[Albion] Sean Dyche - slippery as an eel

dsr-burnley · Dec 17, 2017

On that photo Arfield is on the borderline between level and in front, so if you've picked the right split second when the ball was kicked, he may have been offside. But have you picked the right split second? Both players were moving, and even at a slowish walking pace you move about one and a half inches in one twenty-sixth of a second, which I think is the normal camera speed. If you're judging offsides by the inch, as the pundits do, then you really need faster speed cameras. Certainly there's nothing there to prove the lineman wrong.

Isn't the second photo from Arfield's first shot? My apologies if not, but I remember that when the second shot was taken, the one that rebounded to Wood, both your furthest back defenders had retreated a yard. I don't have the pictures any more to check.

PeterOut · Dec 17, 2017

dsr-burnley said:
On that photo Arfield is on the borderline between level and in front, so if you've picked the right split second when the ball was kicked, he may have been offside. But have you picked the right split second? Both players were moving, and even at a slowish walking pace you move about one and a half inches in one twenty-sixth of a second, which I think is the normal camera speed. If you're judging offsides by the inch, as the pundits do, then you really need faster speed cameras. Certainly there's nothing there to prove the lineman wrong.

Isn't the second photo from Arfield's first shot? My apologies if not, but I remember that when the second shot was taken, the one that rebounded to Wood, both your furthest back defenders had retreated a yard. I don't have the pictures any more to check.

You really should change your name to BG - Burnley Grandad

LamieRobertson · Dec 17, 2017

dsr-burnley said:
Does he get credit for not whinging about the non-offside goal, which MOTD also didn't mention? (Incidentally, our fourth "offside" disallowed in the last six matches, two absolutely wrong and two (yesterday included) marginal).

No....it’s not in his nature not to whinge
..don’t get me wrong he’s obviously a very good manager judging by his record with Burnley ..but he is like many managers has defective eyesight when he feels like it...if we got a free kick he started his windmill impression and likewise if you didn’t get one

Acker79 · Dec 17, 2017

With that first picture it is the moment the ball is played through. I made sure with that one because it wasn't a clean hit. And it is not borderline, Arfield's foot is clearly closer to the goal line than Dunk's upper body. There's no doubt he is offside, regardless of running directions or any other irrelevancies you want to try to muddy the decision with.

With the second I was apparently less thorough, just had a quick look at the video again. It would be incredibly harsh to consider both shots separate phases of play, but I would accept that official may. And the second shot, Dunk is still on the floor, and Bong has stepped back closer to the goal and Wood would probably be in line. So the second one tight enough that both sets of supports could argue in their teams' favour, but that first one there should be no debate.

It's not a matter of inches, offside is binary. You're on or you're off. Arfield was offside. The only room for discussion on that is whether Dunk's shoulder is in line with the Centre of Arfield's chest (and thus the gap between his legs), or in line with arfield's left shoulder (his left, not ours as we look at the picture).

Surrey Phil · Dec 17, 2017

Dyche deserves a lot of credit esp as his behaviour is a clever act! He spent the entire game remonstrating with the 4th official (funny how Warnock does it for Cardiff for 5 mins and gets sent off) and with his comments after the game, you wonder if this ultimately influences referees decisions at times. Hemed get’s a 3 match ban (for treading on someone) bet Tarkowski doesn’t for far worse.

dsr-burnley · Dec 17, 2017

Acker79 said:
It's not a matter of inches, offside is binary. You're on or you're off. Arfield was offside. The only room for discussion on that is whether Dunk's shoulder is in line with the Centre of Arfield's chest (and thus the gap between his legs), or in line with arfield's left shoulder (his left, not ours as we look at the picture).

Not true, actually - not in practice. The rules of offside as they are applied are not the same as the rules of deciding the winner of the Olympic 100m. It's not done to the nearest 100th of a second.

If you get two players chasing the ball side by side, more or less level with each other, then the linesman is not expected to decide whether one man's foot is ahead of the other man's upper body. If they're level to the naked eye, then they are level for offside. When TV replay comes in, then the forward will be able to change from offside to onside several times in the course of each stride; until then, "level" is not decided by inches. If TV replay had been in for this one, then the decision wouldn't have been overturned; but on another day with another linesman (an no TV replay) it would have stood.

luppers · Dec 18, 2017

Not Andy Naylor said:
Me too. He's much cleverer (and funnier) than he comes across on TV.

And me as well

nicko31 · Dec 18, 2017

Ernest said:
Just a fatter and rougher version of SMUG Eddie

Who can't clear his throat

brightn'ove · Dec 18, 2017

Motogull said:
Jose's tumble was worse than Niasse's so I fear he'll get some time off.

You only get banned for successfully deceiving the referee.

Simster · Dec 18, 2017

Ernest said:
Just a fatter and rougher version of SMUG Eddie

Not really, and you could probably ask any Burnley fan for confirmation of that - Dyche took over from Howe's bang-averageness and turned them into what they are now. Got them up, then relegated, then up again, then stayed up and now FIFTH. That's consistent, constant improvement on what is clearly a low budget.

On the other hand, Smug Eddie basks in the glory of his "miracle" which is nothing of the sort, owing to the fact he's spent absolutely MILLIONS.

PILTDOWN MAN · Dec 18, 2017

studio150 said:
Don't think either will be looked at. The elbow wasnt to the head so would have only got a yellow.

Izquierdo was just doing an impression of the 3rd best player in the world and didn't con the ref.

...

Gazz15 · Dec 18, 2017

Thunder Bolt said:
Quote Originally Posted by Gazz15 View Post
I guess he also feels that 'cheating' is not important, ie Pope's ludicrous delays taking goal kicks or free kicks. So why he having a go at Izquierdo I don't know?

Exactly the same as Ryan did at Wembley. The Spurs fans were booing every kick he took because of it. We cannot point the finger at other teams.

That is the point, it is a disease that has been allowed to creep into English football. Grant for Stoke, Forster for Southampton all are doing it.

All keepers should be booked immediately for this time wasting, Ryan, Pope and the rest.........we as the paying fans £30 - £70 per match are being cheated as a whole, for value for money! It needs stamping out.

Baldseagull · Dec 18, 2017

GT49er said:
If MOTD had kicked up half the fuss about Tarkowski's elbow as they did about Hemed's 'stamp' he would be out fro three matches. For some reason they went easy on Burnley and instead concentrated on Jose's ridiculous but harmless drive. Tossers!

MOTD made nothing of the Hemed "stamp", it was Sky that did for him.

hans kraay fan club · Dec 18, 2017

dsr-burnley said:
On that photo Arfield is on the borderline between level and in front, so if you've picked the right split second when the ball was kicked, he may have been offside. But have you picked the right split second? Both players were moving, and even at a slowish walking pace you move about one and a half inches in one twenty-sixth of a second, which I think is the normal camera speed. If you're judging offsides by the inch, as the pundits do, then you really need faster speed cameras. Certainly there's nothing there to prove the lineman wrong.

Isn't the second photo from Arfield's first shot? My apologies if not, but I remember that when the second shot was taken, the one that rebounded to Wood, both your furthest back defenders had retreated a yard. I don't have the pictures any more to check.

You've seemed a fairly sensible sort, in the past, but you're sounding a bit of a myopic idiot here.

That incident was very clearly (just :shrug:

) offside - little point in arguing black is white.

Are you going to argue that your other disallowed goal, was further anti-Burnley bias, too? The one when our keeper spilled it into his own net under minimal contact from Ashley Barnes...

Thunder Bolt · Dec 18, 2017

hans kraay fan club said:
Are you going to argue that your other disallowed goal, was further anti-Burnley bias, too? The one when our keeper spilled it into his own net under minimal contact from Ashley Barnes...

I had to chuckle at that, once I knew Ryan wasn't injured. Duffy got his own back twice, by flattening Ashley when they both jumped for a header. Ashley didn't whinge about it either.

Bozza · Dec 18, 2017

dsr-burnley said:
Not true, actually - not in practice. The rules of offside as they are applied are not the same as the rules of deciding the winner of the Olympic 100m. It's not done to the nearest 100th of a second.

If you get two players chasing the ball side by side, more or less level with each other, then the linesman is not expected to decide whether one man's foot is ahead of the other man's upper body. If they're level to the naked eye, then they are level for offside. When TV replay comes in, then the forward will be able to change from offside to onside several times in the course of each stride; until then, "level" is not decided by inches. If TV replay had been in for this one, then the decision wouldn't have been overturned; but on another day with another linesman (an no TV replay) it would have stood.

More importantly, who will play for you when Tarkowski takes his three game break?

dsr-burnley · Dec 18, 2017

hans kraay fan club said:
Are you going to argue that your other disallowed goal, was further anti-Burnley bias, too? The one when our keeper spilled it into his own net under minimal contact from Ashley Barnes...

Your keeper's a tougher man than Murray. I reckon Barnes read the recently revived thread about him being too soft for league football, and decided Ryan was the original poster.

To answer Bozza, Kevin Long is the reserve centre half. He had to play two games when Mee was injured and we kept two clean sheets, so he's a decent reserve.

lancyclaret · Dec 19, 2017

Bozza said:
More importantly, who will play for you when Tarkowski takes his three game break?

Yes, worrying. With Tarkowski out, Huddersfield's big Belgian (Le Poitre?) will fancy his chances of bagging a goal or two when we visit them on December 30. Bad news for us but possibly worse news for teams below the Terriers.

Gazz15 · Dec 20, 2017

Isn't Lowton due back soon? Plus ward?

AmexRuislip · Feb 25, 2018

The Breen

Sean Dyche :shrug:

Just thought they kinda sounded alike!

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[Albion] Sean Dyche - slippery as an eel

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