[Albion] Javier Hernandez

Sussexscots · Jan 11, 2018

West Ham the wrong fit for him and Moyes doesn't fancy him anyway so not surprised a move is being talked about.

I like him. International goalscorer, quick and knows where the goal is. Massive caveat is that he's not a striker that can hold the ball up on his own. Arguably his best years were at Man United when he had Rooney as a 10 behind him. Can't see he fits our style of play and apart from the cost, think it would be a big risk to restructure our whole playing style at this stage of the season.

hart's shirt · Jan 11, 2018

Dale Jasper said:
Is that a crodonilson original? Cos that is impressive

Not quite. Or at least, I hope not.

Taybha · Jan 11, 2018

Wages are not a issue , he's just too short .

Machiavelli · Jan 11, 2018

Marshy said:
Can't play up top on his own are my initial thoughts before thinking that he earns at least twice out top earner... its a no thanks from me

He's played most of his career up top on his own, so I'll dispute this. Such a player needs to have at least three of the following: pace, goalscoring ability, movement, strength. Hernandez has certainly got the first three of those.

Machiavelli · Jan 11, 2018

sussex_guy2k2 said:
No. Javier Hernandez is excellent at what he does, but what he does does not suit our style in any way, shape or form. And at that money and with his age, I just do not see it happening at all.

I don't see it happening, but I think he'd fit our style perfectly. At present, opposition defences can really push up high closing down the space in the middle of the pitch and in our half, because neither of our central attacking players (whether Murray, Hemed or Gross) has the pace to outrun their defence (our wide players do, especially Izquierdo, but then they're rarely that high up the pitch). What a quick player like Hernandez will do, will force opponents' defence to play with a deeper line, which will grant Gross more space to pick out a 'key' pass.

Marshy · Jan 11, 2018

Machiavelli said:
He's played most of his career up top on his own, so I'll dispute this. Such a player needs to have at least three of the following: pace, goalscoring ability, movement, strength. Hernandez has certainly got the first three of those.

Really ..... I just don't recall him playing that type of role... I bow to your knowledge if that's the case

Milano · Jan 11, 2018

Machiavelli said:
I don't see it happening, but I think he'd fit our style perfectly. At present, opposition defences can really push up high closing down the space in the middle of the pitch and in our half, because neither of our central attacking players (whether Murray, Hemed or Gross) has the pace to outrun their defence (our wide players do, especially Izquierdo, but then they're rarely that high up the pitch). What a quick player like Hernandez will do, will force opponents' defence to play with a deeper line, which will grant Gross more space to pick out a 'key' pass.

Which is the impact Baldock had on Monday, neither Murray nor Hemed would have made anything of Kayal’s through ball.

Machiavelli · Jan 11, 2018

Milano said:
Which is the impact Baldock had on Monday, neither Murray nor Hemed would have made anything of Kayal’s through ball.

Oh, I agree with this, but I really don't want to be relying on Baldock playing up-top on his own in the PL. He's neither enough of a sniffer nor a natural finisher (as that opportunity demonstrated), and he lacks the strength to play up-top on his own. Hernandez's movement and finishing is superior to Baldock.
And, related to this, I just don't see CH departing too much from the 4-5-1/4-4-1-1 script in the PL.

redoubtable seagull · Jan 11, 2018

Sky said he was on £115k pw! There’s no way we’d be paying that in our first season of PL football.

GT49er · Jan 11, 2018

Stat Brother said:
All the club needs to do is find a striker who .....................

- Sees The Albion as a stepping stone to a 'big 6' move.

Piece of piss there must be hundreds of these fellas, out there.

The difficulty there may lie with finding one with the intelligence to realise that........cough: playing for Celtic.....?

OSRGull · Jan 11, 2018

I find it hilarious people are saying they would turn down Javier Hernandez signing for us, utter ridiculous.

We won’t even show interest due to wage demand and they will not want to loan him to a rival club either.

OzMike · Jan 12, 2018

Blue moon tonight is it ?

Megazone · Jan 12, 2018

Hernandez is turning 30 this year. I would rather us splash the cash on someone with potential rather than the opposite. Hernandez reminds me of Michael Owen. He has a good goal scoring record, likes to play off the shoulder chasing through balls and pouncing on any rebounds. The problem with Hernandez, like Owen, is when the pace starts letting him down, his whole style of play goes completely out of the window and then he'll become an injury plagued, static, non effective center-forward. Just how Owen ended up.

BadFish · Jan 12, 2018

BensGrandad said:
Ings or Solankie on loan from Liverpool?

good shout, or Origi on loan from Liverpool

Psychobilly freakout · Jan 12, 2018

The only sensible option considering his wages and the possibility of relegation is a loan.

Machiavelli · Jan 12, 2018

Megazone said:
Hernandez is turning 30 this year. I would rather us splash the cash on someone with potential rather than the opposite. Hernandez reminds me of Michael Owen. He has a good goal scoring record, likes to play off the shoulder chasing through balls and pouncing on any rebounds. The problem with Hernandez, like Owen, is when the pace starts letting him down, his whole style of play goes completely out of the window and then he'll become an injury plagued, static, non effective center-forward. Just how Owen ended up.

There's a decent point in here but, in terms of the comparison with Owen, it doesn't quite work. Owen's hamstrings started pinging by the age of about 20 and he suffered from it thereafter. I'm not so sure that this (or anything else) has been an issue with Hernandez.

sussex_guy2k2 · Jan 12, 2018

Machiavelli said:
I don't see it happening, but I think he'd fit our style perfectly. At present, opposition defences can really push up high closing down the space in the middle of the pitch and in our half, because neither of our central attacking players (whether Murray, Hemed or Gross) has the pace to outrun their defence (our wide players do, especially Izquierdo, but then they're rarely that high up the pitch). What a quick player like Hernandez will do, will force opponents' defence to play with a deeper line, which will grant Gross more space to pick out a 'key' pass.

I get the theory, but the reality simply doesn't back up that argument. And that's because Chicharito simply doesn't have enough about his game outside of the penalty box (more about that in a second). The way we're set up with two solid banks of four, often in quite deep positions, means we rely heavily on having someone up top who can bring others into play. Ideally that person would have more pace than Murray or Hemed, but nonetheless we need someone as a focal point up there to make the system work as a unit and to bring the best out of the other players by holding the ball and allowing them to get on it in more advanced positions.

Where a player like Chicharito really thrives is in a side that has more possession than the opposition (Utd and Leverkusen more often than not) rather than a side than concedes possession and looks to break on teams (WHU, and arguably us this season). The reason for this is that he relies too heavily on those around him to create chances for him or to put balls into areas where his superior box movement will allow him to get an edge on slower defenders. In this regard the stats back that up. In his best season for Leverkusen, when they were having over 50% possession per game and having 14 shots per game as a side, he scored 17 league goals. At WHU this season, where they averaged less than 50% and had less than 10 shots per game, he's struggled. In part that's probably because of what Chicharito isn't bringing to the game when others aren't doing the work for him. He averages less than 1 header won per game (so it would take a total style shift for us as our midfield and defenders are used to playing with a target man forward who wins their share of headers) , he's yet to lay on an assist and has less than one key pass per game and he is not that competent as a dribbler (less than 1 completed dribble per two games at WHU). All of these factors show that he's relying heavily on others to do the dirty work for him, and when they don't, he struggles.

What he does excellently is score a good portion of goals for the amount of shots he takes, but if he doesn't fit the system, and consequently he isn't able to occupy defenders and bring our midfield into play as effectively as Hemed or Murray, then in reality he'll get less shots (as he is at WHU) and the whole system will also suffer i.e. there are a lot more negative potential knock on effects of having a less well rounded striker than there are positive knock on effects of having a bit of pace in behind).

Like I said, I get the theory. We want more pace up front to have the option to push defenders back. But that can't come at the expense of a physical forward who is so crucial to our set up and in making those around them better. And especially at £16m and £130k a week.

sussex_guy2k2 · Jan 12, 2018

Machiavelli said:
There's a decent point in here but, in terms of the comparison with Owen, it doesn't quite work. Owen's hamstrings started pinging by the age of about 20 and he suffered from it thereafter. I'm not so sure that this (or anything else) has been an issue with Hernandez.

That plus the fact that Michael Owen was a substantially better striker than Chicharito ever was.

Commander · Jan 12, 2018

OSRGull said:
I find it hilarious people are saying they would turn down Javier Hernandez signing for us, utter ridiculous.

This. Our strikers are Glenn Murray and Tomer Hemed FFS.

Pavilionaire · Jan 12, 2018

Tammy Abraham would have been a perfect fit - if we're going to play one up top with Gross behind then a Dembele or Ighalo-type makes more sense.

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[Albion] Javier Hernandez

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