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[Politics] Benevolent Dictatorship Manifesto



DavidinSouthampton

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jan 3, 2012
16,569
This. All microbeads should be banned NOW. I was staggered to see that many different brands and types of toothpaste still contain them. I never buy a toothpaste containing them and I would encourage others to leave them on the shelf.

How can you tell?..... genuine question
I presume "microbeads" would not show on the list of ingredients. They're not listed on mine.

Edit - I've just seen on a website called electric teeth that the UK government banned the use of microbeads in all Cosmetics from July 2018. Whether toothpaste counts as cosmetics, or whether people might be breaking the law is, I guess, another matter.
 
Last edited:




Bakero

Languidly clinical
Oct 9, 2010
13,747
Almería
How can you tell?..... genuine question
I presume "microbeads" would not show on the list of ingredients. They're not listed on mine.

Edit - I've just seen on a website called electric teeth that the UK government banned the use of microbeads in all Cosmetics from July 2018. Whether toothpaste counts as cosmetics, or whether people might be breaking the law is, I guess, another matter.

Pretty sure microbeads are banned in all cosmetic and personal care products. That includes toothpaste.
 




cunning fergus

Well-known member
Jan 18, 2009
4,744
Glad I lightened your day :)

I certainly didn't suggest the EU was anti-business, and I could also have added that they were at an arms length from the unions too - although I was including them in the 'vested interests' of the latter part of that sentence. The point I was making was that elected officials are heavily influenced in policy making by the need to get elected, which is in turn heavily influenced by their donors - the unions, the lobbyists, 'big-business' and so on. So while that influence is still there when it comes to the EU, it is considerably diluted for a number of reasons.

No point in re-running a hundred brexit arguments on this thread. but I think its fair to say that policy on the environment, pollution, human rights, health and safety at work is generally more advanced through EU rules than in the constituent nation's laws, even though I would argue that a large majority of the public would support those rules when considering them in isolation. I think that the contrast between what becomes law in a country and what becomes an EU regulation, comes about because the EU is far more of the 'benevolent dictator' proposed in this thread.

An example is air pollution, for which I am certain the vast majority of the British public would answer yes to the question "do you want clean air and no air pollution"? And yet the supposedly-undemocratic EU has set stricter limits than the democratic UK government ever did and has taken the UK to court over the levels of air pollution in our country. Which is the debate in a nutshell, do you value democracy over clean air?

FYI the greens fought for remain and are now pro-second referendum


I’m afraid your assertion that U.K. elected MPs are somehow more sceptible to the influence of lobbyists than (say) non elected EU commissioners is simply wrong. The reason for that is the inherent transparency of the respective systems of government.

I’m not naive, there are corrupt/dishonest publicly elected U.K. MPs, however their conduct is subject to a broadly investigative UK press and most importantly a strong parliamentary opposition. There respective non elected EU officials are not subject to either in the way it operates in the U.K..

If it was as you say, then we would have known about trade agreements like TTIP before the Trump administration walked away, but we didn’t. The U.K. MPs are of course guilty of keeping their mouths shut on this kind of stuff, but then they mostly agree with the system as it is don’t they?

https://www.independent.co.uk/voice...-why-the-answer-should-scare-you-9779688.html

As for the EU having an environmental bent, I don’t see it that way, the CAP and fisheries policies are not working, and if you want proof of the influence of big business the recent VW emission scandal tells you who pulls the strings of power at the EU Commission.

https://www.politico.eu/article/european-commission-strikes-dieselgate-deal-with-volkswagen/

One final point, why did dyed-in-the-wool pro EU Nick Clegg join Facebook? To facilitate Facebook lobbying of the EU Commission or the EU’s man in Facebook following GDPR? Seriously......
 


Kalimantan Gull

Well-known member
Aug 13, 2003
12,923
Central Borneo / the Lizard
I’m afraid your assertion that U.K. elected MPs are somehow more sceptible to the influence of lobbyists than (say) non elected EU commissioners is simply wrong. The reason for that is the inherent transparency of the respective systems of government.

I’m not naive, there are corrupt/dishonest publicly elected U.K. MPs, however their conduct is subject to a broadly investigative UK press and most importantly a strong parliamentary opposition. There respective non elected EU officials are not subject to either in the way it operates in the U.K..

If it was as you say, then we would have known about trade agreements like TTIP before the Trump administration walked away, but we didn’t. The U.K. MPs are of course guilty of keeping their mouths shut on this kind of stuff, but then they mostly agree with the system as it is don’t they?

https://www.independent.co.uk/voice...-why-the-answer-should-scare-you-9779688.html

As for the EU having an environmental bent, I don’t see it that way, the CAP and fisheries policies are not working, and if you want proof of the influence of big business the recent VW emission scandal tells you who pulls the strings of power at the EU Commission.

https://www.politico.eu/article/european-commission-strikes-dieselgate-deal-with-volkswagen/

One final point, why did dyed-in-the-wool pro EU Nick Clegg join Facebook? To facilitate Facebook lobbying of the EU Commission or the EU’s man in Facebook following GDPR? Seriously......


OK, I'm hardly claiming that the EU is amazing, but can you admit there are good things being regulated in the EU parliament that can't get through Westminster?

I wasn't really talking about corruption, merely the influence of bodies making very large legal donations to MP's

CAP and CFP have major issues, of course they do, although I'm not convinced a world without them will be better for the environment. Losing CAP is probably the single biggest benefit of Brexit in my eyes, although I doubt the farmers will be happy. CFP could have been fine but terribly mismanaged at the national level.
 






Weststander

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 25, 2011
63,881
Withdean area
OK, I'm hardly claiming that the EU is amazing, but can you admit there are good things being regulated in the EU parliament that can't get through Westminster?

I wasn't really talking about corruption, merely the influence of bodies making very large legal donations to MP's

CAP and CFP have major issues, of course they do, although I'm not convinced a world without them will be better for the environment. Losing CAP is probably the single biggest benefit of Brexit in my eyes, although I doubt the farmers will be happy. CFP could have been fine but terribly mismanaged at the national level.

Don't underestimate the power of huge multinationals on the EU. A.Benn and Corbyn have crusaded against the EU all their lives because of it. Some people in the UK think of the EU as a a socialist endeavour, it isn't. A drive to the bottom on wages favours employers.
 


cunning fergus

Well-known member
Jan 18, 2009
4,744
Thank God for trade union apologists, Jacob Rees-Mogg and Boris Johnson eh? Good to read these people have got your working-class back.

Well, some trade unions are for the EU and some are not.....

https://www.ft.com/content/692f2578-fcbd-11e5-b5f5-070dca6d0a0d

That said, even the GMB in their advice to their members advocated a vote leave whilst holding your nose approach, so hardly a ringing endorsement. As has been said on here a gazillion times, the British working class have largely been hung out to dry by EU policies, that is why they largely voted leave.

The fact that a couple of Tory toffs want out only contrasts with the Labour toffs like Lady Nugee and Sir Kier who want in........only one of these couples are aligned with the interests and results of the referendum.





https://www.ft.com/content/692f2578-fcbd-11e5-b5f5-070dca6d0a0d
 




cunning fergus

Well-known member
Jan 18, 2009
4,744
OK, I'm hardly claiming that the EU is amazing, but can you admit there are good things being regulated in the EU parliament that can't get through Westminster?

I wasn't really talking about corruption, merely the influence of bodies making very large legal donations to MP's

CAP and CFP have major issues, of course they do, although I'm not convinced a world without them will be better for the environment. Losing CAP is probably the single biggest benefit of Brexit in my eyes, although I doubt the farmers will be happy. CFP could have been fine but terribly mismanaged at the national level.


I’m afraid as it stands there are no aspects of how EU laws are made that provides me with any sense of reassurance, and consequently whether or not those laws are right is moot. All the while I don’t vote in (say) the Head of the EU Commission or the Commissioners and powerful people continue to appoint powerful people to make EU laws I can’t accept the existing governmental model.

I know the U.K. is not perfect too, but U.K. democracy with a strong opposition and robust press holding elected governments to account serves the U.K. electorate better than its shadowy, arms length EU equivalent.

And, let’s not forget who runs the EU Commission now, ex Luxemburg President who oversaw one of the biggest expansions of Luxemburg’s economy, how so? Brass plating multi national big business so they avoided tax in other EU countries. If you think the EU henhouse is best managed by Mr Fox then good luck to you, had he been put up for public election that back story would have bit him on the arse and he would never have been installed......FACT.
 








melias shoes

Well-known member
Oct 14, 2010
4,830
Following the recent IPCC climate change report, is it now time to get real, accept people aren't going to change without the force of law and start a move towards benevolent dictatorships to save us all?

Manifesto pledges for starters:

AIR TRAVEL - All citizens to be issued with one air travel voucher per year, transferable. Those wishing to have more foreign holidays will have to buy vouchers from those willing to sell. This should lead to a reduction in air travel whilst those unable to afford foreign holidays, or not wanting to use their voucher, can get some income from selling their vouchers.

COMMUTING - Those living within 3 miles of their place of work/study aren't allowed to drive there without a medical certificate proving they can't walk/cycle or access public transport for the journey.

PLASTIC STRAW AND COTTON BUD BAN - No proposal to ban them....we're just going to ban them as from NOW.

PRIVATE CARS - Maximum two cars per household, no exceptions. Tax breaks for one car or no car households.





Any more pledges anyone?

Good luck with that.
 


FatSuperman

Well-known member
Feb 25, 2016
2,830
The entire WORLD needs to start following these policies, but it’s not going to go down well with developing countries that are trying to catch up. And frankly, they’ll all be such a pain in the arse to most in ‘the west’ that you’ll end up with a revolution. I feel that most of the issues will be solved by economic pressures and technology. Most people are very interested in things that will save them a decent chunk of money or gain them a load of time for no cost.

Once EVs are as cheap and convenient as ICE cars, there will be a significant shift. Once lab grown meat is as good as normal meat but much cheaper, there will be a shift (although that’ll be a generational thing for sure). Plastic needs a new tech to arrive that is green, cheap and just as useful. That one may take a while :(

Absolutely any barrier to most people’s lives will be met with indifference at best, if not outright hostility. Jesus, most people wouldn’t switch to a green washing powder even if it was the same price as their current one. Let alone go vegan or something for the good of the planet and future strangers / generations.
 


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