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Police Taser 63 year old race group founder in the face.







drew

drew

Drew
Oct 3, 2006
23,050
Burgess Hill
dingodan said:
Actually the proper example involves questions more like "Who are you?", and "Can you prove it?".

In a society with the rule of law, the burden of proof is placed on the accuser, not the accused, and for good reason. We operate under a presumption of innocence, for good reason.

Should Mr I S Innocent be treated as though he is Mr R Biggs, or Mr P Sutcliffe or Mr I Huntley, until such time as he can prove he is not? Giving them his name and possible a bit of id would prove it though.

I understand that we all want bad people to be caught, but we also don't want good people to be treated as though they are bad people.

What would the police have done if this individual had given his name, but had not had any I.D. on him? I don't think they would have taken his word for it, they would have wanted proof. What about cases where a name is not enough? A search of the person? A search of their home? Their bank records? It's a slippery slope if we apply your reasoning, and that is precisely why the law is what it is. This might seem like a simple and easy case, but in the end the difference between the principle of the presumption of innocence vs the presumption of guilt, is the difference between a free society and something else.

A free society may mean that proper police work, investigation, and evidence are required. But that is no bad thing, and you are mistaken if you think it is.
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And Anarchy rules. Simple request for someones name and it's turned into a massive issue. My reasoning was about asking for a name and, so what if you then back it up with a form of id. How does that then escalate into a search of a home (for which I would guess a warrant is required and that would only be given if there were reasonable grounds for it).

As for reasoning, by yours, surely Mr Biggs, Mr Sutcliffe and Mr Huntley should be treated the same as Mr Innocent. And with your reasoning you could get away with any crime by just not revealing your name. A very sorry state of affairs.
 


F

Fungus

Well-known member
NSC Patron
May 21, 2004
7,046
Truro
On a slight tangent, when she fired the Taser, the neighbour was standing very close by, filming.

If the Taser had gone off at a slight tangent, he could have been hit. What are the rules? I can't imagine they would have fired a gun, with bystanders around.
 


dingodan

dingodan

New member
Feb 16, 2011
10,080
From the Met Police web site.

The police officer will ask for your name and address and date of birth. You do not have to give this information if you don't want to, unless the police officer says they are reporting you for an offence.
 


The Clamp

The Clamp

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jan 11, 2016
24,504
West is BEST
NooBHA said:
I would suggest that I am not in the least blinkered - Statistics bear that out. Not once have I seen a white man in their 60s arrested in the street whilst on their own and not once have I seen a white man tasered in the face. You posted the video
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Don't rise to him. He doesn't like anyone suggesting that black people have it tougher than whites. *looks around, whispers from corner of mouth*... I don't think he likes black people very much.

As a teenager I used to get stopped often being of large build with tattoos and a shaven bonce at the time. The variation in policing styles was to be frank, appalling. How people who have undergone the same training and standardised assessments can interpret their role with such disparity is worrying.

Some were polite, some rude, some bored, some accusatory, some nonchalant, some aggressive, some hands on, some ... Well you get the idea. I'm all for a bit of individualism on the job but the police farce need to train their officers more effectively.
 
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GoingUp

GoingUp

Well-known member
Aug 14, 2011
3,585
Sussex By The Sea
This looks like an example of the police been out of their depth, especially that female copper, when faced with someone RIGHTFULLY telling them NO, they seem to have no clue on how to defuse a situation and resort to doing something overly drastic.

Also no one gave a sh!t about that poor dog, it could of run off or been hit by a car! On the flip side the police also ignored it as a threat, had it been vicious dog it could of attacked them for attacking its owner.
 




origigull

origigull

Well-known member
Jun 29, 2009
1,167
It seems to me that the police seem to use the taser as a first resort instead of other less harmful methods first. It was already in the pc's hand at the start of the filming ready to fire, just itching to use it. Just imagine if you were stopped by the police and the taser is right there in their hands, ready to be fired, depending on your answers or not in this case.
 




C

CHAPPERS

DISCO SPENG
Jul 5, 2003
44,772
Bit of movement on this

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...investigation-after-tasering-own-race-adviser

Two police officers involved in an incident in which a race relations adviser was Tasered have been served with gross misconduct notices.

The Independent Police Complaints Commission (IPCC) has told the pair that their conduct is under investigation after Judah Adunbi, 63, was Tasered by police outside his home in Bristol in January when officers apparently mistook him for a wanted man.

The incident was acutely embarrassing as Adunbi has sat on Bristol’s independent advisory group, which is designed to forge links between the police and the community, and has also worked with the Crown Prosecution Service’s local community involvement panel.

Video footage recorded by a neighbour shows police scuffling with Adunbi as he tried to get through the gate of his home in the Easton area. He falls to the ground after a Taser is discharged. Adunbi said later he thought he was going to die.

On Wednesday the IPCC said: “Having carefully considered the evidence gathered so far, the IPCC has served two officers with gross misconduct notices advising them that their conduct is under investigation.

“As part of the investigation, we have conducted house-to-house inquiries, obtained statements from a number of witnesses and collected guidance, procedures and policies over the use of the Taser.

“We have viewed body-worn camera footage worn by the officers involved in the incident, and obtained statements from the officers, along with police logs. The IPCC also held a meeting in Bristol last week with a number of invited community representatives.”

Cindy Butts, an IPCC commissioner, said: “The incident in which Mr Adunbi was Tasered has attracted significant community concern and I am grateful to the representatives for their attendance last week and their honest and frank contributions.

“We would reassure them that we are conducting a thorough investigation into the circumstances surrounding this incident. The investigation is making positive progress and we are continuing to review evidence regarding the appropriateness of Taser use in the circumstances.”

Serving a notice advises an officer or member of police staff that their conduct is subject to investigation – such notices are not judgmental in any way. Avon and Somerset constabulary voluntarily referred the matter to the IPCC.

Adunbi said he feared for his life. “I felt that was it,” he said. “Because of the way I fell back. The way I fell backward on the back of my head. I was just paralysed. I thought that was it. I thought they were taking my life.”
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C

CHAPPERS

DISCO SPENG
Jul 5, 2003
44,772
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...fficer-charged-judah-adunbi-shot-taser-weapon

A police officer is to be charged with assault after one of her force’s race relations advisers was allegedly shot with a Taser electronic weapon.

PC Claire Boddie, 47, has been summonsed to appear before magistrates following an incident in which 63-year-old Judah Adunbi was stopped outside his home in Bristol.

The Independent Police Complaints Commission (IPCC) investigated and sent a file to the Crown Prosecution Service (CPS), which decided there was sufficient evidence to charge the officer.

The IPCC said: “An Avon and Somerset police officer will appear in court to face a charge of common assault contrary to section 39 of the Criminal Justice Act 1988, after an incident in Bristol in which a man was Tasered.

“PC Claire Boddie, 47, has been summonsed to appear at Taunton magistrates court on 14 August. The incident happened in Colston Road, Easton on Saturday 14 January 2017.

“The IPCC began an investigation after the police force voluntarily referred a complaint about the incident, during which a 63-year-old man was Tasered.”

Video footage of the incident appears to show Adunbi falling to the ground outside his home in Easton.

Adunbi has sat on Bristol’s independent advisory group, which forges links between the police and the community, and has also worked with the CPS’s local community involvement panel.

Shortly after the incident he said he had suffered sleepless nights.

Adunbi was taken to the Bristol Royal infirmary by ambulance after the incident. He was initially charged with assaulting a constable and using threatening or abusing behaviour or disorderly behaviour likely to cause harassment, alarm or distress. The charges were later dropped.

An Avon and Somerset police spokesman said: “The IPCC has confirmed that one officer will face a criminal charge of assault following an incident involving a 63-year-old man in Bristol in January.

“Now criminal proceedings have started, this prevents us from commenting further on the circumstances surrounding this matter, other than to reiterate that we’re continuing to fully cooperate with the IPCC as their investigation progresses.

“Chief Constable Andy Marsh has made clear from the start of this investigation that we will discuss the matter fully and publicly once the investigation has concluded.”
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GT49er

GT49er

Well-known member
Feb 1, 2009
46,716
Gloucester
Fair enough. I'm aware that the police often face difficult and challenging situations - situations which I certainly wouldn't like to face! - and have to make split second decisions (without the aid of a video referee) and sometimes get it wrong. Usually, an apology would be appropriate. Having watched the video in this case though, prosecution seems fair enough.
 




McTavish

McTavish

Well-known member
Nov 5, 2014
1,562
First Cindy Butts, then Claire Boddie...I suspect that the judge may turn out to be Caroline Brests.
 


L

luppers

New member
Aug 10, 2008
798
Didim, Turkey
firstly if he is a great assistant to the police why was he being so stroppy from the ouset.The male officer first of all asked his name and he threw a stop straight away.If he had brought his ID out and given his name none of this would have happened. Secondly the police then totally lost the plot despite the neighbour telling them who he was. The female with the tazer did not seem to have a clue what she was doing.In my openion both parties were in the wrong, him for being a stroppy git from the outset, them for not dealing with it in a more apprioprate manner
 


Eeyore

Eeyore

Colonel Hee-Haw of Queen's Park
NSC Patron
Apr 5, 2014
23,533
luppers;8015656[B said:
]firstly if he is a great assistant to the police why was he being so stroppy from the ouset.[/B]The male officer first of all asked his name and he threw a stop straight away.If he had brought his ID out and given his name none of this would have happened. Secondly the police then totally lost the plot despite the neighbour telling them who he was. The female with the tazer did not seem to have a clue what she was doing.In my openion both parties were in the wrong, him for being a stroppy git from the outset, them for not dealing with it in a more apprioprate manner
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This was because he was an innocent man on his way home- and it wasn't the first time. I would have done exactly the same.
 


GT49er

GT49er

Well-known member
Feb 1, 2009
46,716
Gloucester
luppers said:
firstly if he is a great assistant to the police why was he being so stroppy from the ouset.The male officer first of all asked his name and he threw a stop straight away.If he had brought his ID out and given his name none of this would have happened. Secondly the police then totally lost the plot despite the neighbour telling them who he was. The female with the tazer did not seem to have a clue what she was doing.In my openion both parties were in the wrong, him for being a stroppy git from the outset, them for not dealing with it in a more apprioprate manner
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"They" are trained and paid for 'dealing with it in a more appropriate manner' - they didn't. In this case, they weren't just incompetent, they were criminally incompetent. IMHO CPS have got it right.
 






Boys 9d

Boys 9d

Well-known member
Jan 3, 2012
1,794
Lancing
Deleted
 
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