[Albion] Say what you like about Poyet but he could certainly spot a player

Ninja Elephant · Dec 28, 2017

Publius Ovidius said:
I know...winning all those championships was areal bummer wasnt it.

fancy what a shit manager, turning a magnificent team , really doing well under Slade and Adams and making them absolute relegation candidates....why did we ever get him to join our club? I hated all those wins, those magnificent games with Bobby creaming sides, all those victory parades, hated every minute...as fro bringing in some of these foreign wasters ...it was pathetic

Absolute shit of a manager...should never have been let anywhere near our perfect club.

You know what I really hated? The 4-0 win at Charlton, followed the next week with the 3-0 win at Peterborough. The 8 consecutive wins in March to wrap up promotion with the 4-3 win against Dagenham at Withdean was pretty miserable as well. And let's not forget the St Patrick's Day massacre, that would have been countless more goals without the negative approach.

The Poyet years were incredible, that's remembering history as it was, not how you reflect on it today.

Harry Wilson's tackle · Dec 28, 2017

ROSM said:
This thread wasnt intended to be a pro or anti poyet piece nor to bemoan his passing or gloss over his failings (like you im really enjoying the present) but more about how players he did sign or wanted to sign have progressed very well

I was responding to the posts on the thread rather than the intentions of the OP - sorry. BTW you are going to be extraordinarily busy, rebuking folk for going a bit OT. I salute your indefatigability. :lolol:

Algernon · Dec 28, 2017

ROSM said:
This thread wasnt intended to be a pro or anti poyet piece nor to bemoan his passing or gloss over his failings (like you im really enjoying the present) but more about how players he did sign or wanted to sign have progressed very well

Righty -ho Gus.

Weststander · Dec 28, 2017

Cloughie said:
Poyet cancelled two meetings with Murray to discuss a contract renewal after the season had ended. This led to him signing for Palace. Point the finger elsewhere but Poyet could’ve sorted that out if he’d have really wanted to.

I didn’t point the finger elsewhere, Poyet did.

Poyet didn’t particularly like Murray and didn’t like a player asking for a significant payrise on his lower leagues salary.

NooBHA · Dec 28, 2017

Poyet claimed Brighton had a ''ceiling'' - What he achieved at Brighton was a decent achievement but ultimately it is he who appears to have had a ''ceiling'' - He loses jobs due to conflicts with Owners and Chairmen and Brighton and AEK Athens that we know of so his failure to get on with people seems to be his downfall.

If he can't even get on with Owners of Clubs, managing different types of players will always be a challenge to him. You just need to live in the ''here and now'' - Brighton are in the PL and giving a decent account of themselves and as more transfer windows come and go then the quality of players here will get far better than those mentioned in the OP - And as the players get better then so will the Egos a manager has to deal with and dealing with Big Personalities just doesn't seem to be Poyet's strong point.

ROSM · Dec 28, 2017

Algernon said:
Righty -ho Gus.

Wow thanks a lot. I take that as a compliment
Best go off and get my renminbi changed up

ROSM · Dec 28, 2017

NooBHA said:
Poyet claimed Brighton had a ''ceiling'' - What he achieved at Brighton was a decent achievement but ultimately it is he who appears to have had a ''ceiling'' - He loses jobs due to conflicts with Owners and Chairmen and Brighton and AEK Athens that we know of so his failure to get on with people seems to be his downfall.

If he can't even get on with Owners of Clubs, managing different types of players will always be a challenge to him. You just need to live in the ''here and now'' - Brighton are in the PL and giving a decent account of themselves and as more transfer windows come and go then the quality of players here will get far better than those mentioned in the OP - And as the players get better then so will the Egos a manager has to deal with and dealing with Big Personalities just doesn't seem to be Poyet's strong point.

And whats that got to do with whether he was or wasnt a good judge of a player?

I appreciate for every barnes there is a hoskins and for every buckley there was a harley but whats your view overall on his choices of players?

sir albion · Dec 28, 2017

ROSM said:
I know he is a marmite person but he did seem to be able to see things in players. Granted that he had stephenson and burke helping with player recruitment in the amex era but there are many positives (and clearly well backed by Bloom too)

Ashley Barnes (loan then permanent)
Chris wood (loan)
Bridcutt (came on free but sold for loads)
Calde (legend)
Bruno (legend and cutting it in the prem)
Vokes (loan)
Buckley (granted a record signing but sold on for profit)
Ulloa (huge profit sell on and prem league winner)
And the one that got away...virgil van dijk where the recruitment team didnt agree with poyets view on the player's future value

I may even forgive him for Barndoor Billy, Dobbie and his view on Murray first time round

Barnes was way too shite most of the time
Chris wood was gash but young to be fair
Vokes was gash
Buckley one great season but gash or injury prone
Ulloa great signing along with Calderon and Bruno and bridcutt was great in that defensive position

Bridge was a super loan although we got lucky as he was crocked the whole following season and then retired.

Plenty of positives and plenty of negatives but all in all thank god the **** was sacked as couldn't stand the egotistical idiot.
Most of the time the football bored the fack out of me although you'd get 6 wonderful performances a season that for many overshadowed the dull performances.

NooBHA · Dec 28, 2017

ROSM said:
And whats that got to do with whether he was or wasnt a good judge of a player?

I appreciate for every barnes there is a hoskins and for every buckley there was a harley but whats your view overall on his choices of players?

Being able to work with them is quite conceivably more important than spotting them

NooBHA · Dec 28, 2017

ROSM said:
And whats that got to do with whether he was or wasnt a good judge of a player?

I appreciate for every barnes there is a hoskins and for every buckley there was a harley but whats your view overall on his choices of players?

I think they were decent players at that level but as he began to have to deal with the better players it would have needed to go that next step up then he comes up short.

ROSM · Dec 28, 2017

NooBHA said:
I think they were decent players at that level but as he began to have to deal with the better players it would have needed to go that next step up then he comes up short.

But the fact that so many of his signings have played at premier league level and left us for profit should count for something?

lawros left foot · Dec 28, 2017

Weststander said:
Spot on.

The rapid counter attacking Championship football under CH, with masses of goals and wins, was light years ahead of the slow paced possession based snooze-fest in most Amex games before his arrival.

Do you mean Poyets final season?

5-1 against Barnsley
3-0 against Massive
4-1 against Udders
3-0 against Palace
6-1 against Blackpool
1-3 away to Burnley
3-3 away to Wolves
1-3 away to Ipswich

8 games out of 46 we scored 3 goals or more. Thats a lot of re-written history there

kevo · Dec 28, 2017

...and of course beating Nigel Adkins' Soutampton to the League One title. Those 8 wins out of 8 in March, fantastic stuff. I think his final season saw some of the best football ever played by a Brighton team. We simply outclassed most teams - just sometimes failed to convert dominance into goals mainly because, until we signed Ulloa, we lacked a striker who could regularly find the net. The most ridiculous game was Bolton at home, which we deserved to win about 8-0 but drew 1-1 thanks to a 97th minute equaliser. Talking of the Spanish signings, let's not forget Calde, David, Orlandi and of course Vicente. Vicente in the Championship! Still the best player to ever play for us I reckon. I know Poyet didn't treat him well and he was injured so much, but to even get him to come here was remarkable. I thoroughly enjoyed the Gus years. Yes he wore his heart on his sleeve and could sometimes be a complete dick, but he took us fron league one relegation candidates to verge of the Prem which is a brilliant achievement.

e77 · Dec 28, 2017

I do remember that until Ulloa appeared the common thinking was Poyet had a blind spot signing strikers. With hindsight it perhaps was a blindspot signing strikers who were good out of the box.

Problem is for him then and Hughton now is decent goal scorers are at a premium.

As for Poyet he blotted the copy book with the way he left but he did launch us into the Falmer era. I think he was a great example of the way coaching trends have moved on in the last few years as when he started the Spanish method of keeping possession was all the rage but towards the end it was beginning to look a bit dated and (eventually) Hughton updated the style.

Publius Ovidius · Dec 28, 2017

e77 said:
I do remember that until Ulloa appeared the common thinking was Poyet had a blind spot signing strikers. With hindsight it perhaps was a blindspot signing strikers who were good out of the box.

Problem is for him then and Hughton now is decent goal scorers are at a premium.

As for Poyet he blotted the copy book with the way he left but he did launch us into the Falmer era. I think he was a great example of the way coaching trends have moved on in the last few years as when he started the Spanish method of keeping possession was all the rage but towards the end it was beginning to look a bit dated and (eventually) Hughton updated the style.

to be fair, looking at our football now, we are not a million miles away from the Poyet way.

pass the ball around the back four, holding midfielders and strength in numbers through the middle.

I was watching an FA Cup game the other night , a league 1 side vs a non league side and in the past, i would have expected kick and rush , but everything was all on the ground and there was neat passing between players....our game has changed out of all proportion if you remember back to the days where it was 100 miles and hour with big lumps up front and even bigger psychopaths at the back.

Some would say today's game is more fluent and skillful and there is no doubt that is true....BUT there is also the cynical diving and conning of officials that is rife in our game. remember when we used to sneer at the Italian and Spanish teams who used to dive about and kick the English teams about the field....now our top league is full of those type of players ...tremendously skillful players grant you, but also some real ponys

Stat Brother · Dec 28, 2017

Publius Ovidius said:
to be fair, looking at our football now, we are not a million miles away from the Poyet way.

pass the ball around the back four, holding midfielders and strength in numbers through the middle.

I was watching an FA Cup game the other night , a league 1 side vs a non league side and in the past, i would have expected kick and rush , but everything was all on the ground and there was neat passing between players....our game has changed out of all proportion if you remember back to the days where it was 100 miles and hour with big lumps up front and even bigger psychopaths at the back.

Some would say today's game is more fluent and skillful and there is no doubt that is true....BUT there is also the cynical diving and conning of officials that is rife in our game. remember when we used to sneer at the Italian and Spanish teams who used to dive about and kick the English teams about the field....now our top league is full of those type of players ...tremendously skillful players grant you, but also some real ponys

I'll hazard a guess diving and conning the ref has been a part of the English game now for a similar length of time that it hasn't.

We might not be a million miles away from Poyet's style, but in like for like comparisons it does feel a million miles an hour quicker.

Icy Gull · Dec 28, 2017

Poyet, Bloom and the Albion were a match made in Heaven until Gus decided he deserved better than the Albion. He was very good at getting players to play for him and although he was sometimes too fearful of losing, when his teams hit their stride they were as good as any I’ve ever seen at the Albion. Peterborough and Charlton away remain two of my top ten favourite Albion games.

Publius Ovidius · Dec 28, 2017

Stat Brother said:
I'll hazard a guess diving and conning the ref has been a part of the English game now for a similar length of time that it hasn't.

We might not be a million miles away from Poyet's style, but in like for like comparisons it does feel a million miles an hour quicker.

Sky do one of these " football in the past" type shows and it showed some of the tackles that Keane and Souness were dishing out and there was one where Keane absolutely clattered into Steve McMahon and apart from a few words, he got up somehow and carried on. We all see week in week out players being poleaxed when someone brushes past them and "card waving"...that is the sort of thing I am talking about...I cant really recall in all the 45 years of watching Brighton that happening , certainly not before the last 15 years

Publius Ovidius · Dec 28, 2017

Icy Gull said:
Poyet, Bloom and the Albion were a match made in Heaven until Gus decided he deserved better than the Albion. He was very good at getting players to play for him and although he was sometimes too fearful of losing, when his teams hit their stride they were as good as any I’ve ever seen at the Albion. Peterborough and Charlton away remain two of my top ten favourite Albion games.

Charlton away...I got my ugly mug on the front page of the Telegraph the next day after celebrating when the 3rd Goal went in. Superb day out! and one of the best performances I have ever seen a Brighton team give.

Stat Brother · Dec 28, 2017

Publius Ovidius said:
Sky do one of these " football in the past" type shows and it showed some of the tackles that Keane and Souness were dishing out and there was one where Keane absolutely clattered into Steve McMahon and apart from a few words, he got up somehow and carried on. We all see week in week out players being poleaxed when someone brushes past them and "card waving"...that is the sort of thing I am talking about...I cant really recall in all the 45 years of watching Brighton that happening , certainly not before the last 15 years

My point is (using your numbers):-

After the past 15 years of 'conning', I reckon we probably had 15 years of sneering at Johnny Foreigner and before that x years of They May Take Out Lives, But They Will Never Take Our Freedom violence :lol:

Like you I know which one I prefer, but I just think we're beyond the point of citing that as a recent change to the game.
Sadly it is the game.

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[Albion] Say what you like about Poyet but he could certainly spot a player

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