How can Jesse Starkey sign for Gillingham outside the transfer window?

AZ Gull · Sep 15, 2017

Today it has been announced that former Albion development squad midfielder Jesse Starkey has signed a permanent deal with Gillingham until January - GILLS SWOOP FOR STARKEY

According to the Swindon Town website, he was only released from his contract there on September 5th - Starkey Departs Town

September 5th was, of course, after the transfer window shut. I was under the impression that if a player was contracted to a club when the window shut, he wouldn't be able to sign for another club until the next window opened (which was why Dean Cox, released by L. Orient after the window closed, couldn't be registered by Crawley last season until January and had to play at Burgess Hill).

Have the rules changed?

Lawro's Lip · Sep 15, 2017

Gillingham bend the rules again!

BensGrandad · Sep 15, 2017

It may be the same way that Dean Cox signed for Crawley and then went out on loan but trained with them until he was eligible to play in January.

clippedgull · Sep 15, 2017

AZ Gull said:
Today it has been announced that former Albion development squad midfielder Jesse Starkey has signed a permanent deal with Gillingham until January - GILLS SWOOP FOR STARKEY

According to the Swindon Town website, he was only released from his contract there on September 5th - Starkey Departs Town

September 5th was, of course, after the transfer window shut. I was under the impression that if a player was contracted to a club when the window shut, he wouldn't be able to sign for another club until the next window opened (which was why Dean Cox, released by L. Orient after the window closed, couldn't be registered by Crawley last season until January and had to play at Burgess Hill).

Have the rules changed?

In the summer the player and the club decided to terminate his deal and Starkey has now joined the Gills until the new year. Maybe he was terminated before the window closed and they reported it late, like BHAFC do sometimes.

AZ Gull · Sep 15, 2017

clippedgull said:
In the summer the player and the club decided to terminate his deal and Starkey has now joined the Gills until the new year.

I did see that. The only rational explanation would seem to be that his contract was actually terminated before September 1, but it is odd that the club didn't announce it until September 5 if that is the case.

Starkey was certainly still with Swindon Town as of August 1 - REPORT: Chippenham Town 2-3 Swindon Town

AZ Gull · Sep 15, 2017

BensGrandad said:
It may be the same way that Dean Cox signed for Crawley and then went out on loan but trained with them until he was eligible to play in January.

I really should ignore your ramblings, but I'm going to bite. Cox COULDN'T sign for Crawley until the window opened in January; there was obviously an agreement between the player and the club, but he wasn't registered as a Crawley Town player until January 1. He therefore WASN'T on loan at Burgess Hill, as he wasn't contracted to a club from which he could be loaned out.

The article on Gillingham's website specifically states that Starkey is available for their game against Charlton on Saturday.

BensGrandad · Sep 15, 2017

It could well be that by signing until Christmas it given them the chance to look at him before either letting him go or extend his contract whilst giving him the chance to see what they have to offer so a win all round for all concerned.

Just read the last para so obviously he was released before 1st Sept but not announced.

BensGrandad · Sep 15, 2017

AZ Gull said:
I really should ignore your ramblings, but I'm going to bite. Cox COULDN'T sign for Crawley until the window opened in January; there was obviously an agreement between the player and the club, but he wasn't registered as a Crawley Town player until January 1. He therefore WASN'T on loan at Burgess Hill, as he wasn't contracted to a club from which he could be loaned out.

The article on Gillingham's website specifically states that Starkey is available for their game against Charlton on Saturday.

It was reported that he had signed and gone on loan to Burgess Hill but wasnt eligible for registration or to play which is not the same as signing for them, He became a Crawley employee and player.

clippedgull · Sep 15, 2017

AZ Gull said:
I did see that. The only rational explanation would seem to be that his contract was actually terminated before September 1, but it is odd that the club didn't announce it until September 5 if that is the case.

Starkey was certainly still with Swindon Town as of August 1 - REPORT: Chippenham Town 2-3 Swindon Town

Just found this on Swindon Town's forum

Re: The Squad List (Current 2017-18)
« Reply #3049 on: Thursday, August 3, 2017, 17:12:31 »
Jesse Starkey told he can find a new club.

adds to the probability that he was released early but they announced it as an afterthought!

Postman Pat · Sep 15, 2017

AZ Gull said:
I did see that. The only rational explanation would seem to be that his contract was actually terminated before September 1, but it is odd that the club didn't announce it until September 5 if that is the case.

Starkey was certainly still with Swindon Town as of August 1 - REPORT: Chippenham Town 2-3 Swindon Town

From Kent Online:

His contract at Swindon was terminated, however, in the early weeks of the new campaign to allow him to find a new club.

AZ Gull · Sep 15, 2017

clippedgull said:
Just found this on Swindon Town's forum

adds to the probability that he was released early but they announced it as an afterthought!

Postman Pat said:
From Kent Online:

His contract at Swindon was terminated, however, in the early weeks of the new campaign to allow him to find a new club.

That will be it, then.

Joey Jo Jo Jr. Shabadoo · Sep 15, 2017

AZ Gull said:
I really should ignore your ramblings, but I'm going to bite. Cox COULDN'T sign for Crawley until the window opened in January; there was obviously an agreement between the player and the club, but he wasn't registered as a Crawley Town player until January 1. He therefore WASN'T on loan at Burgess Hill, as he wasn't contracted to a club from which he could be loaned out.

The article on Gillingham's website specifically states that Starkey is available for their game against Charlton on Saturday.

Actually BG is correct on this occasion. Dean Cox signed for Crawley and then joined Burgess Hill on loan. You can sign a player at any time but a free agent who leaves his club after the window closes will not be eligible to play for another club until the next window opens.

http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/37351654

http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/37455613

AZ Gull · Sep 15, 2017

Joey Jo Jo Jr. Shabadoo said:
Actually BG is correct on this occasion. Dean Cox signed for Crawley and then joined Burgess Hill on loan. You can sign a player at any time but a free agent who leaves his club after the window closes will not be eligible to play for another club until the next window opens.

He didn't; there was clearly an agreement in place between Cox and Crawley Town, but he couldn't be registered until January 1 2017 (screenshot of the FA Player registration booklet):-

Joey Jo Jo Jr. Shabadoo · Sep 15, 2017

AZ Gull said:
He didn't; there was clearly an agreement in place between Cox and Crawley Town, but he couldn't be registered until January 1 2017 (screenshot of the FA Player registration booklet):-

View attachment 89396

Read the links in my original post, they report Cox as being signed by Crawley but they would loan him out to a non league club as he couldn't play in games until the window re-opened. He was still training with Crawley and an employee of the club even if he wasn't registered to play for them until the window reopened. To actually prevent a player from signing for another club outside of the window would be a restriction of trade. This allows a player to sign for a club and earn a living even if they couldn't play in a game.

Here are more links referring to a loan deal

https://www.crawleytownfc.com/news/2016/september/cox-is-a-red/

https://www.crawleytownfc.com/news/2016/september/cox-joins-burgess-hill/

Don Tmatter · Sep 15, 2017

Coxy was definitely on loan at Burgess Hill so must have been a Crawley player even if ineligible for L2 matches.

Guy Fawkes · Sep 15, 2017

AZ Gull said:
He didn't; there was clearly an agreement in place between Cox and Crawley Town, but he couldn't be registered until January 1 2017 (screenshot of the FA Player registration booklet):-

View attachment 89396

Signed a pre-contract with Crawley which tied him to the club but allowed him to go to BH before it kicked in?

Guy Fawkes · Sep 15, 2017

AZ Gull said:
Today it has been announced that former Albion development squad midfielder Jesse Starkey has signed a permanent deal with Gillingham until January - GILLS SWOOP FOR STARKEY

According to the Swindon Town website, he was only released from his contract there on September 5th - Starkey Departs Town

September 5th was, of course, after the transfer window shut. I was under the impression that if a player was contracted to a club when the window shut, he wouldn't be able to sign for another club until the next window opened (which was why Dean Cox, released by L. Orient after the window closed, couldn't be registered by Crawley last season until January and had to play at Burgess Hill).

Have the rules changed?

Given that he was only 21 at the start of the season, are there different rules about younger players which allow them to join and play for other clubs if let go outside of a transfer window?

Dean Cox was in his late 20s when he was released by Orient

clippedgull said:
Just found this on Swindon Town's forum

adds to the probability that he was released early but they announced it as an afterthought!

Maybe he had been released in August, but had stayed on with Swindon to train as an out of contract player (as players have trained with us when they were out of contract) and then announcement of his leaving on the 5th would still ring true as he didn't actually stop training there until after the window?

AZ Gull · Sep 16, 2017

Joey Jo Jo Jr. Shabadoo said:
Read the links in my original post, they report Cox as being signed by Crawley but they would loan him out to a non league club as he couldn't play in games until the window re-opened. He was still training with Crawley and an employee of the club even if he wasn't registered to play for them until the window reopened. To actually prevent a player from signing for another club outside of the window would be a restriction of trade. This allows a player to sign for a club and earn a living even if they couldn't play in a game.

Here are more links referring to a loan deal

I think we're arguing semantics. Clearly Cox had an agreement with Crawley, and Crawley had an agreement with Burgess Hill (and the player) that suited all three parties. But as Cox couldn't be registered as a Crawley player before January 1, there was also no way they could officially loan him to the Hillians (as they didn't hold his registration until January 1).

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How can Jesse Starkey sign for Gillingham outside the transfer window?

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