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[Politics] Brexit
- Thread starter KingstonSeagull
- Start date
Blimey. The Business Minister Richard Harrington on No deal/Airbus; "This is a disaster for business. I am very happy to be public about it and very happy if the prime minister decides I am not the right person [to be business minister as a result.]"
from [MENTION=15212]lisa[/MENTION]ocarroll
Government is collapsing
from [MENTION=15212]lisa[/MENTION]ocarroll
Government is collapsing
Agree with a lot of what you've posted. I'd ask you a question - the well stated aim of the EU is ever closer integration. Where do you see this leading ? Obviously as a leaver I see that as a 'United States of Europe' .... a single fedral state. I really can't see where else it could go ?
Garry Nelson's teacher
Well-known member
Thankfully the Faversham Wine lake is fully stocked. I used to do a regular trip to France for vino, but now find that . . . .I can't be arsed, and am well supplied by Majestic.
To be honest, Brexit won't harm me unless there is a catestrophic fail in my fully paid-up pension pot. Once the hoards of European guest worker farm labourers are slung out, it may even encourage some of the tracky bottomed chaves off the late morning train to Sittingbourne in the morning and onto the fields. This will probably be facilitated by the **** up that is universal credit failing to stump up on time for them. And if all this fails, the fields will revert to rough countryside - more places to go for a walk or cycle. Not sure who's going to buy all the rabbit hutch houses that are starting to go up on the main roads out of town, mind. All I need to do now is find something to spunk my money on that means I don't end up with savings and consequently crashing through 100 grand's worth of care home fees in 18 months, like my second cousin has just done, when I can no longer get up the stairs and Mrs Tackle decides she's fed up with my increasingly disgusting geriatric ways in the next 20 years. Alright, next 5 years.
Or maybe I'll find it rather sad to see people suffering in the shambolic aftermath of Brexit. I remember the 'Britain isn't working' posters, deriding the labour government for allowing unemployment to reach the million mark. All the while the plan was to allow unemployment to increase five fold in order to make it easier to 'reform' labour laws. Those people who voted for Maggie in the hope of getting a better chance of a decent job were slightly mislead. However the media successfully blamed it all on the unions. The 'no compromise with the electorate' hard left unwittingly colluded with the process. Then, like now, labour was unelectable. I was living in Canada at the time. I couldn't believe how poor and shitty and mean England had become in the 4 years I was away, when I came back in 86.
Brexit won't harm me in the least, but if I were a betting man, I'd put a few quid on a repeat of the early 80s.....except we no longer have such a buoyant service industry, to bail us out. But at least we will offer, as we did in 86, London as the finance hub of the world, a most favourable economic environment to attract business from the EU - free trade, low taxes, swift access in and out of the country via the ferries and the channel tunnel, a simple tariff system with effectively open borders, and of course masses of nationalised industries to flog off cheap to the aspiring lower middle classes.
Oh.
Garry Nelson's teacher
Well-known member
This is the conclusion of an interesting little piece on the UK's position in the EU with respect to our position on policy initiatives. I think it shows a balanced and nuanced analysis which can be interpreted in a number of ways, depending on your perspective:
[I]In sum: UK on the losing side, but…
In short, the official voting records of the EU Council suggest that there has been a significant shift in the positions on the UK in the Council between 2004-09 and 2009-15. In the latter period the UK government has voted more often against the majority, and is hence now on the losing side more often than any other EU government. There is some variance across policy area, the UK has some powerful allies, and Germany also often votes against the winning majority. Nevertheless, on average, these data suggest that the UK government has often had to accept policy outcomes from the EU for which it did not vote.
Nevertheless, there are some important caveats against inferring too much from this evidence. First, overwhelmingly the Council decides by consensus, as very few votes are taken, and even when votes are taken the UK is on the winning majority side almost 87% of the time.
Second, unlike some other governments, the UK government might be more willing to publicly register its opposition to EU decisions by having its minority vote recorded (for domestic consumption or to signal its opposition to the Commission or the European Parliament for future rounds of negotiations) whereas some other governments might prefer to go along with the majority despite having more serious reservations than the UK.
Third, and related to this point, these data do not tell us what went on behind the scenes on each of these issues, and hence how much the UK disagreed with the majority position when it recorded its opposition – perhaps the UK was on the winning side on all the key issues it really cared about in this period.[/I]
Pavilionaire
Well-known member
- Jul 7, 2003
- 30,590
What a day. Chancellor Phillip Hammond has said a no-deal Brexit would be a "betrayal of the promises that were made" during the 2016 referendum campaign.
But Mr Hammond also said that not leaving the EU "would be seen as a betrayal of that referendum decision".
The People's Vote team have pulled their parliamentary amendment for a Second Referendum because Corbyn hasn't come out and backed it, while Theresa May is sticking to her EU Withdrawal Agreement "Deal" (which isn't a Deal) that got overwhelmingly rejected by the HoC and will be rejected again in 5 days time.
And we have 9 weeks until we leave the EU.
But Mr Hammond also said that not leaving the EU "would be seen as a betrayal of that referendum decision".
The People's Vote team have pulled their parliamentary amendment for a Second Referendum because Corbyn hasn't come out and backed it, while Theresa May is sticking to her EU Withdrawal Agreement "Deal" (which isn't a Deal) that got overwhelmingly rejected by the HoC and will be rejected again in 5 days time.
And we have 9 weeks until we leave the EU.
ManOfSussex
We wunt be druv
Just Tweet back #wouldhavehappenedanyway and she'll be fine.
fanseagull
New member
- Dec 18, 2018
- 228
Anecdotal evidence has no impact on 'no deal Brexit' supporters and others determined to 'seize the moral high ground' to uphold the 4% majority of the 2016 referendum no matter what. Their agenda is everything to them......
Thunder Bolt
Silly old bat
I'd like to think so. I doubt they will.
Blue Valkyrie
Not seen such Bravery!
May is going to keep them voting time after time on her deal as the clock runs down, and more and more details of the *no deal* apocalypse keep coming out.
Then there will be the final vote at the brink of the on-coming storm.
If she loses that then at the last minute it is up to her alone - *no deal* disaster or no brexit.
Then there will be the final vote at the brink of the on-coming storm.
If she loses that then at the last minute it is up to her alone - *no deal* disaster or no brexit.
Thunder Bolt
Silly old bat
[tweet]1088412567251365888[/tweet]
Razzoo
Well-known member
Anthem,flag it's all coming together...
Lincoln Imp
Well-known member
- Feb 2, 2009
- 5,964
British public opinion was in favour of appeasement in the 30s. If there had been a referendum on the matter in, say, 1937 ‘Appeasement’ would presumably have won. And two and a half years later I suppose some people would have been standing on soapboxes proclaiming that Appeasement means Appeasement, that we should turn our back on European involvement. Will of the people and all that.
lawros left foot
Glory hunting since 1969
To be honest now, I don’t want a people’s vote, I don’t want no deal, I don’t want Mays deal, Canada+++, Norway plus, article 50 postponed.
I want a politician, any politician, to stand up and say”This has gone from stupidity, to insanity, I would not be doing my job if I didn’t say, bugger the referendum, we cannot leave.
It is an impossibility to make any kind of Brexit as successful for this country as remaining in the EU would be. Some people may not like the truth in this, but there it is, I wouldn’t stand by and watch a single person self -harm, I’m not prepared to watch a whole country self-harm”
I just hope one of them grows some balls, and stands up to the “ It’s the will of the people” lot.
I want a politician, any politician, to stand up and say”This has gone from stupidity, to insanity, I would not be doing my job if I didn’t say, bugger the referendum, we cannot leave.
It is an impossibility to make any kind of Brexit as successful for this country as remaining in the EU would be. Some people may not like the truth in this, but there it is, I wouldn’t stand by and watch a single person self -harm, I’m not prepared to watch a whole country self-harm”
I just hope one of them grows some balls, and stands up to the “ It’s the will of the people” lot.
dingodan
New member
- Feb 16, 2011
- 10,080
Coming from someone who thinks there'll just be some teething problems that aren't insurmountable if no deal was to happen and we'll be alright in about 18 months.
Yes, that's right. I don't think you are factoring in the fact that if no deal were to happen, everyone, on all sides & without exception, would be working 100% to make things work, and as quickly as possible. There simply isn't the will to demonstrate that at the moment, because it would be considered encouraging to a no deal scenario, and that is considered highly undesirable.