[Albion] That Footage Of Vermin Breaking Into The Amex...

rippleman · Nov 30, 2017

Bozza said:
I don't know. However, the Palace fans who had been rounded up from the bars down by the seafront and walked to Brighton Station would have been on their way, or close. I would expect that police at the stadium had to be prepared for their arrival and the task of trying to keep the "welcoming committee" away from them as best they could.

On a broader point, I really don't like the general tone of your post, and similar, that just seem to want to try and find fault with the police. Maybe they were at fault - I simply have no idea, so I'm not going to go jumping in trying to point the finger of blame. There will be debriefs and investigations to try and ensure that anything that went wrong doesn't happen again.

I don't go to football wearing a tightly drawn hood and a scarf or balaclava over my face. I don't take weapons. I don't take pyrotechnics. I don't try to get in a ground without a ticket, causing physical harm to those who try to get in my way. Unfortunately some people do, and some people have to try and minimise the impact of them on everyone else.

I have massive amount of respect for those who are tasked with trying to make sure tens of thousands of people can get to the game, and home again, in safety. I'm willing to accept that they may make mistakes because it's a really difficult job on nights like Tuesday. And I wouldn't want to do that job myself - it looks very tough.

But the point of the heaviest police presence I can recall at the Amex was to prevent disorder and in this they failed miserably. I am well aware that all the trouble was started by the scum and that they are ultimately responsible. But we have police at matches to prevent disorder so that those of us who turn up to watch a game of football can do so peaceably and without the dangers that so many faced on Tuesday night.

I am far from being the only poster to be hugely critical of the police and the way they handled the events on Tuesday night but you have singled me out for branding! Thanks for quoting my post though.

Bozza · Nov 30, 2017

rippleman said:
But the point of the heaviest police presence I can recall at the Amex was to prevent disorder and in this they failed miserably. I am well aware that all the trouble was started by the scum and that they are ultimately responsible. But we have police at matches to prevent disorder so that those of us who turn up to watch a game of football can do so peaceably and without the dangers that so many faced on Tuesday night.

I am far from being the only poster to be hugely critical of the police and the way they handled the events on Tuesday night but you have singled me out for branding! Thanks for quoting my post though.

I haven't singled you out. I've posted along the same lines to others and, as I said above, "the general tone of your post, and similar".

Your agenda is very clear, as you have illustrated again with "they failed miserably". Most reports suggest that numerous attempts at disorder were prevented all over the city as well as at the Amex itself.

As I say, I believe it to be a very difficult job and I would guess that significant decisions have to be made in very short order. If I do that in my work and get it wrong, then no one is going to notice. (And please note I am not saying they got it wrong as I have no idea).

For you to be so sure of what you are saying, I can only assume you have significant hands-on knowledge of policing highly volatile crowds, so I shall bow to your superior knowledge and just wish you'd been in charge on Tuesday night.

amexer · Nov 30, 2017

We have played Palace several times and what happened was completely unexpected. Of course Police will look back and think they could have done some things better but from what I saw at Station and Amex they did well. On reflection that small % of scum have only appeared this season and maybe they should have been aware of it. Very easy for me to say all those hiding there idendity when in Brighton should have had to show they had tickets. But what on earth do you do with 80/100 thugs. Thankfully game was not interupted and this was down to the good decision of not going in to try and arrest people and also avoided over crowding by not letting in more supporters.
Unbelievable comment on here that Shit happens

DavidRyder · Nov 30, 2017

AmexRuislip said:
What a bunch of w@nkers, really frightening dressing up in black, like they'll never be recognised. I'm sure some of these scum left their DNA about

And here's one of them with theirs

The Birdman · Nov 30, 2017

AmexRuislip said:
What a bunch of w@nkers, really frightening dressing up in black, like they'll never be recognised. I'm sure some of these scum left their DNA about

Check the sheep for DNA :sheep:

Emperor Tomato Ketchup · Nov 30, 2017

Exile said:
I've not got involved in this stuff, but you've prompted me to wade in. What an absolutely shitty post that is.

Two entirely innocent people, working for a tenner an hour, end up in hospital - one serious enough to be kept in overnight.
More innocent people get assaulted randomly.
Two innocent Palace fans get knocked to the ground, and leave, hurt.
A load of EXPLOSIVE devices are smuggled into the ground and let off, highlighting potential fatal weaknesses in security and terrifying some vunerable fans.
Innocent Palace fans get burned by pyrotechnics and require treatment.
200 hundred or so presumably blameless fans spend a ton of cash on a day out, and get denied access to the game, due to the actions of others.

And your response is that 'shit happens' and if you don't like it, you shouldn't attend.

What a w4nker.

I’m old enough to remember the 70s and 80s at the Goldstone so I have been in the “it’s a bit of an overreaction” camp.

However I think you have summed up the reality of it very well and I take my hat off to you.

Lower West Stander · Nov 30, 2017

Emperor Tomato Ketchup said:
I’m old enough to remember the 70s and 80s at the Goldstone so I have been in the “it’s a bit of an overreaction” camp.

However I think you have summed up the reality of it very well and I take my hat off to you.

I agree too.

The 70s and 80s were a different world in football which no longer exists. In that context what happened looks pretty tame but I think it is a positive that so many on here are in the " let's look to improve and make sure it doesn't happen again" rather than make moronic statement that it isn't important and "shit happens".

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LamieRobertson · Nov 30, 2017

rippleman said:
But the point of the heaviest police presence I can recall at the Amex was to prevent disorder and in this they failed miserably. I am well aware that all the trouble was started by the scum and that they are ultimately responsible. But we have police at matches to prevent disorder so that those of us who turn up to watch a game of football can do so peaceably and without the dangers that so many faced on Tuesday night.

I am far from being the only poster to be hugely critical of the police and the way they handled the events on Tuesday night but you have singled me out for branding! Thanks for quoting my post though.

If we talk about the disorder pre match at the ground ..as far as I am aware it only occurred just before kick off with the vast majority of people in the stadium. If we discount the events at the Palace end of fire crackers etc going off etc then during the match and post match I would say the vast majority of people were not under threat ...that in no way under plays the distraction and concern over what was happening in the Palace stand. The vast majority of the crowd would have only become aware of the morons breaking in after the game.
I would be very surprised if they didn’t look again at the area surrounding the holding back of a large contingent of Palace fans on the ramp up to the railway bridge (as they did successfully when we beat Palace three nil) and then marching them around the stadium when there was a fair number of Brighton fans who had waited for their arrival ..this to my knowledge was the only large flashpoint (excluding flares) of the night..but once again I would stress that at least 95% of fans were in the ground

doogie004 · Nov 30, 2017

Mr Bridger said:
Every clubs has them. The toilets got trashed at Palace last time we played there.

You mean improved surely ?

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Easy 10 · Nov 30, 2017

What time did the police corral the Palace fans from the town centre out of the pubs and into Brighton station ?

Seemed like an awful lot of away fans were still outside right on top of kickoff, when the whole incident at the turnstiles "kicked off". Surely these fans should have been escorted to the station and then the stadium WELL in advance of kickoff. Part of the problem was caused by a large number of fans still being outside when the game had started.

That doesn't excuse or justify what they then went and did, but if the police were cutting it fine getting them into the ground then it was always going to cause a problem.

LamieRobertson · Nov 30, 2017

Easy 10 said:
What time did the police corral the Palace fans from the town centre out of the pubs and into Brighton station ?

Seemed like an awful lot of away fans were still outside right on top of kickoff, when the whole incident at the turnstiles "kicked off". Surely these fans should have been escorted to the station and then the stadium WELL in advance of kickoff. Part of the problem was caused by a large number of fans still being outside when the game had started.

That doesn't excuse or justify what they then went and did, but if the police were cutting it fine getting them into the ground then it was always going to cause a problem.

If they had marched them round the stadium earlier wouldn’t there have been more potential for clashes with home support..my one criticism would be why a group of Brighton fans not being moved on when it was bang on kick off time

Blue Valkyrie · Nov 30, 2017

Easy 10 said:
What time did the police corral the Palace fans from the town centre out of the pubs and into Brighton station ?

Seemed like an awful lot of away fans were still outside right on top of kickoff, when the whole incident at the turnstiles "kicked off". Surely these fans should have been escorted to the station and then the stadium WELL in advance of kickoff. Part of the problem was caused by a large number of fans still being outside when the game had started.

That doesn't excuse or justify what they then went and did, but if the police were cutting it fine getting them into the ground then it was always going to cause a problem.

It's not unimaginable that Southern Fail had a role in that.

3 carriage trains. 1 train full of fans at Brighton having to be de-loaded because it wasn't stopping at Falmer etc.

It was a match that the trains needed to be at the top of their game for.

CPFC G · Nov 30, 2017

Easy 10 said:
What time did the police corral the Palace fans from the town centre out of the pubs and into Brighton station ?

Seemed like an awful lot of away fans were still outside right on top of kickoff, when the whole incident at the turnstiles "kicked off". Surely these fans should have been escorted to the station and then the stadium WELL in advance of kickoff. Part of the problem was caused by a large number of fans still being outside when the game had started.

That doesn't excuse or justify what they then went and did, but if the police were cutting it fine getting them into the ground then it was always going to cause a problem.

18:00 -

Copy and paste from closed palace group on facebook-

I was one of those who was locked out of the game last night. Shocking by the police and the Brighton stewards.
Yes a few got in without tickets but that was down to bad stewarding. The police took everyone on a tour of the back roads of Brighton to get to the station and then held us before getting on and off train. A journey that should have took 20-25 mins took 1 hour 45 mins. Then get told by police we should have got there earlier. No explanation on why they wouldn't let us in then used horses to push us back to station. Was herded around like cattle by police for 4 & half hours.
Even got punched by a copper because the crowd pushed forward and he just laughed in my face.
Then when back at Brighton station they want to put us straight onto train to Croydon when we had hotel in Brighton.
Lost all respect for the police last night.
Palace saying will get refund on tickets but that doesn't include travel costs and hotel costs plus 2 days off work. Yes maybe that was my choice to stay but they should at least pay travel costs in addition to ticket money.
Absolute disgrace.

Easy 10 · Nov 30, 2017

LamieRobertson said:
If they had marched them round the stadium earlier wouldn’t there have been more potential for clashes with home support..my one criticism would be why a group of Brighton fans not being moved on when it was bang on kick off time

There's always going to be home support milling around outside the Amex right up to kickoff particularly midweek (I've been one of them), so I don't see that as being a major factor. We're always told to arrive in plenty of time. Had the police got those fans to the away turnstiles in plenty of time for kickoff there would not have been the urgency to get in.

If there were large numbers of ticketless fans in that group then maybe it wouldn't have made any difference if their plan was always to storm the turnstiles. But surely the police need to be getting them all to the ground as early as poss.

Exile · Nov 30, 2017

CPFC G said:
18:00 -

Copy and paste from closed palace group on facebook-

I was one of those who was locked out of the game last night. Shocking by the police and the Brighton stewards.
Yes a few got in without tickets but that was down to bad stewarding. The police took everyone on a tour of the back roads of Brighton to get to the station and then held us before getting on and off train. A journey that should have took 20-25 mins took 1 hour 45 mins. Then get told by police we should have got there earlier. No explanation on why they wouldn't let us in then used horses to push us back to station. Was herded around like cattle by police for 4 & half hours.
Even got punched by a copper because the crowd pushed forward and he just laughed in my face.
Then when back at Brighton station they want to put us straight onto train to Croydon when we had hotel in Brighton.
Lost all respect for the police last night.
Palace saying will get refund on tickets but that doesn't include travel costs and hotel costs plus 2 days off work. Yes maybe that was my choice to stay but they should at least pay travel costs in addition to ticket money.
Absolute disgrace.

This guy has every right to be pissed off, clearly, but even he - a blameless Palace fan who has been massively ****ed over - STILL repeats this.

Nothing was CAUSED by 'bad stewarding'. The actions or decisions taken by the stewarding team might have failed to stop things that happened, but that is NOT the same as CAUSING them.

Why are all the Palace SO desperate to NOT blame the little shits who travelled without tickets and forced entry? :shrug:

Easy 10 · Nov 30, 2017

Blue Valkyrie said:
It's not unimaginable that Southern Fail had a role in that.

3 carriage trains. 1 train full of fans at Brighton having to be de-loaded because it wasn't stopping at Falmer etc.

It was a match that the trains needed to be at the top of their game for.

No,its certainly not unimaginable. Which is why I'd be interested to know what time the hoards were escorted to the station, as many of them seem to be complaining about being "marched round Brighton for hours beforehand". Given the perpetual clusterfvck that is Southern, you'd think that the police would get them to the station with plenty of time to allow for the potential Southern buffoonery.

Getting them there moments before or just after kickoff was a recipe for aggro.

Publius Ovidius · Nov 30, 2017

CPFC G said:
18:00 -

Copy and paste from closed palace group on facebook-

I was one of those who was locked out of the game last night. Shocking by the police and the Brighton stewards.
Yes a few got in without tickets but that was down to bad stewarding. The police took everyone on a tour of the back roads of Brighton to get to the station and then held us before getting on and off train. A journey that should have took 20-25 mins took 1 hour 45 mins. Then get told by police we should have got there earlier. No explanation on why they wouldn't let us in then used horses to push us back to station. Was herded around like cattle by police for 4 & half hours.
Even got punched by a copper because the crowd pushed forward and he just laughed in my face.
Then when back at Brighton station they want to put us straight onto train to Croydon when we had hotel in Brighton.
Lost all respect for the police last night.
Palace saying will get refund on tickets but that doesn't include travel costs and hotel costs plus 2 days off work. Yes maybe that was my choice to stay but they should at least pay travel costs in addition to ticket money.
Absolute disgrace.

Bad Stewarding? Did you see the video of your fans , yes YOUR fans, forcing their way into the ground...and some of the stewards were from YOUR club. For someone ( I know it wasnt you) to moan that they didn't get in the ground is a bit rich...if YOUR fans hadn't arrived as a mob wanting to fight and cause problems there wouldn't have been any need to kettle you back to the station. We all saw pictures of the tw'ats dressed in black and it was obvious if they didn't have tickets what would happen. Whoever wrote that wants to direct his/her ire at YOUR fans not at the poor sods who had the unenviable task of trying to stop the tw'ats getting intio the ground.....and as being kettled, welcome to our world after the last time we played at Selhurst...ketteled to Norwood Junction, pissed and shitted on by horses and put on trains back to brighton when some of our fans were headed to London!

Easy 10 · Nov 30, 2017

CPFC G said:
18:00 -

Copy and paste from closed palace group on facebook-

I was one of those who was locked out of the game last night. Shocking by the police and the Brighton stewards.
Yes a few got in without tickets but that was down to bad stewarding. The police took everyone on a tour of the back roads of Brighton to get to the station and then held us before getting on and off train. A journey that should have took 20-25 mins took 1 hour 45 mins. Then get told by police we should have got there earlier. No explanation on why they wouldn't let us in then used horses to push us back to station. Was herded around like cattle by police for 4 & half hours.
Even got punched by a copper because the crowd pushed forward and he just laughed in my face.
Then when back at Brighton station they want to put us straight onto train to Croydon when we had hotel in Brighton.
Lost all respect for the police last night.
Palace saying will get refund on tickets but that doesn't include travel costs and hotel costs plus 2 days off work. Yes maybe that was my choice to stay but they should at least pay travel costs in addition to ticket money.
Absolute disgrace.

So they got to the station at 18:00 and were held there ?
I'm not clear why it took 1 hr 45 minutes to get from Brighton station to the Amex, that's nuts.

The Andy Naylor Fan Club · Nov 30, 2017

CPFC G said:
18:00 -

Copy and paste from closed palace group on facebook-

I was one of those who was locked out of the game last night. Shocking by the police and the Brighton stewards.
Yes a few got in without tickets but that was down to bad stewarding. The police took everyone on a tour of the back roads of Brighton to get to the station and then held us before getting on and off train. A journey that should have took 20-25 mins took 1 hour 45 mins. Then get told by police we should have got there earlier. No explanation on why they wouldn't let us in then used horses to push us back to station. Was herded around like cattle by police for 4 & half hours.
Even got punched by a copper because the crowd pushed forward and he just laughed in my face.
Then when back at Brighton station they want to put us straight onto train to Croydon when we had hotel in Brighton.
Lost all respect for the police last night.
Palace saying will get refund on tickets but that doesn't include travel costs and hotel costs plus 2 days off work. Yes maybe that was my choice to stay but they should at least pay travel costs in addition to ticket money.
Absolute disgrace.

Absolutely no different as to how the Met police treat us when we come up to you.

CPFC G · Nov 30, 2017

Exile said:
This guy has every right to be pissed off, clearly, but even he - a blameless Palace fan who has been massively ****ed over - STILL repeats this.

Nothing was CAUSED by 'bad stewarding'. The actions or decisions taken by the stewarding team might have failed to stop things that happened, but that is NOT the same as CAUSING them.

Why are all the Palace SO desperate to NOT blame the little shits who travelled without tickets and forced entry?

CALM DOWN

Easy was asking what time the group was moved from the centre of town to the stadium.This answered it for him. Yes the 50 odd dickheads who went in the fire door where in the wrong, But still shocking policing in my book.

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[Albion] That Footage Of Vermin Breaking Into The Amex...

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