[News] Craig Mackey , cowardly copper

Big G · Oct 18, 2018

darkwolf666 said:
So will you be “sticking on” all the uniformed officers identified by the armed officers as moving away from the scene, batons drawn? Or just this senior officer?

Yes, especially the 'Police Officers'.....who leave their station and go out without their protective equipment, which they are duty bound to have with them....!

And quite frankly any officer 'moving away'..(cowards).....from a threat... armed with a knife.... when they have CS spray and a baton.. and lets not forget a duty to protect life and lim......should have their ability to be a police officer seriously questioned....regardless of rank!

Big G · Oct 18, 2018

Weststander said:
Again, great post.

NSC’s keyboard brave men channelling all their anger towards the policeman.

Another result for our enemies that want divisions.

What an utterly ridiculous comment!!!

The blokes a bloody coward......and I'm saying that with 18 years service as a police officer....nothing keyboard about that!!!

What makes you any different from the "NSC brave men" you like to slag off.....I take it you obviously have a vast experience in this field then?

"Another result for our enemies that want divisions".....seriously mate, are you for bloody real?.....And who the hell are 'our enemies'?

darkwolf666 · Oct 19, 2018

Big G said:
Yes, especially the 'Police Officers'.....who leave their station and go out without their protective equipment, which they are duty bound to have with them....!

And quite frankly any officer 'moving away'..(cowards).....from a threat... armed with a knife.... when they have CS spray and a baton.. and lets not forget a duty to protect life and lim......should have their ability to be a police officer seriously questioned....regardless of rank!

I might take your comments a bit more seriously if you could learn to spell the word limb...

As for police officers being “duty bound” to carry their protective equipment that is complete rubbish, as it clearly depends on type of police officer and situation. Also, protective equipment is for the officer, not a MoP, so he had the best possible protective equipment, a car!

The Clamp · Oct 19, 2018

darkwolf666 said:
I might take your comments a bit more seriously if you could learn to spell the word limb...

As for police officers being “duty bound” to carry their protective equipment that is complete rubbish, as it clearly depends on type of police officer and situation. Also, protective equipment is for the officer, not a MoP, so he had the best possible protective equipment, a car!

It's just lower ranks bashing the "desk jockeys". They know deep down they'd have done the same. I have never been a copper, so maybe it's different but I have been in frontline security and protection for over twenty years and currently work in protection at safe houses and it's standard to have a pop at those higher up the pecking order. I have been stabbed 4 times, had a gun pulled on us, been attacked with glass and all kinds of everyday objects.

Myself and my colleagues have a close working relationship with the police and have regularly been in violent situations alongside officers and I'm not sure I'd be so bold as to accuse someone of cowardice unless I was there myself and was part of the dynamic risk assessment, because unless you were, there is really no way to tell. Personally I'd love to have the choice of getting in a car and buggering off from some situations I have been in.

Weststander · Oct 19, 2018

Big G said:
What an utterly ridiculous comment!!!

The blokes a bloody coward......and I'm saying that with 18 years service as a police officer....nothing keyboard about that!!!

What makes you any different from the "NSC brave men" you like to slag off.....I take it you obviously have a vast experience in this field then?

"Another result for our enemies that want divisions".....seriously mate, are you for bloody real?.....And who the hell are 'our enemies'?

Come on then, let’s all hear your view on the uniformed officers running away from the murderer. All well documented in the Inquest. Source: Police witnesses.

Are they “Bloody cowards” too?

Big G · Oct 19, 2018

darkwolf666 said:
I might take your comments a bit more seriously if you could learn to spell the word limb...

As for police officers being “duty bound” to carry their protective equipment that is complete rubbish, as it clearly depends on type of police officer and situation. Also, protective equipment is for the officer, not a MoP, so he had the best possible protective equipment, a car!

c

Whilst I respect people have differing views on issues like this... but please know you are wrong!
For 5 years of my service I was a Conflict Resolution Instructor....teaching officers how to use the protective equipment!
'Every' officer, regardless of rank has to re-certify on their protective equipment every year...Fact!
'Every' officer, regardless of their role has to re-certify on their protective equipment every year...Fact!
This is mandatory and part of a police officers terms and conditions...Fact!
Officers are taught that the protective equipment is for their, the publics and their colleagues protection...Fact!

Like I said, my point of view is based on actually doing the job and being a police conflict trainer....whats yours?

Big G · Oct 19, 2018

Weststander said:
Come on then, let’s all hear your view on the uniformed officers running away from the murderer. All well documented in the Inquest. Source: Police witnesses.

Are they “Bloody cowards” too?

Yes they are!....and need to be stuck on for neglect of duty!

Weststander · Oct 19, 2018

Big G said:
Yes they are!....and need to be stuck on for neglect of duty!

Ending this on a friendly note, you have my total respect for your 18 years as a policeman. Dealing with with the vermin of society spitting and trying to attack you, whilst protecting the public. I know a few retired and serving policemen (mainly through sitting next to them as fellow season ticket holders at Withdean and The Amex); all good people.

Big G · Oct 19, 2018

The Clamp said:
It's just lower ranks bashing the "desk jockeys". They know deep down they'd have done the same. I have never been a copper, so maybe it's different but I have been in frontline security and protection for over twenty years and currently work in protection at safe houses and it's standard to have a pop at those higher up the pecking order. I have been stabbed 4 times, had a gun pulled on us, been attacked with glass and all kinds of everyday objects.

Myself and my colleagues have a close working relationship with the police and have regularly been in violent situations alongside officers and I'm not sure I'd be so bold as to accuse someone of cowardice unless I was there myself and was part of the dynamic risk assessment, because unless you were, there is really no way to tell. Personally I'd love to have the choice of getting in a car and buggering off from some situations I have been in.

Whilst your experience in the security sector has its similarities with the type of incidents you may have dealt with as a police officer and sounds like you've been through your fair share of shit....but this argument is about the blatant disregard for the safety of the public and colleagues by officers who think they don't need to bother to carry protective equipment because they mainly work in an office.....my point is that any police officer regardless of rank or role is still a police officer and is 'supposedly' duty bound by the oath they took to protect life and limb.....and lets have it right...I've worked with senior ranking officers who mainly drive a desk but will still have their equipment with them whilst out and get stuck in when needed!....so its not bashing the desk jockeys thing!

The Clamp · Oct 19, 2018

Big G said:
Whilst your experience in the security sector has its similarities with the type of incidents you may have dealt with as a police officer and sounds like you've been through your fair share of shit....but this argument is about the blatant disregard for the safety of the public and colleagues by officers who think they don't need to bother to carry protective equipment because they mainly work in an office.....my point is that any police officer regardless of rank or role is still a police officer and is 'supposedly' duty bound by the oath they took to protect life and limb.....and lets have it right...I've worked with senior ranking officers who mainly drive a desk but will still have their equipment with them whilst out and get stuck in when needed!....so its not bashing the desk jockeys thing!

Thank you for a reasoned response, rare on here these days. To be fair, I see both sides of this argument. and what I'm mainly saying is I wouldn't be in a position to call it cowardice unless I was part of the debrief and review or if I was on the scene at the time of the incident. Either way, he will never come out of this looking good. I know coppers have long memories!!
Have a nice weekend

darkwolf666 · Oct 19, 2018

Big G said:
c

Whilst I respect people have differing views on issues like this... but please know you are wrong!
For 5 years of my service I was a Conflict Resolution Instructor....teaching officers how to use the protective equipment!
'Every' officer, regardless of rank has to re-certify on their protective equipment every year...Fact!
'Every' officer, regardless of their role has to re-certify on their protective equipment every year...Fact!
This is mandatory and part of a police officers terms and conditions...Fact!
Officers are taught that the protective equipment is for their, the publics and their colleagues protection...Fact!

Like I said, my point of view is based on actually doing the job and being a police conflict trainer....whats yours?

Sorry, not playing your game of Top Trumps, just safe to say I spent 7 years with The Met. I don’t contest any of your facts, but still quibble about the bit you decided to leave out about ALL officers being duty bound to carry their protective equipment at ALL times.

Big G · Oct 19, 2018

Weststander said:
Ending this on a friendly note, you have my total respect for your 18 years as a policeman. Dealing with with the vermin of society spitting and trying to attack you, whilst protecting the public. I know a few retired and serving policemen (mainly through sitting next to them as fellow season ticket holders at Withdean and The Amex); all good people.

Thanks mate...appreciate that!

afcb · Oct 19, 2018

The Clamp said:
It's just lower ranks bashing the "desk jockeys". They know deep down they'd have done the same. I have never been a copper, so maybe it's different but I have been in frontline security and protection for over twenty years and currently work in protection at safe houses and it's standard to have a pop at those higher up the pecking order. I have been stabbed 4 times, had a gun pulled on us, been attacked with glass and all kinds of everyday objects.

Myself and my colleagues have a close working relationship with the police and have regularly been in violent situations alongside officers and I'm not sure I'd be so bold as to accuse someone of cowardice unless I was there myself and was part of the dynamic risk assessment, because unless you were, there is really no way to tell. Personally I'd love to have the choice of getting in a car and buggering off from some situations I have been in.

I thought as much in you saying you've never been a copper. There never was a choice of getting in a car and buggering off from some or any situations and if there was I don't know anyone who would have taken it despite the fact you claim you would have loved to. ...that instinct never crossed my mind.

If you want to play knock down bingo then crack on.....my guess is you're a doorman or something.

Big G · Oct 19, 2018

darkwolf666 said:
Sorry, not playing your game of Top Trumps, just safe to say I spent 7 years with The Met. I don’t contest any of your facts, but still quibble about the bit you decided to leave out about ALL officers being duty bound to carry their protective equipment at ALL times.

Trust me mate, It's not a game of top trumps for me!!
And as you did the job.. you will know damn well why every officer has a yearly refresher for PPE then

....if it wasn't a mandatory requirement, why would every officer have to do it...regardless of their role??
My whole point and what really pisses me of is the acceptance that officers carrying out non front line roles are in some way exempt from carrying PPE....bottom line is they're not....but its just become accepted...and this whole argument started because he used the excuse that he didn't have any protective equipment with him.......its a simple answer....'Are you a Police Officer on duty or not'?.....If you are, then you act professional enough and abide by the rules to have everything with you to carry out your duty as a police officer!

Big G · Oct 19, 2018

darkwolf666 said:
Sorry, not playing your game of Top Trumps, just safe to say I spent 7 years with The Met. I don’t contest any of your facts, but still quibble about the bit you decided to leave out about ALL officers being duty bound to carry their protective equipment at ALL times.

And now I'm curious....Spent 7 years with the Met!

In what role?

Weststander · Oct 19, 2018

Still gutted about the error (admitted at the Inquest) in not having heavily armed officers with Keith Palmer.

The evil piece of shit would almost certainly have been slain the moment he advanced with weopons.

The only positive, what a wake up call for the Met, Government and Parliament. This is a war; prepare as such.

darkwolf666 · Oct 19, 2018

Big G said:
Trust me mate, It's not a game of top trumps for me!!
And as you did the job.. you will know damn well why every officer has a yearly refresher for PPE then....if it wasn't a mandatory requirement, why would every officer have to do it...regardless of their role??
My whole point and what really pisses me of is the acceptance that officers carrying out non front line roles are in some way exempt from carrying PPE....bottom line is they're not....but its just become accepted...and this whole argument started because he used the excuse that he didn't have any protective equipment with him.......its a simple answer....'Are you a Police Officer on duty or not'?.....If you are, then you act professional enough and abide by the rules to have everything with you to carry out your duty as a police officer!

Im not going to argue semantics with you, but Knowing how to use your PPE is not the same as having to carry it.

I cannot recall any of my senior ranking officers routinely carrying their PPE save for the riots in Croydon.

Only Mr Mackey knows how he will live with the choices he made that day, but all this talk of sticking him on is just frankly infantile.

darkwolf666 · Oct 19, 2018

Big G said:
And now I'm curious....Spent 7 years with the Met!

In what role?

Tea boy!

Weststander · Oct 19, 2018

darkwolf666 said:
Tea boy!

I thought you were going to reveal yourself as ex Met Commissioner Sir ...... .

The Clamp · Oct 19, 2018

afcb said:
I thought as much in you saying you've never been a copper. There never was a choice of getting in a car and buggering off from some or any situations and if there was I don't know anyone who would have taken it despite the fact you claim you would have loved to. ...that instinct never crossed my mind.

If you want to play knock down bingo then crack on.....my guess is you're a doorman or something.

No I’m not a doorman and I’ve never buggered off from a situation in my career . It’s not an option (well on some jobs it is), especially with the amount of time it takes your mob to rock up ;-) And I never claimed to be a copper. I work in protection and safeguarding (people not property) but I’m not getting into a willy waving contest with you and certainly not going into much more detail than that on here.

If you don’t want anyone else’s opinion on matters probably best you avoid this board because you’re gonna see a lot of differing opinions. My opinion is, I wasn't there so I cannot say. However, if he was in a car with someone who was charged with protecting him, then that someone discharged their duty admirably.

I have a lot of the respect for the police, there have been times when seeing them turn up has been like the cavalry arriving. But my guess is you weren't personally there during the incident and you weren't part of the debriefing or the review so i'm afraid that makes your take on the matter an opinion and not fact.

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