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[Politics] Brexit

If there was a second Brexit referendum how would you vote?

  • Total voters
    1,085


Pavilionaire

Pavilionaire

Well-known member
Jul 7, 2003
30,673
BigGully said:
I really do not mean this with any disrespect, but I cannot get as excited as perhaps you can talking to a guy 24 years ago who is totally irrelevant to todays position
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But it was YOU that asked ME "did you ever expect that pre 2004 that Slovakia, Lithuainia and Slovenia for example would become part of the EU" Hence my answer YES - in 1990!
Like Boris Johnson, you also appear to be forgetting what you've just said.


<For the record, 2016-1990 = 26, correct spelling is Lithuania>
 




Captain Sensible

Captain Sensible

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2003
6,436
Not the real one
pastafarian said:
and i cant believe on the three issues i mentioned you still insist remainers and leavers didnt know the consequences of their vote
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Sorry Pasta, there never was and has still not been a clear view on what leaving and a leaving deal would look like. Claiming that you did know is one thing (although no one could have known because no one does), claiming that millions of others did is another and false.
 


beorhthelm

beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,349
Lincoln Imp said:
Oh come on. Leave supporter after Leave supporter was on here saying that the EU would be absolutely GAGGING to do single market membership deals with us after we left.
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care to find quotes on that. there may be one but it wasnt a common position? or do you mean leavers said the EU would accomodate some agreement, that industry and commercial interests in EU states would lean on the politicans to work something out when we get to the negotiations?
 




Captain Sensible

Captain Sensible

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2003
6,436
Not the real one
Lincoln Imp said:
Oh come on. Leave supporter after Leave supporter was on here saying that the EU would be absolutely GAGGING to do single market membership deals with us after we left. Germany and its automakers would be telling every other member what to do. Claims to the contrary were just more examples of Project Fear.

In the week when the ruling party of Walonia has unstitched the EU Canada deal those claims have to go down as yet more misleading nonsense from the Brexit campaign.
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Yeah, any leaver on question time over the months was using the rhetoric that the EU would 'have' to trade with us. Chris Grayling saying the 30million German jobs rely on the UK car market', springs to mind. Utter BS
 




Pavilionaire

Pavilionaire

Well-known member
Jul 7, 2003
30,673
Hamilton said:
Theresa May can't even make a decision on whether or where we should have a third runway. Doesn't bode that well for future major decisions. Shilly shalling around. Is she up to making tough decisions, or does she just like to sound like she's up to them?
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She's a similar age to what Thatcher was, she owns a pearl necklace and her hair's a bit bouffante. Surely that makes up for it?
 


L

Lincoln Imp

Well-known member
Feb 2, 2009
5,964
beorhthelm said:
care to find quotes on that. there may be one but it wasnt a common position? or do you mean leavers said the EU would accomodate some agreement, that industry and commercial interests in EU states would lean on the politicans to work something out when we get to the negotiations?
Click to expand...
I have to go to a football match now but it was a VERY common line on the NSC Brexit threads and elsewhere. Germany would ensure the important UK market was kept open, and vice versa of course.
 


beorhthelm

beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,349
Captain Sensible said:
Yeah, any leaver on question time over the months was using the rhetoric that the EU would 'have' to trade with us. Chris Grayling saying the 30million German jobs rely on the UK car market', springs to mind. Utter BS
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did he? certainly sounds like bull that he'd say that.
 




L

Lincoln Imp

Well-known member
Feb 2, 2009
5,964
beorhthelm said:
tell you who was very clear about the consequences of voting Leave - the Remain campaign. they made it perfectly clear you cant just vote to leave and expect nothing to change, the benefits of the single market would go. no one can say the public werent informed on the impact of voting to leave.
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Everything from Remain that wasn't sunny good news was dismissed as Project Fear unfortunately. Still happens.
 


beorhthelm

beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,349
Lincoln Imp said:
I have to go to a football match now but it was a VERY common line on the NSC Brexit threads and elsewhere. Germany would ensure the important UK market was kept open, and vice versa of course.
Click to expand...

keeping a market open is not at all the same thing as keeping single market. the general position is we're happy for free trade if they are.

Lincoln Imp said:
Everything from Remain that wasn't sunny good news was dismissed as Project Fear unfortunately. Still happens.
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agree, project fear is still with us unfortunatly.
 






B

BigGully

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2006
7,139
Pavilionaire said:
But it was YOU that asked ME "did you ever expect that pre 2004 that Slovakia, Lithuainia and Slovenia for example would become part of the EU" Hence my answer YES - in 1990!
Like Boris Johnson, you also appear to be forgetting what you've just said.


<For the record, 2016-1990 = 26, correct spelling is Lithuania>
Click to expand...

Yes, yes I did and I acknowledged it and explained that really it didnt offer much in terms of his relevence, but well done to you for talking to an EU bureaucrat , did you get to meet him because of your exemplary spelling, well done you.

I am guessing his insightfulness didnt run to those other issues that you have chosen to ignore and your bestest oldest friend never contemplated.
 


deletebeepbeepbeep

deletebeepbeepbeep

Well-known member
May 12, 2009
20,989
Hamilton said:
Theresa May can't even make a decision on whether or where we should have a third runway. Doesn't bode that well for future major decisions. Shilly shalling around. Is she up to making tough decisions, or does she just like to sound like she's up to them?
Click to expand...

Hadn't realised they kicked the vote down the road for a year - that patch of long grass is getting full.
 


C

cunning fergus

Well-known member
Jan 18, 2009
4,748
Pavilionaire said:
Are you saying that everyone who voted LEAVE was crystal clear that meant exiting the Single Market completely, so REMAIN invented a term to describe a group that doesn't exist?
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You tinker.......

It was the remainers who made it clear what Brexit would mean, and it was out the single market. The choice was always clear.

http://www.politico.eu/article/davi...eu-referendum-vote-june-23-consequences-news/

Soft Brexit is merely the current position for remain as they still want freedom of movement.

Why remainers are not seeking to reform the EU is beyond me............if we could have reform if the EU, we could have border control and the single market.

There is only one group that is being dogmatic.......
 






Herr Tubthumper

Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
59,879
The Fatherland
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-37691270

"Downing Street has said it is "very likely" MPs will be able to vote on the final Brexit agreement reached between the UK and the European Union."

Yet another climb down/u-turn by Theresa May.
 


T

The Rivet

Well-known member
Aug 9, 2011
4,515
Herr Tubthumper said:
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-37691270

"Downing Street has said it is "very likely" MPs will be able to vote on the final Brexit agreement reached between the UK and the European Union."

Yet another climb down/u-turn by Theresa May.
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Only after any potential treaty change. Anyhow bearing in mind the irreversible article 50 will be in force by then what does the vote mean exactly. Just like the actual brexit 'terms', we don't know yet.

Kick off soon anyhow........so maybe back later. Bye.
 


vegster

vegster

Sanity Clause
May 5, 2008
27,922
Green Cross Code Man said:
All of that is incredibly one sided. Unelected prime minister? I am aware that the leader of a party influences the result of an election. However we have NEVER elected a pm. So that's nonsense for a start. The other complaint you have about the 3 stooges as you call them, is simply our government at work, perhaps it's another thing you dislike about democracy, I.e. those in charge carrying out the wishes of the people. As for Europe, what a wonderful institution you describe, you explain all too well how you feel regarding the vindictive nature of the EU and its leaders, I thought we were all friends? It seems that if one of us wishes to go our own way, the rest may well take a dim view and act retributively. That's a great recommendation for the EU isn't it, do as we say or we'll punish you. You also ignore the fact that we won't be saddled by block negotiation for trade deals with countries outside the union.

What do you think of the comments made by Otmar Ossing yesterday? He doesn't paint the bright utopian picture of the EU. In fact no remainers seemed interested in what he had to say. Strange that.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...f-cards-ecb-single-currency-a7364826.html?amp
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May was almost a nobody in the Tory party before Brexit, she is the lucky beneficiary of all the backstabbing and jostling that saw her not so much as the best candidate for PM, just the least worst. As for the Three Stooges, Johnson, Davies and Fox, they had been kept well out of government and were very very small cogs in our democracy. Johnson was Minister without Portfolio and only in Cabinet as Cameron preferred him pissing out of the tent rather than in, Davies had been overwhelmingly rejected by Tory MP's when they chose the as then, unknown David Cameron as PM. Fox was shamed out of government for "financial irregularities " and had to resign for the second time.

This is the calibre of Government ministers taking on the unknown responsibilities for negotiating a " Good " deal from a now pissed off Europe... Somehow we are currently the 5th biggest economy in the world and we can't seem to run a passable rail service, our NHS is failing, today in the news was the failure of mental health services ability to intervene and care for people with serious mental health issues. West Schools have a massive shortfall in budgets that will end up with heads having to merge classes and sack teachers as many TA's have already gone. The list of cuts across all forms of services continues apace, we even have to sponsor our roundabouts as Highways Agency/County Councils can't afford to maintain them or cut the grass. Inflation is just starting to rear its head which will lead to a downturn in growth, possibly a recession, and inevitably a wage freeze.... somehow we have to rebuild trade with far away little places competing with serious industrial nations while cutting ourselves off from our nearest trading partners.. And in our corner we have...
 




Green Cross Code Man

Green Cross Code Man

Wunt be druv
Mar 30, 2006
19,773
Eastbourne
vegster said:
May was almost a nobody in the Tory party before Brexit, she is the lucky beneficiary of all the backstabbing and jostling that saw her not so much as the best candidate for PM, just the least worst. As for the Three Stooges, Johnson, Davies and Fox, they had been kept well out of government and were very very small cogs in our democracy. Johnson was Minister without Portfolio and only in Cabinet as Cameron preferred him pissing out of the tent rather than in, Davies had been overwhelmingly rejected by Tory MP's when they chose the as then, unknown David Cameron as PM. Fox was shamed out of government for "financial irregularities " and had to resign for the second time.

This is the calibre of Government ministers taking on the unknown responsibilities for negotiating a " Good " deal from a now pissed off Europe... Somehow we are currently the 5th biggest economy in the world and we can't seem to run a passable rail service, our NHS is failing, today in the news was the failure of mental health services ability to intervene and care for people with serious mental health issues. West Schools have a massive shortfall in budgets that will end up with heads having to merge classes and sack teachers as many TA's have already gone. The list of cuts across all forms of services continues apace, we even have to sponsor our roundabouts as Highways Agency/County Councils can't afford to maintain them or cut the grass. Inflation is just starting to rear its head which will lead to a downturn in growth, possibly a recession, and inevitably a wage freeze.... somehow we have to rebuild trade with far away little places competing with serious industrial nations while cutting ourselves off from our nearest trading partners.. And in our corner we have...
Click to expand...
When you don't include the EU argument, I agree with much of what you say. I also have very little confidence in our politicians.
 


T

The Rivet

Well-known member
Aug 9, 2011
4,515
vegster said:
May was almost a nobody in the Tory party before Brexit, she is the lucky beneficiary of all the backstabbing and jostling that saw her not so much as the best candidate for PM, just the least worst. As for the Three Stooges, Johnson, Davies and Fox, they had been kept well out of government and were very very small cogs in our democracy. Johnson was Minister without Portfolio and only in Cabinet as Cameron preferred him pissing out of the tent rather than in, Davies had been overwhelmingly rejected by Tory MP's when they chose the as then, unknown David Cameron as PM. Fox was shamed out of government for "financial irregularities " and had to resign for the second time.

This is the calibre of Government ministers taking on the unknown responsibilities for negotiating a " Good " deal from a now pissed off Europe... Somehow we are currently the 5th biggest economy in the world and we can't seem to run a passable rail service, our NHS is failing, today in the news was the failure of mental health services ability to intervene and care for people with serious mental health issues. West Schools have a massive shortfall in budgets that will end up with heads having to merge classes and sack teachers as many TA's have already gone. The list of cuts across all forms of services continues apace, we even have to sponsor our roundabouts as Highways Agency/County Councils can't afford to maintain them or cut the grass. Inflation is just starting to rear its head which will lead to a downturn in growth, possibly a recession, and inevitably a wage freeze.... somehow we have to rebuild trade with far away little places competing with serious industrial nations while cutting ourselves off from our nearest trading partners.. And in our corner we have...
Click to expand...

Your glass half full or empty veggie? You must be very depressed.
 


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