[Other Sport] Cycling geeks

Stat Brother · Jul 31, 2018

Bold Seagull said:
As time goes on though, you do evolve and some rules do make sense. As an example, I used to think I needed one of those saddle bags for tools, tubes and the like, but now more than happy to stuff all that crap in my jersey*. I actually feel better for it, I don't know why, and I'm faster because of it too.**

* do you remember how many times I got something out of my jersey that time we did with Wiggle Long One!?
**that probably isn't true, if Strava that racing app is anything to go by.

I dispensed with my bag a long time ago.
I now just have everything (tube, levers, CO2, mini tool, chain link and cake money) in a sunglasses bag.
That sits nicely in the middle back pocket, phone and key in the right and food in the left.

It definitely* makes you faster.

*definitely doesn't

Bold Seagull · Jul 31, 2018

Stat Brother said:
I dispensed with my bag a long time ago.
I now just have everything (tube, levers, CO2, mini tool, chain link and cake money) in a sunglasses bag.
That sits nicely in the middle back pocket, phone and key in the right and food in the left.

It definitely* makes you faster.

*definitely doesn't

Makes you look cooler = faster so essentially the same thing. Anyone that can publicly state that matching bar tape, socks, and sunglasses trim doesn't make you faster doesn't understand marginal gains.

Triggaaar · Jul 31, 2018

1066familyman said:
I'm not a Sky fan at all. Aside from anything else, Brailsford's level of arrogance just seems to step up and up with each interview. Today's one
, when asked if other teams can improve, is yet another shining example.

You'd be arrogant if you were that good.

Well done G!

He's always come across as a very genuine bloke and really likeable character. And above all, he's done so much hard work for others and now really deserves this win. Chapeau!

Indeed.

Pogue Mahone · Jul 31, 2018

Bold Seagull said:
As time goes on though, you do evolve and some rules do make sense. As an example, I used to think I needed one of those saddle bags for tools, tubes and the like, but now more than happy to stuff all that crap in my jersey*. I actually feel better for it, I don't know why, and I'm faster because of it too.**

* do you remember how many times I got something out of my jersey that time we did with Wiggle Long One!?
**that probably isn't true, if Strava that racing app is anything to go by.

I subliminally follow many of 'The Rules'. I disapprove of myself for doing so.

Pogue Mahone · Jul 31, 2018

Bold Seagull said:
* do you remember how many times I got something out of my jersey that time we did with Wiggle Long One!?
**that probably isn't true, if Strava that racing app is anything to go by.

* How could I forget?
**It's not about speed. It's about getting there.

Stat Brother · Jul 31, 2018

Pogue Mahone said:
I subliminally follow many of 'The Rules'. I disapprove of myself for doing so.

Jnr's dropped himself in it by riding the IOW, then racing Phil up a Coombes climb, the other day.

He's now getting a fair bit of 'Rule #5' every time he drops his pace. :lol:

#CompetitiveDad.

Triggaaar · Jul 31, 2018

1066familyman said:
What I don't like about Brailsford is the way that he always suggests that all his success is due to working harder and being smarter than those he's competing against. Others are too stupid/lazy to get the refuelling right, pay attention to the 'marginal gains' or travel the world going to conferences and learning from other sports. Not once does he ever mention the budget.

Can someone post the budgets for the top few teams over the last 7 ish years? From bits I've read, Sky weren't that far over other teams, and since they're winning, they're presumably getting more from sponsors than their rivals, so you can't blame them for that.

And in some years Froome has been good enough to win without his brilliant team anyway. I also assume Froome is paid more than his rivals, which will be part of the larger budget Sky have, and yes, I imagine Sky wouldn't have always won if Froome raced for someone else.

Stat Brother · Jul 31, 2018

Triggaaar said:
Can someone post the budgets for the top few teams over the last 7 ish years? From bits I've read, Sky weren't that far over other teams, and since they're winning, they're presumably getting more from sponsors than their rivals, so you can't blame them for that.

And in some years Froome has been good enough to win without his brilliant team anyway. I also assume Froome is paid more than his rivals, which will be part of the larger budget Sky have, and yes, I imagine Sky wouldn't have always won if Froome raced for someone else.

It's not so much Sky, BMC, Katusha, Movistar et al budgets that's the issue.
It's the difference between the have and have not's that is the problem.

The have not's have always been able to compete on a level, they could usually pick up enough prizes (or even a singular TdF prize victory) to validate an entire season, but now they are all but shut out.
A situation made worse when you consider there are no transfer fees in cycling

m20gull · Jul 31, 2018

Stat Brother said:
Damn straight other than rule #9 that's all bollox.

If he thinks I'm going to wave to a triathlete he can do one.

There's no way they would wave back anyway

Triggaaar · Jul 31, 2018

Bold Seagull said:
I know you’re joking, and I did chuckle, but it is also worth noting Thomas has never had a TUE, the strongest medication he’s had (on record) is ibruprofen when he broke his hip. I think he is genuinely, unpretentiously one of the good guys.

So does having TUE make you one of the bad guys?

Triggaaar · Jul 31, 2018

Stat Brother said:
It's not so much Sky, BMC, Katusha, Movistar et al budgets that's the issue.
It's the difference between the have and have not's that is the problem.

The have not's have always been able to compete on a level, they could usually pick up enough prizes (or even a singular TdF prize victory) to validate an entire season, but now they are all but shut out.
A situation made worse when you consider there are no transfer fees in cycling

That's a fair comment on cycling in general. What I'm unconvinced about is Sky just winning because they have the biggest budget.

Stat Brother · Jul 31, 2018

For any newbie that doesn't know what we're bibbling on about:-

http://www.velominati.com/the-rules/

Stat Brother · Jul 31, 2018

Triggaaar said:
That's a fair comment on cycling in general. What I'm unconvinced about is Sky just winning because they have the biggest budget.

Obviously on a level that's impossible to answer, as they've always had the biggest budget and in the main have been the premier Grand Tour team.

Bold Seagull · Jul 31, 2018

Triggaaar said:
So does having TUE make you one of the bad guys?

Nope, but it means you're also not treading a tight rope of controversy either.

Triggaaar · Jul 31, 2018

Bold Seagull said:
Nope, but it means you're also not treading a tight rope of controversy either.

But if you actually have asthma, you don't really have a choice do you. And since G doesn't have asthma, taking the meds wouldn't do him any good anyway.

Bold Seagull · Jul 31, 2018

Triggaaar said:
But if you actually have asthma, you don't really have a choice do you. And since G doesn't have asthma, taking the meds wouldn't do him any good anyway.

Okay Trigg. :thumbsup:

Triggaaar · Jul 31, 2018

Bold Seagull said:
Okay Trigg.

Feel free to explain why that's wrong.

Bold Seagull · Jul 31, 2018

Triggaaar said:
Feel free to explain why that's wrong.

Several riders have been banned for taking salbutamol, unless you are being intentionally dense, then you must have also missed the controversy over Froome's adverse reading of having appeared to have taken too much salbutamol. You must have also missed the controversy over Wiggins TUE packages. But other than that, no controversy with TUEs for legitimate medical reasons.

Triggaaar · Jul 31, 2018

Bold Seagull said:
Several riders have been banned for taking salbutamol

Which means that there's a limit, and you need permission to use it, and that riders are believed to have exceed the limit. That's all.

unless you are being intentionally dense, then you must have also missed the controversy over Froome's adverse reading of having appeared to have taken too much salbutamol.

Unless you're being intentionally dense, then you must have miss the fact that he was cleared of wrong-doing, because the test results didn't show he's taken too much at all.

You must have also missed the controversy over Wiggins TUE packages.

No, I saw that too.

But other than that, no controversy with TUEs for legitimate medical reasons.

But I wasn't saying there's no controversy, I was saying that to my knowledge Salbutomol doesn't do anything for you if you don't have asthma. That may not be correct, I don't know, but I don't think it's been proven that it's performance-enhancing for everyone.

Bold Seagull · Jul 31, 2018

Triggaaar said:
Which means that there's a limit, and you need permission to use it, and that riders are believed to have exceed the limit. That's all.

Unless you're being intentionally dense, then you must have miss the fact that he was cleared of wrong-doing, because the test results didn't show he's taken too much at all.

No, I saw that too.

But I wasn't saying there's no controversy, I was saying that to my knowledge Salbutomol doesn't do anything for you if you don't have asthma. That may not be correct, I don't know, but I don't think it's been proven that it's performance-enhancing for everyone.

You don't need permission to use salbutamol, it doesn't actually require a TUE, it just has a dose limit.

Froome's readings showed he was over that limit, but Sky demonstrated the reasons for the reading being over. We'll never know if he actually took too much or not, we only know they were satisfied there was a legitimate reason for his high reading.

My saying Thomas has never required a TUE was only to say he's never been involved in any controversies, that he is genuinely one of the nice guys in the peloton and in cycling generally - that in turn didn't mean to imply those taking TUE are bad guys. Hope that clarifies that.

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