[Sussex] A27 Route Decision Delayed .... again!

Stat Brother · May 11, 2018

Triggaaar said:
So for those who use the route a lot, was this the worst part of the journey, and how much difference would you expect it to make?

And in comparison, how much difference would a Worthing bypass make?

Papa Lazarou said:
Getting through / round Arundel can take a VERY long time, with the tailbacks at Crossbush heading West (can be 15 - 20 minutes, and sometimes worse), at the roundabout just past the railway station (all the way down the hill sometimes) and on the old bypass in the lead up to the roundabout over the bridge. The whole thing can easily add half an hour to the journey.

Coming the other way, we often get stuck coming down the hill past the White Swan just after switch from dual to single carriageway.

What happens generally is the locals go through Arundel to avoid the snarl ups and in turn snarl up both roundabouts as they try and rejoin. The same happens on the West bound at Crossbush as cars fly up the inside lane, as if to turn left to LA, but try and nip in later on, or even accelerate after the lights and nip in front of the cars turning right.

To your other question - we still need a bypass for Worthing, as the section up to each roundabout (Offington and Grove Lodge) snarls up under even moderate traffic, and Lions Farm also produces its own long tailback often to Grove Lodge. Chi can also add 30 mins onto a West bound journey, with most Sat Navs now directing people back through the City to avoid it.

Not to mention those waiting to get out of Littlehampton (why wouldn't you) can have an equal wait South to North before Crossbush.
That in turn puts pressure on the A259, but even then there's no way out as the coast traffic still gets hit at Chi or Worthing.

I always find West to East, through Arundel is quicker, but that's mainly because there's one set to traffic lights less.

By 2023 they'll probably be another 10,000+ homes built on the River Arun flood plains around Littlehampton (what could possibly go wrong) and another bypass will be needed.

Papa Lazarou · May 11, 2018

Stat Brother said:
Not to mention those waiting to get out of Littlehampton (why wouldn't you) can have an equal wait South to North before Crossbush.
That in turn puts pressure on the A259, but even then there's no way out as the coast traffic still gets hit at Chi or Worthing.

I always find West to East, through Arundel is quicker, but that's mainly because there's one set to traffic lights less.

By 2023 they'll probably be another 10,000+ homes built on the River Arun flood plains around Littlehampton (what could possibly go wrong) and another bypass will be needed.

The traffic coming north from LA to Crossbush gets stuck for 2 reasons....

1. The cars cutting in at the lights cause the junction to be blocked even after the lights have changes, allowing only a few cars through from the south.
2. Some cars fly up the left, turn left and then turn round in the McDonalds and rejoin the queue there.

Papa Lazarou · May 11, 2018

Stat Brother said:
By 2023 they'll probably be another 10,000+ homes built on the River Arun flood plains around Littlehampton (what could possibly go wrong) and another bypass will be needed.

Build a road over the Channel? (following the coast)

Stat Brother · May 11, 2018

Getting to the AMEX and/or Mill Road from the coast, I don't go on the A27 until Shoreham fly-over.
Preferring to go over the 27 at Angmering, up the 24, and right at Washington.

Djmiles · May 11, 2018

Definitely good news, and will save most 15 minutes off of a rush hour commute. Only problem is they’ll just be more queuing traffic either side at Chichester and Arundel as a result.

Step in the right direction, but an actual working bypass at Chichester and some sort of solution for Worthing is now needed.

banjo · May 11, 2018

2 year wait. By then they’ll have to draw up new plans.

Seagull73 · May 11, 2018

GooGull said:
There were proposals recently for improvements to the A27 from Bedingham to Polegate which would cost millions but still leave the road as a single carriageway. You couldn’t make it up

That's just a joke. Anybody who uses the road going West in the morning and East in the evening will tell you that most of that road is now seriously over capacity. Even Beddingham is starting to become a snarling point in the mornings, despite the bridge over the railway.

I did, however, see a concession somewhere that, actually, there is almost universal agreement (apart from Norman sodding Baker) that a dual-carriageway is now a must on that part of the A27.

Deleted member 2719 · May 11, 2018

That's great news, can we now sort out Chichester and Worthing.

Probably be able to get to the Amex in half the time.

hans kraay fan club · May 11, 2018

Doing just Arundel is a total and utter waste of time. It will not save a single minute of anybody's journey. The same volume of cars will still be travelling along there and will just reach the next bottleneck quicker and concertina there. Driving East you'll slog through / round Chichester, sail round the swanky new Arundel bypass then queue for 30 minutes at Hill Barn / Broadwater / Lyons Farm (instead of 15 mins at Arundel and 15 minutes there).

Completely pointless. Fontwell > Amberley > Storrington > Steyning will continue to be the route of choice.

Djmiles · May 11, 2018

Mustafa said:
Some of the A27 improvements in planning for Worthing & Lancing are looking good.

They include (from East to West):

- Scrapping the Manor Road, Lancing roundabout in favour of lights and sliproads. Image

- Extra lane at Lyons farm junction and new traffic arrangements: Image

- Extra lane at the Grove Lodge roundabout: Image

- Scrapping the Findon roundabout in favour of traffic lights and slip roads and closing off Goodwood Road. Image

My only concern with that, is that it isn’t clear whether the stretch from Broadwater roundabout to the Argos/Toby Carvery will remain 1 lane or be widened. No point in dualing everything else if you’re going to have a 800m stretch or single carriageway.

Papa Lazarou · May 11, 2018

Mustafa said:
Some of the A27 improvements in planning for Worthing & Lancing are looking good.

They include (from East to West):

- Scrapping the Manor Road, Lancing roundabout in favour of lights and sliproads. Image

- Extra lane at Lyons farm junction and new traffic arrangements: Image

- Extra lane at the Grove Lodge roundabout: Image

- Scrapping the Findon roundabout in favour of traffic lights and slip roads and closing off Goodwood Road. Image

It really needs a bypass.... but slip roads will help the general flow on the A27, but it doesn't seem very future-proof.

I know cars are evil currently, so shouldn't be encouraged, but in the not too distant future most cars will be either hybrid, electric or hydrogen fuel cell vehicles, and driving will be a pollution free (eventually) activity.

Djmiles · May 11, 2018

Papa Lazarou said:
It really needs a bypass.... but slip roads will help the general flow on the A27, but it doesn't seem very future-proof.

I know cars are evil currently, so shouldn't be encouraged, but in the not too distant future most cars will be either hybrid, electric or hydrogen fuel cell vehicles, and driving will be a pollution free (eventually) activity.

Unfortunately we are in a climate of patching up existing roads for a quick fix, as opposed to thinking about it long term. Sure it will help, but in 20 years time when there are another 10-20% more cars on the road, we’ll be in the same position.

Spiros · May 11, 2018

Mustafa said:
Some of the A27 improvements in planning for Worthing & Lancing are looking good.

They include (from East to West):

- Scrapping the Manor Road, Lancing roundabout in favour of lights and sliproads. Image

- Extra lane at Lyons farm junction and new traffic arrangements: Image

- Extra lane at the Grove Lodge roundabout: Image

- Scrapping the Findon roundabout in favour of traffic lights and slip roads and closing off Goodwood Road. Image

Sorry but have to disagree. I went to the consultation thingy they held in Worthing about these and even the most optimistic Highways England estimates are that they'll cut 2 minutes off the journey across Worthing. When you've already been held up on that road for 45 minutes at rush hour what difference does 2 minutes make?

The whole 'solution' is a cheap cop-out to look like they're doing something and will cost significantly less than the bypass Arundel is getting. If the A27 is going to move through/round Worthing it needs uninterrupted dual carriageway with flyovers/underpasses to provide proper junctions - not just turning existing non-functional roundabouts into equally non-functional traffic lights at a cost of ££10s of millions.

Seagull73 · May 11, 2018

Spiros said:
Sorry but have to disagree. I went to the consultation thingy they held in Worthing about these and even the most optimistic Highways England estimates are that they'll cut 2 minutes off the journey across Worthing. When you've already been held up on that road for 45 minutes at rush hour what difference does 2 minutes make?

The whole 'solution' is a cheap cop-out to look like they're doing something and will cost significantly less than the bypass Arundel is getting. If the A27 is going to move through/round Worthing it needs uninterrupted dual carriageway with flyovers/underpasses to provide proper junctions - not just turning existing non-functional roundabouts into equally non-functional traffic lights at a cost of ££10s of millions.

I absolutely agree - those proposals are nothing more than a cheap cop-out. Lancing, Worthing, Arundel AND Chichester need new road solutions, as well as Lewes to Polegate. It is unacceptable that the major trunk road along the south coast is held back by Nimbyism and cheap cost-cutting scheme's. Sod all this nonsense about public transport - people will always take to their cars, and the sooner that people get to grips with this quicker we can get much needed development of our roads.

happypig · May 11, 2018

Seagull73 said:
That's just a joke. Anybody who uses the road going West in the morning and East in the evening will tell you that most of that road is now seriously over capacity. Even Beddingham is starting to become a snarling point in the mornings, despite the bridge over the railway.

I did, however, see a concession somewhere that, actually, there is almost universal agreement (apart from Norman sodding Baker) that a dual-carriageway is now a must on that part of the A27.

Thankfully Baker has gone and won't return. His contribution to the A27 overcrowding between Lewes and Polegate was to have a couple of signs put up saying "Eastbourne to Lewes 20 minutes by train". Which is grand if you want to go from somewhere near the station to somewhere else near the other station at the time a train is running and are guaranteed a seat, otherwise it's a completely vacuous statement; I can get from my house to the place I work sometimes in Freshfield Road in about an hour, by public transport it's at least 35 minutes longer.

Peter Grummit · May 11, 2018

Djmiles said:
Unfortunately we are in a climate of patching up existing roads for a quick fix, as opposed to thinking about it long term. Sure it will help, but in 20 years time when there are another 10-20% more cars on the road, we’ll be in the same position.

Things not quite as simple as you suggest. This evidence published today is worth a look: http://www.demand.ac.uk/wp-content/...avelDemand_infographic.pdf?platform=hootsuite

In particular, young people are driving later in life and less: the car isn't seen as the status symbol it once was.

Network effects are really important for the A27. For example, there are options that HE are consulting on for a new (potentially dualled) alignment of the A27 between the A26/A27 junction and Polegate. But the bottleneck is at the Southerham roundabout eastbound in the PM in particular, which wouldn't be helped by dualling further east and may actually suck more traffic in. That roundabout is elevated above the railway and the River Ouse so is very difficult/expensive to solve. It's also within the National Park which makes it more difficult.

Weststander · May 11, 2018

Changing single lanes to dual, will see the end of Honda Jazz's bringing the A27 through Worthing to their snail's pace.

Stat Brother · May 11, 2018

Weststander said:
Changing single lanes to dual, will see the end of Honda Jazz's bringing the A27 through Worthing to their snail's pace.

More road space does not equal better traffic flow.

Weststander · May 11, 2018

Stat Brother said:
More road space does not equal better traffic flow.

Drivers can finally overtake the old codger driving at half the limit?

I’m a Brightonian, so as someone more local to the various Arundel and Worthing proposals, [MENTION=435]Stat Brother[/MENTION], what’s your personal take on transport solutions for your part of the world? (Other than everyone having to get cycling :smile:

) .

Stat Brother · May 11, 2018

Weststander said:
Drivers can finally overtake the old codger driving at half the limit?

I’m a Brightonian, so as someone more local to the various Arundel and Worthing proposals, [MENTION=435]Stat Brother[/MENTION], what’s your personal take on transport solutions for your part of the world? (Other than everyone having to get cycling ) .

That's the problem, there is only one answer and sadly that's the one we'll never have, that being a fully integrated transport policy.

More roads, bigger roads, straighter roads :shrug:

just isn't the answer.

I guarantee when this 10 lane highway was opened in LA congestion was going to be a thing of the past:-

Cars need to be one option, not the only option for all people.

21st Century City on Twitter @urbanthoughts11 as the title suggests mainly concentrates on getting traffic out of places like Worthing, but he does use plenty of images to prove just how beneficial to everyone (except the Government) getting people out of cars would be:-

The current solution to the Chichester, Arundel & Worthing logjam, ie more roads is the most temporary of temporary sticking plaster.
The only way people currently passing their driving test won't be screaming for (in this case) the widening of the Arundel/Binsted by-pass, during their driving lifetime, will be because cars and/or roads have become all but obsolete.

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[Sussex] A27 Route Decision Delayed .... again!

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