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[Albion] Palace fans: questions they should ask themselves...









Buzzer

Buzzer

Languidly Clinical
Oct 1, 2006
26,121
Return of the Rev said:
Simple fact Brighton fans stormed stadium gates on more than one occasion about 40 years ago and with Palace about 40 years behind why should they not try it? The real shocker was a modern stadium and heavy police presence could not prevent it???
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Because it was a crap thing to do back then. With all the CCTV and mobile phone footage, the embarrassment/anger they've caused to their club and fellow fans and banning orders/prison sentences to follow it's self-inflicted stupidity. It also makes life a lot worse for fans wanting to go to these derby matches in future. Apart from all those reasons, you're spot on - why shouldn't they try it?
 










3

34064 Fighter Command

New member
Jul 24, 2003
2,289
Newbury, Berkshire.
The problem isn't so much what their Ultras brought into the ground, the problem is that such an organised stampede on a turnstile provides a really determined terrorist the once in a lifetime opportunity to get into a crowded area undetected. And that's not a snowflake response, that's a credible modus operandi for a terrorist to enter a packed venue.

At the Stade de France the perp couldn't gain entry through the security cordon so chose to blow himself up outside the ground. Less casualties. It only takes one 'sleeper' to pretend to be a genuine Palace Ultra and they are in the away fan concourse, ready to pull the detonator. Result mass casualties.

Following 7/7 Police made the mistake of shooting Jean Charles de Menenzes at Stockwell under circumstances of trying to jump through a barrier and running from security. Irrespective of the subsequent error that they'd hit the wrong man, and the issue of collateral damage to anyone nearby, a match Commander has to treat such an incident as a potential terror attack in-progress. Armed Police may need to be sent to the entrance. The Westminster Bridge attacker stabbed an unarmed Policeman in the Houses of Parliament entrance, it was only his armed colleague that stopped the perp in his tracks, unfortunately too late. What's to stop a perp using a stampede to cover their entry with a lethal weapon to the away concourse and then let rip on away fans, BHA stewards, Sodexo catering staff, then get through to the seated area and try to get on the pitch. That's why this kind of behaviour is completely unacceptable to any right minded individual. It is bad enough that Police are dragged away from real security threats to cover the match, but to copy terrorist tactics in dress, behaviour and weapons - well it defies comprehension in the current threat climate. Palace fans have to look seriously at why they want to create such disturbances when pulling all Police resource from 40 miles around could leave so many other people, in real need of the emergency services, unprotected.
 
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Not Andy Naylor

Not Andy Naylor

Well-known member
Dec 12, 2007
8,798
Seven Dials
34064 Fighter Command said:
The problem isn't so much what their Ultras brought into the ground, the problem is that such an organised stampede on a turnstile provides a really determined terrorist the once in a lifetime opportunity to get into a crowded area undetected. And that's not a snowflake response, that's a credible modus operandi for a terrorist to enter a packed venue.

At the Stade de France the perp couldn't gain entry through the security cordon so chose to blow himself up outside the ground. Less casualties. It only takes one 'sleeper' to pretend to be a genuine Palace Ultra and they are in the away fan concourse, ready to pull the detonator. Result mass casualties.

Following 7/7 Police made the mistake of shooting Jean Charles de Menenzes at Stockwell under circumstances of trying to jump through a barrier and running from security. Irrespective of the subsequent error that they'd hit the wrong man, and the issue of collateral damage to anyone nearby, a match Commander has to treat such an incident as a potential terror attack in-progress. Armed Police may need to be sent to the entrance. The Westminster Bridge attacker stabbed an unarmed Policeman in the Houses of Parliament entrance, it was only his armed colleague that stopped the perp in his tracks, unfortunately too late. What's to stop a perp using a stampede to cover their entry with a lethal weapon to the away concourse and then let rip on away fans, BHA stewards, Sodexo catering staff, then get through to the seated area and try to get on the pitch. That's why this kind of behaviour is completely unacceptable to any right minded individual. It is bad enough that Police are dragged away from real security threats to cover the match, but to copy terrorist tactics in dress, behaviour and weapons - well it defies comprehension in the current threat climate. Palace fans have to look seriously at why they want to create such disturbances when pulling all Police resource from 40 miles around could leave so many other people, in real need of the emergency services, unprotected.
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So you’re saying that armed police might have to step in and shoot everyone in the away seats if there’s a repeat of last Tuesday’s antics by those children in black who follow cpfc2010 around? Radical but probably the only sensible course of action.
 




3

34064 Fighter Command

New member
Jul 24, 2003
2,289
Newbury, Berkshire.
If it can happen at Stockwell then it can happen anywhere. It only needs a Police commander to have an armed response vehicle in the vicinity and the kind of stampede mentioned (which is not normal at any venue I've attended recently, although it may have happened in the past that is not relevant to the current discussion) for a responsible officer to say ' what's the risk of this being a real incident and I don't take any action '. ' What do I say to the loved ones of those injured / killed knowing that I had a chance to make the decision that might have kept them alive '. His duty isn't to those who stampede, he has to consider what he has to do to minimise a potential disaster, and he may only have 20-30 seconds to make that decision in - no-one knows where or when the next attack might take place, which is why Police cannot afford to 'rank' such behaviour as the actions of a bunch of mindless feckless youth any longer.
 


GT49er

GT49er

Well-known member
Feb 1, 2009
46,720
Gloucester
Not Andy Naylor said:
So you’re saying that armed police might have to step in and shoot everyone in the away seats if there’s a repeat of last Tuesday’s antics by those children in black who follow cpfc2010 around? Radical but probably the only sensible course of action.
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Not to shoot them, of course, but the sight of half a dozen machine guns, primed, cocked and pointed straight at them might just change the mindset of young turds in hoodies thinking they were impregnable and able to do whatever they chose
"I've got a knuckleduster and a knife, mate. What are you going to do abut it? Oh, a machine gun.......errrrmmm.....can I have a minute to rethink?", perhaps?

I'm not actually advocating armed police for this sort of situation - just a sufficient number of OB, properly equipped and trained and willing not to hide somewhere safe behind cameras, ought to be enough to do the trick.
 


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