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  1. #41
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    Stories like this are so depressing, more depressing is how we haven’t moved that far in the intervening years. Why when it’s England? Why does football’s reputation continually get dragged through the dirt like this?

    Lots of reasons, some of them complex to do with class, our island mentality and insecurity of post war decline …. But I think the single biggest one is that when football (as opposed to fans of other countries or rugby) fans get too drunk and step out of line, the moderate football lovers who witness it, me included, don’t do enough to self-police and tell them to get back into line.

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    • #42
      Members Baker lite's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Ernest View Post
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      Pub landlady died
      Landlady of the Regency if I remember rightly?
      It’s a sad fact that We really are a nation nasty pricks when things don’t go as We’d like.
    • #43
      Chrissy Hughton Fanboy Guinness Boy's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by blue-shifted View Post
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      Stories like this are so depressing, more depressing is how we haven’t moved that far in the intervening years. Why when it’s England? Why does football’s reputation continually get dragged through the dirt like this?

      Lots of reasons, some of them complex to do with class, our island mentality and insecurity of post war decline …. But I think the single biggest one is that when football (as opposed to fans of other countries or rugby) fans get too drunk and step out of line, the moderate football lovers who witness it, me included, don’t do enough to self-police and tell them to get back into line.
      Firstly it got dragged through the dirt in 1990. Nothing (much) has happened this year. A couple of daft bints on an ambulance and some beer shower injuries but no riots. That *could* change tonight of course but we don't know for sure that it will.

      But for me the answer is that it isn't really a football problem at all, It's all about our culture with alcohol and the fact that expectations get raised sky high by the media and we're whipped in to the sort of herd mentality that had the Doris I saw this morning driving along yelling "3 Lions" out of her car window, tunelessly. We build and we build and evetually the bubble pops to mix a metaphor. No one rioted after we lost to Iceland. We just accepted that we were shit and Roy was shit. THAT was football. Quietly going about your business in the full knowledge that a team you expected to let you down had done so. THIS is so much more. People who don't often go to games, people who'd never heard of Harry Maguire suddenly getting revved up by The Sun and BBC news and tanked up on shit lager and acting like group morons. And, as per my previous post on this thread I don't know that I wouldn't have done the same when I was that age.

      Danny Baker once wrote a brilliant article for the old Sky magazine (not the media company) after the Luton v Millwall battles arguing that there was no real thing as football violence.There was football, sure, and violence. But there was pub violence and domestic violence and gang violence and chip shop violence and taxi rank violence. Football is just another catalyst and the reason it's football and not rugby or tiddlywinks or polo is that football is wildely popular and more so with the young working class.
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    • #44
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      Unfortunately a series of bad landlords at my local have allowed the place to be overrun with chavvy, underage drinkers so, although formerly a good football pub it was mantal in there v Sweden and even worse after as they stopped cars in the streets, rocking them and shouting through the windows ampng other pathetic behaviour. I shall slink along to The Buck, much better.
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    • #45
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      Quote Originally Posted by Guinness Boy View Post
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      Firstly it got dragged through the dirt in 1990. Nothing (much) has happened this year. A couple of daft bints on an ambulance and some beer shower injuries but no riots. That *could* change tonight of course but we don't know for sure that it will.

      But for me the answer is that it isn't really a football problem at all, It's all about our culture with alcohol and the fact that expectations get raised sky high by the media and we're whipped in to the sort of herd mentality that had the Doris I saw this morning driving along yelling "3 Lions" out of her car window, tunelessly. We build and we build and evetually the bubble pops to mix a metaphor. No one rioted after we lost to Iceland. We just accepted that we were shit and Roy was shit. THAT was football. Quietly going about your business in the full knowledge that a team you expected to let you down had done so. THIS is so much more. People who don't often go to games, people who'd never heard of Harry Maguire suddenly getting revved up by The Sun and BBC news and tanked up on shit lager and acting like group morons. And, as per my previous post on this thread I don't know that I wouldn't have done the same when I was that age.

      Danny Baker once wrote a brilliant article for the old Sky magazine (not the media company) after the Luton v Millwall battles arguing that there was no real thing as football violence.There was football, sure, and violence. But there was pub violence and domestic violence and gang violence and chip shop violence and taxi rank violence. Football is just another catalyst and the reason it's football and not rugby or tiddlywinks or polo is that football is wildely popular and more so with the young working class.
      I disagree. While I think that football fans get unfairly labelled there clearly is such a thing as football violence and saying there isn't is as ridiculous as saying all fans are hooligans.
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    • #46

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      Jesus Christ we are in a World Cup semi final and this thread is full of miserable old ******** moaning at how nasty the country gets when we get deep into a tournament.

      Down some nasty lager. Sing 10 German bombers. Set fire to a corner shop.

      It's Coming Home enjoy yourselves.
    • #47
      Chrissy Hughton Fanboy Guinness Boy's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by The Clamp View Post
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      I disagree. While I think that football fans get unfairly labelled there clearly is such a thing as football violence and saying there isn't is as ridiculous as saying all fans are hooligans.
      You perhaps missed the nuance of the no real thing as football violence. In any case I'm paraphrasing from an old Danny Baker article that's never been digitised. What he was getting at is that people seek to blame football when it is violence that is the problem. That young males of a certain disposition, especially when tanked up, would kick off with a different excuse had football never been invented.

      Obviously at the time there was trouble at and after games - one of the reasons we only took 2-300 on the road. I've seen aggro in a good few grief holes from Gillingham and Selhurst to Chesterfield via Birmingham but the only time I got really injured in the 90s was when some prick headbutted me in The Event on a Tuesday night for no reason at all, outside the football season.
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    • #48
      Absolutely Sheeboed Tom Hark, Preston Park's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by The Kid Frankie View Post
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      Down some nasty lager. Sing 10 German bombers. Set fire to a corner shop.

      It's Coming Home enjoy yourselves.
      Jeez!

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    • #49
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      Quote Originally Posted by Guinness Boy View Post
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      You perhaps missed the nuance of the no real thing as football violence. In any case I'm paraphrasing from an old Danny Baker article that's never been digitised. What he was getting at is that people seek to blame football when it is violence that is the problem. That young males of a certain disposition, especially when tanked up, would kick off with a different excuse had football never been invented.

      Obviously at the time there was trouble at and after games - one of the reasons we only took 2-300 on the road. I've seen aggro in a good few grief holes from Gillingham and Selhurst to Chesterfield via Birmingham but the only time I got really injured in the 90s was when some prick headbutted me in The Event on a Tuesday night for no reason at all, outside the football season.
      No, I got the nuance. And I got the source.
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    • #50
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      Quote Originally Posted by brakespear View Post
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      It's a bit of a state though when that sort of precaution has to be taken by anyone just to avoid running into the wrong person. Kind of takes the nice off a bit
      If it keeps the Scotch indoors then all is fine with the world.
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