When should we panic? - Transfers Activity

Nixonator · Jul 17, 2017

trueblue said:
Agree. We haven't got the firepower to survive. I'd be worried if we don't bring in 2 strikers.

One of those strikers will be a non-squad filler ie. an Izzy Brown (unfortunately)

If we were to bring 2 strikers into the squad, in addition to a CM and a Winger then we would have squad omissions and therefore need to sell one of Skalak, Norwood, Hemed or anyone else considered least likely to excel in top flight.

As someone else suggested, we need very high quality signings in CM, Winger and Striker at the very least. I also think we need 2 of them in before the first game based on Knocky's potential absence.

That is an absolute bare minimum for me. Personally I would look at replacing a couple who I don't think will be able to perform at top flight standard, but happy for them to prove me wrong.

GT49er · Jul 17, 2017

Machiavelli said:
I think we need:
-- a second- or, more likely, third-choice goalkeeper
-- utility defensive cover (Gomez?)
-- CM: need to spend on this
-- a right-footed winger: will need to spend big here too
-- perhaps another ACM (Brown?)
-- two rapid forwards, one of which will have to be a proven goalscorer at PL (or equivalent) level: will really need to break the transfer window on this one

This would mean that, alongside the obvious, we'd be able to offload Skalak and Hemed.

So basically, you just want to replace virtually all of the team that got us promoted............

Weststander · Jul 17, 2017

Nixonator said:
One of those strikers will be a non-squad filler ie. an Izzy Brown (unfortunately)

If we were to bring 2 strikers into the squad, in addition to a CM and a Winger then we would have squad omissions and therefore need to sell one of Skalak, Norwood, Hemed or anyone else considered least likely to excel in top flight.

As someone else suggested, we need very high quality signings in CM, Winger and Striker at the very least. I also think we need 2 of them in before the first game based on Knocky's potential absence.

That is an absolute bare minimum for me. Personally I would look at replacing a couple who I don't think will be able to perform at top flight standard, but happy for them to prove me wrong.

Good post.

Plus I hope we sign a RB, and a CB should Goldson go out on loan.

JimmyJayUK · Jul 17, 2017

Nixonator said:
One of those strikers will be a non-squad filler ie. an Izzy Brown (unfortunately)

If we were to bring 2 strikers into the squad, in addition to a CM and a Winger then we would have squad omissions and therefore need to sell one of Skalak, Norwood, Hemed or anyone else considered least likely to excel in top flight.

As someone else suggested, we need very high quality signings in CM, Winger and Striker at the very least. I also think we need 2 of them in before the first game based on Knocky's potential absence.

That is an absolute bare minimum for me. Personally I would look at replacing a couple who I don't think will be able to perform at top flight standard, but happy for them to prove me wrong.

I hate to say it but if we replace both Skalak and Norwood with real quality we will be fine.

Nixonator · Jul 17, 2017

GT49er said:
So basically, you just want to replace virtually all of the team that got us promoted............

I have no idea how you have reached that conclusion.

To me it looks like he is suggesting replacing Casper, Tomori, Ince, Kaz and Akpom from last season - a 37yo retired GK, 2 incoming loans and 2 outgoing.

+ 2x Striker/ACM, one of whom would replace Towell, who will be going out on loan.

spence · Jul 17, 2017

People saying we need two strikers we don't. Just one quality one is enough

Machiavelli · Jul 17, 2017

Billy the Fish said:
You specifically said we could offload Skalak and Hemed.

Even if we do sign better players in those positions we wouldn't want to sell two internationals, because we'd only have to replace them as well.

I said that we could offload those two if we buy seven new players which would mean that they've already been replaced. Feel free to debate with what I have said.
From your comments to me, your position seems to be that we can survive in the PL with the squad that got us promoted. I think that's wrong.

Machiavelli · Jul 17, 2017

GT49er said:
So basically, you just want to replace virtually all of the team that got us promoted............

You're profoundly wrong, as has already been pointed out.

GT49er · Jul 17, 2017

Nixonator said:
I have no idea how you have reached that conclusion.

To me it looks like he is suggesting replacing Casper, Tomori, Ince, Kaz and Akpom from last season - a 37yo retired GK, 2 incoming loans and 2 outgoing.

+ a Striker/s

No - because those players played virtually no first team minutes between them. We didn't use them in the Championship, so why would we in the PL? - all these lists of players needed floating around would be getting in people to replace our first team players - we wouldn't want to acquire players who are not an improvement.

Nixonator · Jul 17, 2017

GT49er said:
No - because those players played virtually no first team minutes between them. We didn't use them in the Championship, so why would we in the PL? - all these lists of players needed floating around would be getting in people to replace our first team players - we wouldn't want to acquire players who are not an improvement.

Tomori played in 10 games. Akpom played in 10 games and would have been more had we not been lucky with injuries. There is absolutely no doubt we need 2 signings to replace those.

A new CM is potential hard competition for Sidwell/Kayal/Norwood and is a position we already know the club want to strengthen in, as is a potential Winger for Murphy/Skalak/March.

I see this as very far from "..virtually replacing the whole team that got us promoted".

Weststander · Jul 17, 2017

spence said:
People saying we need two strikers we don't. Just one quality one is enough

I'm one of those people.

I think Hughton will only play one upfront this time, and that neither GM, TH or SB will score enough in that lone role as starters to keep us up. So he needs to be a new, younger, fast striker. Should he get injured or banned, we would be back to square one and in serious trouble. Hence the need for a second quality striker.

I understand that's extravagant, but that's what surviving PL clubs do. They have top flight quality cover.

Billy the Fish · Jul 17, 2017

Machiavelli said:
I said that we could offload those two if we buy seven new players which would mean that they've already been replaced. Feel free to debate with what I have said.
From your comments to me, your position seems to be that we can survive in the PL with the squad that got us promoted. I think that's wrong.

That's not my position, I said earlier in the thread that we need to add quality. We'll be relegated if we start the season with what we've currently got.

I just don't understand the talk of getting rid of players when we're struggling to make signings as it is. I see what you mean about the 7 players, I hadn't considered that in my original reply. Fair play if they can go out and sign nearly a whole team that's better than what we currently have, but I don't think that's realistic given how things have gone up to this point.

Weststander · Jul 17, 2017

Billy the Fish said:
That's not my position, I said earlier in the thread that we need to add quality. We'll be relegated if we start the season with what we've currently got.

I just don't understand the talk of getting rid of players when we're struggling to make signings as it is. I see what you mean about the 7 players, I hadn't considered that in my original reply. Fair play if they can go out and sign nearly a whole team that's better than what we currently have, but I don't think that's realistic given how things have gone up to this point.

I don't think anyone would advocate selling Norwood and Skalak for example, until better replacements are signed up.

Sales might occur very late on 1 September. We've all seen live footage of roving Sky reporters standing outside training grounds such as Stoke or Villa on the fateful evening, with Burberry capped feral youth as a backdrop, as Bentley's and Range Rover's whizz past, with last minute signings on board.

Machiavelli · Jul 17, 2017

Billy the Fish said:
That's not my position, I said earlier in the thread that we need to add quality. We'll be relegated if we start the season with what we've currently got.

I just don't understand the talk of getting rid of players when we're struggling to make signings as it is. I see what you mean about the 7 players, I hadn't considered that in my original reply. Fair play if they can go out and sign nearly a whole team that's better than what we currently have, but I don't think that's realistic given how things have gone up to this point.

On that, I suspect you're right. It may well be that we have to regroup in January, and then we'll need to find superior replacements for Hemed and Skalak. I really like Hemed, and he's done wonders for us in two seasons, and is a solid pro, and good team player that's good to have around the squad. My reasoning is that:
-- for most of the season, I suspect we'll play just one up-front
-- he's quite similar to Murray, and Murray will play when that type of forward is required
-- and, as a consequence, he won't get much game time, which is not fair on him.
Skalak has also been great for us but, even in the Championship, he showed himself to have a rather limited repertoire to his game although what he could do, he did very well. Again, I just can't see him getting much game time.

NooBHA · Jul 17, 2017

spence said:
What about in La Liga ? Another top league and he failed miserably at Real Betis. It seems he is only capable of doing ok in the Dutch mickey mouse league. Awful player who can't cut it at the best leagues.

You sort of need to play a system which suits Rick so it really depends on the team he plays in. If you play a system playing weighted balls over the top for him to chase on to him, that's his sort of game. You could see he had potential but his physical stature wasn't strong enough to play the way Norwich played.

He scored a lot of goals in Portugal as well as Holland I think. I don't say he is a superstar but he is a decent striker/footballer

El Presidente · Jul 17, 2017

LamieRobertson said:
I'd agree with the overall gist of your post but bro up for sale? Not sure about that one and they did bring in a fair number of players July/Aug last year..not so sure about there quality though

Boro were on the market, but the deal collapsed!

Seasidesage · Jul 17, 2017

What also surprises me a bit is the development squad? As well as the new signings for the first team, I was expecting a significant upgrade in young promising players coming in from the lower leagues. It's tough getting the right men for the front side and that will not change and obviously you would hope that is the main focus and that we hear some good news soon. But why are not we not addressing the weakenesses of our back up squad? Performances at that level have been less than stellar really and the academy is presumably still a few years from producing much.

Surely our best chance of doing anything long term, depends on buying the right young players before the big boys get in there? Not just in trying to pluck gems from 'lesser' leagues which appears to be our strategy currently. It's not the end of the world as such, but I would've liked to have seen 3 or 4 young lads of potential come in. Thus far it's just the lad from Celtic and that seems a wasted opportunity to me.

We surely have enough resources to do that, but there seems to be little or no focus on that currently. Time will tell I guess but you would've thought that buying from league's 1/2 or whatever would be reasonably straightforward?

sjamesb3466 · Jul 17, 2017

Weststander said:
I'm one of those people.

I think Hughton will only play one upfront this time, and that neither GM, TH or SB will score enough in that lone role as starters to keep us up. So he needs to be a new, younger, fast striker. Should he get injured or banned, we would be back to square one and in serious trouble. Hence the need for a second quality striker.

I understand that's extravagant, but that's what surviving PL clubs do. They have top flight quality cover.

Completely this. Especially when you consider Murray probably only has one (max two) seasons left in him at this level, Hemed isn't good enough in my opinion and whilst Baldocks performances and all round contributions were excellent last season we don't know what he can do at the top level.

Two quality strikers is 100% needed whether we play one up top or two

Bozza · Jul 17, 2017

Seasidesage said:
What also surprises me a bit is the development squad? As well as the new signings for the first team, I was expecting a significant upgrade in young promising players coming in from the lower leagues. It's tough getting the right men for the front side and that will not change and obviously you would hope that is the main focus and that we hear some good news soon. But why are not we not addressing the weakenesses of our back up squad? Performances at that level have been less than stellar really and the academy is presumably still a few years from producing much.

Surely our best chance of doing anything long term, depends on buying the right young players before the big boys get in there? Not just in trying to pluck gems from 'lesser' leagues which appears to be our strategy currently. It's not the end of the world as such, but I would've liked to have seen 3 or 4 young lads of potential come in. Thus far it's just the lad from Celtic and that seems a wasted opportunity to me.

We surely have enough resources to do that, but there seems to be little or no focus on that currently. Time will tell I guess but you would've thought that buying from league's 1/2 or whatever would be reasonably straightforward?

Or Norway: http://www.northstandchat.com/showthread.php?353906-Mathias-Normann

Weststander · Jul 17, 2017

The Complete Badger said:
Goals are the key for a struggling team in the Premier League. We won't be keeping many clean sheets, no team in the bottom half does when you're up against quality attackers every week. So being able to hurt other teams is a must. Sadly I don't think there is a case to be made for any of our current strikers being capable of scoring more than a handful of goals in a Premier League season so we need to focus the budget on this area. We need at least two new strikers and one needs to have some form of track record of scoring goals at a good level. Anything less is just asking for trouble. Even signing one striker would be unacceptable as we need options. Plus you can't pin all your hopes on one man, find he is injured in the first month and then be relying on a 34 year old with minimal top flight experience/success to lead our attack. Even crap teams have good strikers - Watford have Deeney, Palace have Benteke, Swansea have Llorente, Bournemouth have Defoe, West Brom have Rondon etc. That's the level we need to reach. Anyone thinking Glenn Murray or Sam Baldock can do the job is sadly mistaken and we can't take a £120m gamble on them.

This post hits the proverbial nail on the head. Top flight quality strikers (plural) will give us a good chance of staying up.

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