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[Politics] Brexit

If there was a second Brexit referendum how would you vote?


  • Total voters
    1,081


JC Footy Genius

Bringer of TRUTH
Jun 9, 2015
10,568
No deal, without a transition and leaving on 30/03/19:

Main consequences of scenario 2: withdrawal on 30 March 2019 without a withdrawal agreement

The United Kingdom will be a third country and Union law ceases to apply to and in the United Kingdom.

Citizens: There would be no specific arrangement in place for EU citizens in the United Kingdom, or for UK citizens in the European Union.

Border issues: The European Union must apply its regulation and tariffs at borders with the United Kingdom as a third country, including checks and controls for customs, sanitary and phytosanitary standards and verification of compliance with EU norms. Transport between the United Kingdom and the European Union would be severely impacted. Customs, sanitary and phytosanitary controls at borders could cause significant delays, e.g. in road transport, and difficulties for ports.

Trade and regulatory issues: The United Kingdom becomes a third country whose relations with the European Union would be governed by general international public law, including rules of the World Trade Organisation. In particular, in heavily regulated sectors, this would represent a significant drawback compared to the current level of market integration.

Negotiations with the United Kingdom: Depending on the circumstances leading to the withdrawal without an agreement, the EU may wish to enter into negotiations with the United Kingdom as a third country.

EU funding: UK entities would cease to be eligible as Union entities for the purpose of receiving EU grants and participating in EU procurement procedures. Unless otherwise provided for by the legal provisions in force, candidates or tenderers from the United Kingdom could be rejected.


https://ec.europa.eu/info/sites/inf...-preparing-withdrawal-brexit-preparedness.pdf

Hope you didn't google that.

Calling [MENTION=396]WATFORD zero[/MENTION], please tell MoS why this isn't going to happen and never was and to stop scare mongering. :D
 


Thunder Bolt

Ordinary Supporter
Once again you are both presenting a possibility as fact. It says they might be needed, but only if the UK and EU don't agree to mutually recognise licences.

How are the government going to do a deal for mutual licences? We're heading for no deal, a three month recess, so when is the government going to find time to sort out licences?
The day after Brexit, there are 164 trade deals that need to be signed immediately, and 700 in total, so driving licences will be at the bottom of the pile.
 




Pavilionaire

Well-known member
Jul 7, 2003
30,521
The Remain camp had a huge spend advantage and the weight of the Uk government machine, UK/European, global establishment and big business behind them. For tissue of lies see project fear, both sides stretched the truth/fibbed.

The Central Pillar of the Leave campaign was 'take back control'. Many people voted to leave because they wanted more democratic accountability and many were fed up of being continually ignored. I would humbly suggest ignoring their democratic voice would be a mistake. If voting doesn't make any difference even when they are in the majority what do you suggest they do next to make their voices heard?

Classic whataboutery. Without the lies re the NHS, the threat of mass immigration from Turkey, the 'cake and eat it' then Leave would have lost comfortably - with or without "taking back control".

The difference was less than 4%. There is no doubt the lies swung it. So we jump off an economic cliff because some gammon peddled some serious lies that enough people swallowed for it to make a difference??
 








Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patreon
Jul 11, 2003
59,203
The Fatherland
Hope you didn't google that.

Calling [MENTION=396]WATFORD zero[/MENTION], please tell MoS why this isn't going to happen and never was and to stop scare mongering. :D

So what do you think will happen if time runs out?
 






Garry Nelson's teacher

Well-known member
May 11, 2015
5,257
Bloody Worthing!
So what do you think will happen if time runs out?

For me the consequences of leaving without a deal trumps everything else. As a Remainer I'd be squeamish about a poor deal being ignored. But a no deal is a different matter: no ifs or buts, I couldn't stomach seeing that total car crash that would ensue. We have a duty to the generation that follows who didn't get a chance to vote - or even be mislead in the Referendum.
 


JC Footy Genius

Bringer of TRUTH
Jun 9, 2015
10,568
Classic whataboutery. Without the lies re the NHS, the threat of mass immigration from Turkey, the 'cake and eat it' then Leave would have lost comfortably - with or without "taking back control".

The difference was less than 4%. There is no doubt the lies swung it. So we jump off an economic cliff because some gammon peddled some serious lies that enough people swallowed for it to make a difference??

You were talking about the influence of spending ...

8XcxASU9YIlXZOYejMFxQM_E2pSoNVoQqCOzGf_Rv60.jpg


I have not seen any conclusive analysis as to why people voted the way they did on either side so to say there is' no doubt' is just a biased opinion. The use of the term 'gammon' further undermines your argument.

Back to the big question ... 'If voting doesn't make any difference even when they are in the majority what do you suggest they do next to make their voices heard?'
 


The Clamp

Well-known member
NSC Patreon
Jan 11, 2016
24,290
West is BEST
The referendum result is not the will of the people. The referendum result is the result of a large scale confidence trick. What is happening now is not what anybody wants. Brexit is not the will of the people.
 






hans kraay fan club

The voice of reason.
Helpful Moderator
Mar 16, 2005
61,094
Chandlers Ford
The Remain camp had a huge spend advantage and the weight of the Uk government machine, UK/European, global establishment and big business behind them. For tissue of lies see project fear, both sides stretched the truth/fibbed.

The Central Pillar of the Leave campaign was 'take back control'. Many people voted to leave because they wanted more democratic accountability and many were fed up of being continually ignored. I would humbly suggest ignoring their democratic voice would be a mistake. If voting doesn't make any difference even when they are in the majority what do you suggest they do next to make their voices heard?

I agree with you that the whole thing is a sorry episode for our democratic process.

On the flip side to your scenario, are you considering the people who voted for all that new funding for the NHS, and how they are going to feel when that money never existed, and it gets sold off to private interests because of a lack of funding?

Or the people who voted just to give the 'establishment' a kicking, and how they feel with no change to their lives, save for a stripping back of all their workers' rights.

Or the people who voted to end Freedom of Movement, because they read a story about Romanians begging, and Poles taking someone's job, and how they will feel when our shiny new trade deals with India and Pakistan include freedom of movement for work?

Or the people (not that anyone has the balls to admit it) who voted mainly to keep out all the brown people, and how they will feel when we increase immigration from the sub-continent to replace all the workers we lose from the EU?

The ones for whom it was genuinely ALL about sovereignty at any cost (William Wallace and [MENTION=21401]pastafarian[/MENTION] ) will be happy, I guess, and everyone else can just suck it up.
 








WATFORD zero

Well-known member
NSC Patreon
Jul 10, 2003
25,675
So what do you think will happen if time runs out?

Once again you seem to be assuming because the UK or the EU wouldn't be ready it couldn't possibly happen. Hypothetically speaking I would expect Emergency measures continuing the current arrangments with a transition period until both sides can adjust to the new reality.

In that hypothetical scenario, no deal means talks have irrevocably broken down possibly very near the March 29 deadline. Therefore I expect some form of transition process would be needed to reduce the impact and disruption which both sides are likely to agree to as, like you, I can't see how they would be ready. Also it's not continuing EU membership as we would have left on March 29 all those promises about paying tens of billions and future funding commitments no longer stand. The Eu probably wouldn't even agree to extending membership anyway.

Well it was slightly different last time he was cornered into giving a straight answer to that question ???

But as he made clear, it's definitely not extending membership, definitely not
 
Last edited:


nicko31

Well-known member
Jan 7, 2010
17,523
Gods country fortnightly
Classic whataboutery. Without the lies re the NHS, the threat of mass immigration from Turkey, the 'cake and eat it' then Leave would have lost comfortably - with or without "taking back control".

The difference was less than 4%. There is no doubt the lies swung it. So we jump off an economic cliff because some gammon peddled some serious lies that enough people swallowed for it to make a difference??

The referendum wasn't thought through and I blame Cameron for this, where is he now? To leave ans step into the unknown with a country more or less 50/50 is ridiculous

If we do go off a cliff I can see a brain drain in the UK and massive resentment from the younger generation left to pick up the bill, while still being expected to fund an oldies that largely f**ked them over. If I were under 30 I know exactly what I would do...
 


JC Footy Genius

Bringer of TRUTH
Jun 9, 2015
10,568
I agree with you that the whole thing is a sorry episode for our democratic process.

On the flip side to your scenario, are you considering the people who voted for all that new funding for the NHS, and how they are going to feel when that money never existed, and it gets sold off to private interests because of a lack of funding?

Or the people who voted just to give the 'establishment' a kicking, and how they feel with no change to their lives, save for a stripping back of all their workers' rights.

Or the people who voted to end Freedom of Movement, because they read a story about Romanians begging, and Poles taking someone's job, and how they will feel when our shiny new trade deals with India and Pakistan include freedom of movement for work?

Or the people (not that anyone has the balls to admit it) who voted mainly to keep out all the brown people, and how they will feel when we increase immigration from the sub-continent to replace all the workers we lose from the EU?

The ones for whom it was genuinely ALL about sovereignty at any cost (William Wallace and [MENTION=21401]pastafarian[/MENTION] ) will be happy, I guess, and everyone else can just suck it up.

As funny as those who believed they were just voting for a status quo or we would suddenly lead and steer the EU in a direction more to our liking #gullible idiots.

The point of returning sovereign powers is to hold our directly elected representatives to account if they don't deliver they are directly accountable and can be removed. Good luck voting out the EU commission when they inflict crushing austerity on a member state ..
 




Pavilionaire

Well-known member
Jul 7, 2003
30,521
You were talking about the influence of spending ...

8XcxASU9YIlXZOYejMFxQM_E2pSoNVoQqCOzGf_Rv60.jpg


I have not seen any conclusive analysis as to why people voted the way they did on either side so to say there is' no doubt' is just a biased opinion. The use of the term 'gammon' further undermines your argument.

Back to the big question ... 'If voting doesn't make any difference even when they are in the majority what do you suggest they do next to make their voices heard?'

2 in 7 voters didn't vote and of the 5 in 7 that did a small majority voted for something made up by some unaccountable gammon, most of whom scarpered immediately after the result.

I don't have a problem with a second referendum on a scenario that is known, i.e. a No Deal Brexit with a clean break from the EU vs the status quo pre-June 2016.

What I do object to his this "will of the people" bollocks where - on the Brexit side - people knew what they were voting against but were clueless what they were voting for.
 


hans kraay fan club

The voice of reason.
Helpful Moderator
Mar 16, 2005
61,094
Chandlers Ford
As funny as those who believed they were just voting for a status quo or we would suddenly lead and steer the EU in a direction more to our liking #gullible idiots.
.

Christ. Which part of that did you think was supposed to be FUNNY?
 



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