Diane Abbott in fine form this morning...

pastafarian · May 25, 2017

Arundel_Seagull said:
Most are to be fair! Corbyn may be a few things in certain people's eyes, but he's hardly a shit bag is he? He stands by his principles and I honestly think he is what this country is crying out for right now.

Of course he is a shitbag. And he does stand by some horrible principles of his supporters.
His brand of extreme left wing politics has given lip service to IRA supporting, to Hamas and Hezbollah extremist apologists, to haters of Jews.
It’s a fruitcakery of beliefs that borders on the turd mental. He is the Apologist General and not worthy of high office.
The modern world is at war with mental muslims and this country is on the front line to international terrorism, we also enter one of the biggest transitional phases in the history of the country with Brexit and people are saying we should put Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott in charge of all that and the security of Britain. Do me a fracking favour .

#anyonebutcorbyn

pastafarian · May 25, 2017

Neville's Breakfast said:
I think the problem with Labour's costings is the suggestion that it will be the rich who pay for the extra spending. If I thought this would happen they would get my vote. Unfortunately these people and corporations are likely to simply move their
assets and income to a different and more favourable jurisdiction. I know someone who did just that in 1997. Countries such as Ireland and Switzerland are attractive alternatives. The problem is that these are the wealth and job creators. Labour in Government can't touch these people so to pay for their promises they will do as they always do and tax the middle. Now, you might think that middle class house owners are wealthy but the reality in most cases is mortgage to the hilt and families to bring up. These are soft targets for taxation but often have little disposable income. When the media talks about lack of trust in Corbyn it
is not some sort of conspiracy but rather a reflection of a genuine fear felt by those on middle incomes that their family income will be reduced under Labour. There is an enormous amount of financial sacrifice in bringing up a family and this will be the biggest factor in the election.

Its not UK relevant but this critique of the narrative that the rich 1% ers are the root of all evil could easily apply here.
Socialist figures never add up......ever.Worth watching to the end to see the snowflakes full ridiculous arguments.

beorhthelm · May 25, 2017

Plooks said:
I think the mods should remove FAKE and slanderous comments like this. When was the country bankrupt? They have shown how to pay for the policies on their manifesto.

what's false? their manifesto wants to borrow £250bn on nothing specifc other than "infrastructure" with no plan on how or when that might be paid back. their policies may appear costed, but the costings don't stand scrutiny (assume ambitious and immediate tax rises) and then they go and bring forward free tuition at cost of £9bn. that is an example of how they'll run their ministry, just casually spend (borrow) another 10bn here and there. even on their costings they'd increase the deficit (currently reducing) as they retain the current revenue/spending commitments.

Scotchegg · May 25, 2017

beorhthelm said:
what's false? their manifesto wants to borrow £250bn on nothing specifc other than "infrastructure" with no plan on how or when that might be paid back. their policies may appear costed, but the costings don't stand scrutiny (assume ambitious and immediate tax rises) and then they go and bring forward free tuition at cost of £9bn. that is an example of how they'll run their ministry, just casually spend (borrow) another 10bn here and there. even on their costings they'd increase the deficit (currently reducing) as they retain the current revenue/spending commitments.

Ok. So who do we vote for then? The tories have a track record of high borrowing right now and for what?

midnight_rendezvous · May 25, 2017

Buzzer said:
Brilliant deflection. Every single reply from you is "...but the Tories..."

How is putting PFI into context deflecting? I've already said Labour should share responsibility, as should the Tories.

Deleted member 22389 · May 25, 2017

Plooks said:
If every countrt has that attitude high earners will never be made to pay decent levels of tax. We need to take a stand and encourage others to so as well. Then there will be nowhere to run!

I have heard this all before. Labour gave too much away, it's what created this feeling of injustice amongst hard working people we see today and why nobody wants to vote for Labour anymore, me included. We have seen it all over the years, people doing sod all but getting more money in their pocket than you do, whilst you bust your gut and pay for it all.

midnight_rendezvous · May 25, 2017

wellquickwoody said:
So have ANY of those things actually have been PROVEN to have killed UK children? No.

Has Jezza suggested a 'cup of tea and a chat with ISIS'? Yes.

So all those things are ok because they haven't killed children? Child poverty is ok? Evidence shows that children under 5 are more likely to die in the UK than in any other western European country except Malta. Nearly five babies of every 1,000 born in the UK will not live to their fifth birthday. Royal College of Paediatrics and Child Health (RCPCH) and the National Children's Bureau, say that inequalities in our society which leave many families in poverty and deprivation are to blame for this.

The things the right will do to justify themselves.

wellquickwoody · May 25, 2017

midnight_rendezvous said:
So all those things are ok because they haven't killed children? Child poverty is ok? Evidence shows that children under 5 are more likely to die in the UK than in any other western European country except Malta. Nearly five babies of every 1,000 born in the UK will not live to their fifth birthday. Royal College of Paediatrics and Child Health (RCPCH) and the National Children's Bureau, say that inequalities in our society which leave many families in poverty and deprivation are to blame for this.

The things the right will do to justify themselves.

In the first post that I quoted from you, you went on about 'unprecedented cuts in education', you do realise that more money is being spent on education than EVER before?

pastafarian · May 25, 2017

midnight_rendezvous said:
And you've just ignored the fact that OUR government is selling weapons that are killing children.

All weapons kill children.
All international arms sales into countries that have conflict will end up with the unfortunate deaths of kids.

Are you seriously saying we should only have an arms industry that supplies our own troops, put 100s of thousands out of work and no longer have any global sway internationally in persuading how countries conduct themselves militarily?

Thats a serious amount of isolationism

drew · May 25, 2017

pastafarian said:
Its not UK relevant but this critique of the narrative that the rich 1% ers are the root of all evil could easily apply here.
Socialist figures never add up......ever.Worth watching to the end to see the snowflakes full ridiculous arguments.

Wow, seasoned reporter badgers a student.

Neville's Breakfast · May 25, 2017

pastafarian said:
Its not UK relevant but this critique of the narrative that the rich 1% ers are the root of all evil could easily apply here.
Socialist figures never add up......ever.Worth watching to the end to see the snowflakes full ridiculous arguments.

I don't be think the richest 1% are the root of all evil. Indeed, our civilization has benefited enormously from their philanthropy. In order for us to achieve the next step though I think they can contribute more.

Neville's Breakfast · May 25, 2017

Plooks said:
If every countrt has that attitude high earners will never be made to pay decent levels of tax. We need to take a stand and encourage others to so as well. Then there will be nowhere to run!

Unfortunately if we take such a stand then other countries will simply roll out the red carpet. Remember these are wealth and job creators. Unilateralism does not work as someone else simply steps in to the gap.

pastafarian · May 25, 2017

drew said:
Wow, seasoned reporter badgers a student.

wow
student misfit turns up at studio of seasoned informed reporter armed only flawed thinking and gets walloped
on which points was he lying ?

Lower West Stander · May 25, 2017

midnight_rendezvous said:
PFI was introduced by the Tories under John Major. Yes, it was expanded by Tony Blair. But, despite frequently calling for an end to "Labours flawed PFI program" whilst in opposition, in 2011 George Osborne rebranded and continued the PFI gravy train under the "PFI 2" banner.

In your eyes is there anything ever the Labour Party have got wrong?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

drew · May 25, 2017

wellquickwoody said:
In the first post that I quoted from you, you went on about 'unprecedented cuts in education', you do realise that more money is being spent on education than EVER before?

That is a typical tory mantra. You see it at the end of every report into spending whether it be the NHS, education etc etc. 'The Dept for (fill in the blanks) were asked for comment and stated more money is being spent on (fill in the blanks) than ever before.'

It is a pathetic comment. Look at education where less per pupil is being spent so whilst the overall amount might be more, in real terms it is less. In fact, according to the Institute for Fiscal Studies, down by 14% in real terms since 2010!

https://www.ifs.org.uk/publications/8937

They say the same about the NHS but as a percentage of GDP we compare unfavorably with many other countries and, as a percentage of GDP it seems it is going down!

https://www.kingsfund.org.uk/blog/2...nding-compare-health-spending-internationally

What about the Daily Mail mantra then that paints a picture that the country is full of benefit cheats, something that the blue rinse brigade always seem to throw into the mix. Estimated net over payments in 2014/15 were £2.1b.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa.../fraud-and-error-stats-release-fy-2014-15.pdf

Compare that to the rate of uncollected tax which is about £34b.

https://fullfact.org/economy/tax-avoidance-evasion-uk/

That report also shows tax evasion is estimated to be £4.4b (ie, more than we lose in overpaid benefits).

A different report suggests it could be considerably more.

http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2014/09/22/new-report-the-tax-gap-is-119-4-billion-and-rising/

But, hey ho, we are spending more than we ever had before!!!!

drew · May 25, 2017

Lower West Stander said:
In your eyes is there anything ever the Labour Party have got wrong?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't know about MR but most people will accept that every party got something wrong. In hindsight, the Iraq War was wrong, the scale of some of the PFI projects were wrong but there were also things that they got right.

What do you think the Tories have got wrong over the last 7 years?

Neville's Breakfast · May 25, 2017

drew said:
That is a typical tory mantra. You see it at the end of every report into spending whether it be the NHS, education etc etc. 'The Dept for (fill in the blanks) were asked for comment and stated more money is being spent on (fill in the blanks) than ever before.'

It is a pathetic comment. Look at education where less per pupil is being spent so whilst the overall amount might be more, in real terms it is less. In fact, according to the Institute for Fiscal Studies, down by 14% in real terms since 2010!

https://www.ifs.org.uk/publications/8937

They say the same about the NHS but as a percentage of GDP we compare unfavorably with many other countries and, as a percentage of GDP it seems it is going down!

https://www.kingsfund.org.uk/blog/2...nding-compare-health-spending-internationally

What about the Daily Mail mantra then that paints a picture that the country is full of benefit cheats, something that the blue rinse brigade always seem to throw into the mix. Estimated net over payments in 2014/15 were £2.1b.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa.../fraud-and-error-stats-release-fy-2014-15.pdf

Compare that to the rate of uncollected tax which is about £34b.

https://fullfact.org/economy/tax-avoidance-evasion-uk/

That report also shows tax evasion is estimated to be £4.4b (ie, more than we lose in overpaid benefits).

A different report suggests it could be considerably more.

http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2014/09/22/new-report-the-tax-gap-is-119-4-billion-and-rising/

But, hey ho, we are spending more than we ever had before!!!!

So presumably you are saying there are more children than before so spending should be increased accordingly? If there hasn't been any increase in birth rate then is this down to immigration? If so then it is not really a cut in funding but an inevitable consequence of other policies.

drew · May 25, 2017

pastafarian said:
wow
student misfit turns up at studio of seasoned informed reporter armed only flawed thinking and gets walloped
on which points was he lying ?

Where did I say he was lying? He was doing his job, just as Andrew Neil very successfully makes seasoned politicians of all sides look stupid.

drew · May 25, 2017

Neville's Breakfast said:
So presumably you are saying there are more children than before so spending should be increased accordingly? If there hasn't been any increase in birth rate then is this down to immigration? If so then it is not really a cut in funding but an inevitable consequence of other policies.

Have you got a link that shows no increase in the birth rate then?

pastafarian · May 25, 2017

drew said:
Where did I say he was lying? He was doing his job, just as Andrew Neil very successfully makes seasoned politicians of all sides look stupid.

im glad you agree he made her so called facts about the uber rich and the 1% ers look ridiculous
we could use more honesty and not fake news from the ultra left on this issue

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