General Election 2017

JCL666 · May 11, 2017

Weststander said:
Why would HMRC enquire into the affairs of some taxi drivers and hairdressers in the first place?

For smaller businesses they tend to enquire where they have been tipped off or if that smaller business is using a particular model (ir35 and IT contractors for example).

I think the original quote however was referring to the penalties an organisation incurs and how they are not relative to an organisations size. Therefore in comparison a smaller business will get hit harder.

JCL666 · May 11, 2017

Weststander said:
Do you earn between £300 and £900 a day on the project, with 100's of others earning the same.

I think you're asking the wrong question and TBH what I get paid is none of your business.

A better one IMO would be regarding large consultancies and how work from HMRC (or the government generally) is allocated.

Buzzer · May 11, 2017

JCL666 said:
I work on the largest digital project that HMRC have ever undertaken. The budget justification is based on income from avoidance and evasion.

Both you and Prem Sikka could well be right here. Your comment that HMRC's figure of £11bn is a gross over-estimate may be spot on but when you add in the figures that Prem Sikka wants to include, and he claims other countries do include this in their figures, then the combined figure could still be well in excess of £11bn.

Hastings gull · May 11, 2017

GingerBeerMan said:
I honestly haven't got the energy or the hours in the day. You're being deliberately obtuse and you know what Corbyn is proposing is more akin to the models in the Scandinavian countries, rather than communism from Chavez or Mao. If you don't like it, that's fine, keep reading the Telegraph and voting Conservative and I'll keep fighting the good fight for a more equal and just society in which everyone has the same opportunities - no matter what situation they're born into.

And how are you going to do it? Will the parent who has little or interest in their child's education be forced to do so, so that the luvvies can claim "the same opportunities". By all means lets do our utmost to bring about something fairer, but lets not kid ourselves that everyone will have what you want -life just isn't like that. How often do we hear people bang on about us all being equal, and the fact is that we will never be so. If you started again and everyone was given say £100.00 you would have inequality by lunchtime -some would save it and others would blow it on booze.

I think you actually mean a fairer society, rather than an equal one. If you give everyone the same opportunity, you are not necessarily treating them equally. To look at school again - should the brightest pupil be given the same reading book as the slowest - to do so would treat them equally, but hardly fairly.

Hastings gull · May 11, 2017

Wrong-Direction said:
Oh dear, it's so obvious to people with their heads out the clouds that all this going on the one show and strong n stable bollocks is just a farce to make the public think "she's just like us" .
Sadly the majority of the general public are effing idiots and believe it all

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But thankfully we have you to help millions of thick people with sage advice.

Wrong-Direction · May 11, 2017

Hastings gull said:
But thankfully we have you to help millions of thick people with sage advice.

lucky I don't charge eh

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Blue3 · May 11, 2017

Weststander said:
That's a sweeping inaccurate statement.

Millions of Labour and former Labour voters, voted for Brexit. Millions of Tory and former Tory voters, voted for Remain. The UK decided on a single issue. The government, whoever they are, are having to see those wishes through.

Much of the hard left such as Corbyn and certain trade union leaders were luke warm or cold towards the EU for many reasons, such as the drive to the bottom in wages from freedom of movement.

So where's the black and white thinking coming from that the Tories are one and the same as Brexit? It's far more complex than a party political issue.

I supposed entrenched views lead to a lack of research to ascertain the facts.[/QUOTE

It was the Tories that offered the Brexit referendum as a way of wowing the UKIP voters to return to the fold

It is the Tories that are now saying they are prepared for no deal and to just walk away

It is the Tories who are claiming Labours manifesto will take the country back to the 1970s

I was only commenting on these points when I said that the Labour manifesto is the best I have read and it's the Tories who are taking us back to the 1970s

vegster · May 11, 2017

BigGully said:
Surely you would at least offer an argument perhaps that austority isnt actually working anyway or Labour spending promises would accelerate growth and skills etc. which in turn justifies that extra spending and help paying down national debt, but you seem to be saying if we are doing comparitively better than most then why not immediately stop austority as if the current deficit suddenly becomes irrelevent or magically disappears.

As I read it we have to have austerity due to the global recession caused by the last labour government, yet we have the most amazing economy, created by the Tories which is able to fund the record spending on education and the NHS yet still that seems unable to provide both with the funds they actually require ? As for the current deficit, we have been able to print extra money in order to grease the palms of bankers but we can't print extra for the NHS or education. Odd ?
I kept hearing Mrs May at PMQ's saying how only by maintaining a strong vibrant economy can we fund the record amounts paid to the NHS and the education authorities yet these people are saying we are either about to run out of cash or we are going to have to cut the services we provide. Which is right ? we are obviously not having it both ways.

Weststander · May 11, 2017

The printing of money, quantitative easing, enabled the Labour government and the Tories continued the programme, to purchase debt, which prevented the entire banking system collapsing along with savers £100b's.

It was a paper exercise, that did saddle the country with even greater national debt.

No real cash was actually handed out to banks and their directors (pigs at the trough), but it enabled most of the bankers to keep their well paid jobs and do rather nicely from the economic upturn.

Printing £100b's for teacher wage increases and social benefits, would increase the already huge and growing national debt even more, increase the £b's paid each month in interest out of the public purse, downgrade the UK according to the key ratings agencies, markets and the IMF outlook of the UK, and trigger higher inflation.

Scotchegg · May 11, 2017

So the britainelects twitter posted a bunch of polls.. every single poll claimed to support the policies laid out in this manifesto (backing up the notion that they are in fact populist, rather than far left crazy talk).

Final poll however: "which party has the most realistic and well thought through policies? Lab: 31% con: 51%"

So labours big problem is not their policies, because everyone likes those. But.. It is their policies?

:moo:

beorhthelm · May 12, 2017

Scotchegg said:
So labours big problem is not their policies, because everyone likes those. But.. It is their policies?

to interpret, people like individual policies. however they recognise the manifesto, the collection of those policies is not realisitically deliverable.

clapham_gull · May 12, 2017

Much of the hard left such as Corbyn and certain trade union leaders were luke warm or cold towards the EU for many reasons, such as the drive to the bottom in wages from freedom of movement.

Yes with Unions but with left of Labour more to do with the dilution of the sovereignty of parliament.

I stand by my point that I blame Brexit more on the Urban educated liberals (of which I am one) than I do the "right".

Quite happy to take advantage of "capitalism" whilst viewing the EU as a left of centre safety net in case both right wing Tory and New Labour Governments went a "bit too far".

Unfortunately millions got left behind and bit back.

W.C. · May 12, 2017

Scotchegg said:
So the britainelects twitter posted a bunch of polls.. every single poll claimed to support the policies laid out in this manifesto (backing up the notion that they are in fact populist, rather than far left crazy talk).

Final poll however: "which party has the most realistic and well thought through policies? Lab: 31% con: 51%"

So labours big problem is not their policies, because everyone likes those. But.. It is their policies?

Like that Britainelects tweet, this video with rabid socalist Giles Brandreth shows that the policies are popular but as soon as you say it's Labour...
https://www.facebook.com/185180654855189/videos/1541999345839973/?hc_ref=NEWSFEED

Scotchegg · May 12, 2017

beorhthelm said:
to interpret, people like individual policies. however they recognise the manifesto, the collection of those policies is not realisitically deliverable.

Bearing in mind it's just a draft, on Tuesday when it's released for real and fully costed as they say it will be, do you think those numbers would change? I hope so, because otherwise those are seriously depressing results.

Still, lets wait and see how labour are going to cost it for starters. The one thing that we can say for certain however, is that austerity has not worked. Gideon targets slipped back year on year and there's no end in sight. The UN have criticised the tories aggressive austerity policy, poor families are relying on food banks and disabled people have had to cut back on their levels of care to the point where any sort of independent living is increasingly difficult to impossible. Given this, why do people still trust the tories with delivering anything? They know it themselves I think, which is why they've switched the easily digestible sound byte in this election to "strong and stable" and talk only about brexit. They can't realistically tell people that austerity just needs more time, we've been putting up with it for long enough and there's still nothing to show for it.

Right now the choice offered up as I see it are these:

1. The continuation of a bunch of harsh austerity policies that haven't been working.
Or
2. A bunch of policies which sound fantastic that may or may not work out.

It's not much of a choice just yet, at least not until these manifestos are fleshed out, but even at this early stage, is it such a difficult choice?

Deleted member 22389 · May 12, 2017

I think this countries only saviour is to build our manufacturing base again in this country, that would go on to create far better jobs in the future and manufacturing goods in this country keeps the money in this country, everybody wins. Why can't we copy the Chinese model of doing things, pick up a product and manufacture a copycat for this country, without obviously breaking the law. This country imports billions of pounds worth of product from China every year, are we that bad that nobody can get together with some government investment and get things moving again and to start educating people in this country about buying British. I heard a business owner moaning a few months back that his boilers now cost more to import from Germany, so there you go there is already one product we could manufacture and install in all the new properties that we need to build up and down this country.

Scotchegg · May 12, 2017

bashlsdir said:
I think this countries only saviour is to build our manufacturing base again in this country, that would go on to create far better jobs in the future and of course manufacturing goods in your country keeps the money in your country. Why can't we copy the Chinese model of doing things, pick up a product and manufacture a copycat for this country, without obviously breaking the law. This country imports billions of pounds worth of product from China every year, are we that bad that nobody can get together with some government investment and get things moving again and to start educating people in this country about buying British.

Don't disagree with the sentiment at all, however Chinas IP laws are very much "lenient" to say the least. Secondly they shield the public with the great firewall, effectively banning the competition so that Chinese companies can pump out native copycats. Thirdly they have the infrastructure and the work force in place that are willing and able to manufacture at such a competitive rate. Unfortunately I think that ship has sailed, barring niche products.

Fourthly, just for some futuristic discussion, Foxxcon already Automated away 60,000 jobs last year by switching to robots and plan on bringing in millions more next year because they're cheaper than humans. 30% of the workforce gone by 2020 (that's about 400,000 jobs) and full automation is the endgame.

Scotchegg · May 12, 2017

As an aside, question time was fiesty tonight. Big focus on this leak obviously.

heathgate · May 12, 2017

..... lol.... very noble aspirations... an example of populism at its worst. I call that straw clutching, renationalisation?... pointless and unachievable.

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heathgate · May 12, 2017

GingerBeerMan said:
We're the fifth richest country in the world, we can afford these things if the correct level of taxes are set.

Already the top 1% pay 30% of the tax take, not sure how far you can go with that and remain competitive. As for corporation tax, either you want us to have successful and investment attractive industry, or you don't.

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Herr Tubthumper · May 12, 2017

heathgate said:
Already the top 1% pay 30% of the tax take, not sure how far you can go with that and remain competitive. As for corporation tax, either you want us to have successful and investment attractive industry, or you don't.

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22.5% corp tax in Germany. Country seems to be successful and investment attractive. Income tax is generally higher as well. You can go further.

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