, I think West Brom were beat, and if anything we looked like getting a 4th, but they did get a goal and that was a shot in the arm for them, and they suddenly hurried and harried us whereas previous to that, they hadn't.
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I think we just have to accept that defending the game out is the CH way - that's been pretty obvious from day one, and although some of us don't like that particular aspect it's just something we'll have to accept as long as we want to keep the excellent CH as our manager. The argument in favour, I suppose, is that it's playing the percentages and works more often than not - I guess those that like the system will point to our results over the last two years as proof.
Difficult to argue against that really. I'll just have to accept that we're very seldom going to enjoy the last 15 minutes of any matches this season, and will have to get used to taking an enormous breath of relief when the final whistle blows.
 




Icy Gull

Icy Gull

Back on the rollercoaster
Jul 5, 2003
72,015
Greg Bobkin said:
Yeah – and look how THAT turned out! :jester:
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Not sure we'll get away with sitting back for the last 20 mins with the quality we are going to be facing this season.

It is certainly a CH tactic imo and in fairness it has worked even if it does make me a nervous wreck for the last 20 mins. Maybe I should leave on 70 mins :smile:
 


Thunder Bolt

Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
Aug 18, 2009
65,395
Beside the seaside, beside the sea
One Teddy Maybank said:
But it was two poor errors by us on their goal.

Propper chased the ball and lost shape, Gross tried to slot in, but got caught ball watching as Morrison jogged past him.

Thought Murray was lucky not to see red. Felt we should have got another fresh pair of legs on, perhaps Uwe as a DM or Izquierdo for Solly who looked shattered.

Overall just a great performance though.....


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Murray was looking at the ball the whole time, so it was an accidental arm/elbow. Yes, it deserved a yellow, but not a red, imo.
 


One Teddy Maybank

One Teddy Maybank

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 4, 2006
21,595
Worthing
Icy Gull said:
Not sure we'll get away with sitting back for the last 20 mins with the quality we are going to be facing this season.

It is certainly a CH tactic imo and in fairness it has worked even if it does make me a nervous wreck for the last 20 mins. Maybe I should leave on 70 mins :smile:
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They'll only be a queue....!


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Icy Gull

Icy Gull

Back on the rollercoaster
Jul 5, 2003
72,015
Thunder Bolt said:
Murray was looking at the ball the whole time, so it was an accidental arm/elbow. Yes, it deserved a yellow, but not a red, imo.
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I thought it was absolutely deliberate, he is a very clever player and was the dirtiest player in the Championship last season statistically. :shrug:
 




One Teddy Maybank

One Teddy Maybank

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 4, 2006
21,595
Worthing
Thunder Bolt said:
Murray was looking at the ball the whole time, so it was an accidental arm/elbow. Yes, it deserved a yellow, but not a red, imo.
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Yes, I know what you mean, but sometimes as a player you have a picture in your mind as you are about to challenge, and I think Glenn was going in to 'rattle' the player.

I've seen 'reds' given, but as you correctly say his eyes were focused on the ball.


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Lower West Stander

Lower West Stander

Well-known member
Mar 25, 2012
4,753
Back in Sussex
Bold Seagull said:
Why do people always think WE DECIDED to shut up shop? There is another team on a football pitch whose own play can dictate what happens. I don't think we intentionally 'close shop' at all, I think West Brom were beat, and if anything we looked like getting a 4th, but they did get a goal and that was a shot in the arm for them, and they suddenly hurried and harried us whereas previous to that, they hadn't.
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I think this is certainly true to a point. WBA are clearly a better side than they showed in the 1st 70 or so minutes and they were bound to come on to us at some point.

But, we defended far too deep. When the ball was cleared there was no attempt to push up and get us further forward. Hemed and Murray were isolated and had no one to lay the ball off to. You could see we were just hacking the ball clear and just waiting for it to get pinged back in the box. We have to learn to be more confident against these sides - I doubt we'll get away with defending that deep against top half sides and we won't have a 3-0 cushion every week either.
 






G

Greg Bobkin

Silver Seagull
May 22, 2012
14,836
Icy Gull said:
Not sure we'll get away with sitting back for the last 20 mins with the quality we are going to be facing this season.

It is certainly a CH tactic imo and in fairness it has worked even if it does make me a nervous wreck for the last 20 mins. Maybe I should leave on 70 mins :smile:
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I agree, but then I don't expect the team to the 3-0 up – or even 2-0 up after 70 minutes.
 


M

martin tyler

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2013
5,844
Personally I think it was more the fact Pullis changed things a bit
Started the game with 3 good CM but none who really had much attacking intent, a striker left wing and no one within 20 yards of Rondon and Philips right wing who did nothing and no over lapping full backs
Fast forward to 70th minute we are 3 up he has brought on Morrison who caused more problems than anyone in the previous hour plus, an attacking left back and a RW who would literally go forward at every opportunity right or wrong.
At 3-0 down the onus is on then to attack us and for us to break when we can.
The difference in the PL is it is. It so easy just to break on teams there are better stronger and more physical players. An area for us to improve on clearly as there were a couple of opportunities to break with better composure late on. If we had done that people would of seen us sitting back and breaking as a good thing
 
















oneillco

oneillco

Well-known member
Feb 13, 2013
1,259
Gazz15 said:
Ok it was a great win and much needed, I understand we decided to close shop and allow West Brom to come onto us, but for heaven's sake!

Had they got a second goal, which they almost did, it would have put the wrong complexion on the match, and left us hanging on desperately, when it really was not that close for the first 70 minutes.

Grateful for the well deserved win and 3 points BUT I shudder to think how many points this may cost us during the season, if we try to hang on too much?
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Interesting that the dip on the pitch for the last 15 mins coincided with a dip in singing around the ground. Just before WBA scored I was thinking that the crowd need to lift the players to see them through to the final whistle. At 3-0 up it felt like the crowd and the players thought it was job done...
 


T

TimWatt

Active member
Feb 13, 2011
165
Richmond
My feeling about that time when there was a lull at 3-0, was I guessed everyone's collective thoughts were on the same lines...
As the WBA right back had the ball on the corner doing nothing with it at one point - all of a sudden, whether from his own initiative or instructions, suddenly he and then the rest upped their urgency levels - and applied the 'professional' approach contrasting to Norwich players here last year - of not wanting to appear to be the one looking like he was accepting likely defeat, which translated to the team and edginess of the crowd (and I think after that was the first period I heard anything of the away following from the EN corner.
Norwich players were accused of giving up, but I think that was probably unfair, rather accusing them of that was more bearable to their collective egos than accepting they were actually second best in the game by a big margin.
You could say Norwich players were guilty of conserving effort but that runs contrary to the seemingly accepted player etiquette of always refusing to accept defeat to a team they consider below or equal to themselves, regardless of the likely outcome. So even if it's a 100-1 chance against getting 3 goals in the last 15 minutes no player wants to stick out as accepting that likelihood.
So for appearance sakes to their fans - it seems like their effort came too late or their subs were more effective than their starting team.
They scored a well-worked goal that sneaked in and held out after, so all's well etc.
The last ten minutes against Burnley in 2015/16 - now that was agonising!
 


G

GloryDays

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2011
1,599
Leyton, E10.
Bold Seagull said:
Why do people always think WE DECIDED to shut up shop? There is another team on a football pitch whose own play can dictate what happens. I don't think we intentionally 'close shop' at all, I think West Brom were beat, and if anything we looked like getting a 4th, but they did get a goal and that was a shot in the arm for them, and they suddenly hurried and harried us whereas previous to that, they hadn't.
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I think it's a bit of this and a bit of having been a bit too cocky for 5 minutes and getting scorned for it. Saw the game out well. WB were always going to create chances near the end (aerially esp) and it was vital we put bodies in the box. Saw the game out well, albeit slightly desperately.
 




studio150

studio150

Well-known member
Jul 30, 2011
29,606
On the Border
Here we go (again) we play well and win, but it's not enough for some, who must moan regardless.

Forget game management, we're 3-0 up lets throw everyone forward in search of a 4th, thereby leaving ourselves wide open for conceding goals and getting pegged back.

The back 4 unit have 3 internationals and 1 who is being touted as being able to win an England call up, but no, they're not to be trusted to defend and see the game out, we must attack at all times.

Just leave it to CH he does know what he's doing, alternatively come along to the live QA with Paul Barber and demand that NSC sets out the tactics that the team must adopt.
 


GT49er

GT49er

Well-known member
Feb 1, 2009
46,703
Gloucester
studio150 said:
Here we go (again) we play well and win, but it's not enough for some, who must moan regardless.

Forget game management, we're 3-0 up lets throw everyone forward in search of a 4th, thereby leaving ourselves wide open for conceding goals and getting pegged back.

The back 4 unit have 3 internationals and 1 who is being touted as being able to win an England call up, but no, they're not to be trusted to defend and see the game out, we must attack at all times.

Just leave it to CH he does know what he's doing, alternatively come along to the live QA with Paul Barber and demand that NSC sets out the tactics that the team must adopt.
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Discussion is allowed, you know! It is possible to be a fervent supporter of CH and all he does, but still not enjoy the way the last 15 minutes often seem to pan out.
 


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