View Poll Results: Is Theresa May is out of her depth?

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  • She doesn't know what she is doing

    390 69.89%
  • She knows exactly what she is doing

    168 30.11%
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  1. #51951
    Members Mustafa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WATFORD zero View Post
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    Out of interest, who do you think should have led the negotiations and would have got the 'good deal' you were hoping for?
    I don't think it is possible to get a "good deal" after just 2 years of negotiating. It's one nation versus 27 with so much at stake for them.

    I would have preferred a Corbyn led Labour government to carry out the negotiations for numerous reasons.

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    • #51952

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      Quote Originally Posted by Mustafa View Post
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      I don't think it is possible to get a "good deal" after just 2 years of negotiating. It's one nation versus 27 with so much at stake for them.

      I would have preferred a Corbyn led Labour government to carry out the negotiations for numerous reasons.
      Fair enough. I think we will have to agree to disagree as I thought we were on a one track road to our current clusterf*** from the day after the referendum, regardless of who was in power.

      The other thing people seem to forget is that we were one of the most powerful forces in shaping them (the EU) until Nige and his swivel eyed loons somehow persuaded the naive and gullible that he was the 'man of the people'.

      I'm not a great fan of the EU but we were in a position to change what wasn't good for the UK.

      Nige, Boris and Co have done OK out of this, but it's totally f***ed the rest of us
      Last edited by WATFORD zero; 08-07-2018 at 15:53.
    • #51953
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      Quote Originally Posted by WATFORD zero View Post
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      Fair enough. I think we will have to agree to disagree as I thought we were on a one track road to our current clusterf*** from the day after the referendum, regardless of who was in power.
      It's going to be a tough few years, but we knew that when we voted didn't we?

      It's a shame that we have pro-EU Tories carrying out the negotiations, but in the long term independance from the United States of Europe will be a good thing for the country.
    • #51954
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      Quote Originally Posted by daveinprague View Post
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      We were always able to.
      Quote Originally Posted by pb21 View Post
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      Parliament has always had the ultimate say.
      Quote Originally Posted by WATFORD zero View Post
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      Not an area I know well but I thought the majority of countries in the EU ran state operated railways?

      Isn't Britain of the most privatised models?
      Yes, but new competition rules introduced in 2016 aim to copy the UK (passengers using SASTA may have to stifle a laugh at this point, but the British model is seen as way that railways should be run). Most European railways will continue to be state run but a single 100% state-owned company operating trains, running stations and controlling the track will not be allowed.

      I know that's not what was in the Labour manifesto, but if it was, it wouldn't be allowed while the UK remained a member of the EU.
      Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio
    • #51955

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      Quote Originally Posted by Mustafa View Post
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      It's going to be a tough few years, but we knew that when we voted didn't we?

      It's a shame that we have pro-EU Tories carrying out the negotiations, but in the long term independance from the United States of Europe will be a good thing for the country.
      It's the second part of the last line we disagree on
    • #51956

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      Quote Originally Posted by Gwylan View Post
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      Yes, but new competition rules introduced in 2016 aim to copy the UK (passengers using SASTA may have to stifle a laugh at this point, but the British model is seen as way that railways should be run). Most European railways will continue to be state run but a single 100% state-owned company operating trains, running stations and controlling the track will not be allowed.

      I know that's not what was in the Labour manifesto, but if it was, it wouldn't be allowed while the UK remained a member of the EU.
      I have to say, I'm surprised that an organisation that has a vast majority of state owned railways would make it illegal. Do you know what Germany are going to do about their 100% state owned railways?
    • #51957
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      Quote Originally Posted by WATFORD zero View Post
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      I have to say, I'm surprised that an organisation that has a vast majority of state owned railways would make it illegal. Do you know what Germany are going to do about their 100% state owned railways?
      The EU is very much about competition and is very suspicious of state aid to industries. The original scheme, unveiled in 2013, was very much on the British model but this was watered down. What the EC is proposing is a scheme where there's an element of competition introduced, as in the UK. What this probably means in practice is that an state-run organisation will probably win out against any new operator (unless the government wants to load the dice in favour of the new operator).

      But, by definition, it means that a single state-owned operator like BR wouldn't be allowed. It's one of the reasons why Corbyn and all left wing parties are so opposed to the EU
      Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio
    • #51958

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      Quote Originally Posted by Gwylan View Post
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      The EU is very much about competition and is very suspicious of state aid to industries. The original scheme, unveiled in 2013, was very much on the British model but this was watered down. What the EC is proposing is a scheme where there's an element of competition introduced, as in the UK. What this probably means in practice is that an state-run organisation will probably win out against any new operator (unless the government wants to load the dice in favour of the new operator).

      But, by definition, it means that a single state-owned operator like BR wouldn't be allowed. It's one of the reasons why Corbyn and all left wing parties are so opposed to the EU
      The EU is at the end of the day a set of politicians from the member countries all trying to get the best deal for their prospective countries.(Plus the occasional loon elected by a member that has thrown their toys out the pram). So I find it hard to believe that a collection of states are wary of state aiding industry. (Unless it's cross border to the ddetriment of other states).

      Since Germany are the most powerful force in there, I think it is highly unlikely that they would make their own 100% state owned railways illegal. I think there may be more than one interpretation of these changes.

      If Germany could favour their state owned company, we could do exactly the same.

      Maybe I've answered my own question and it's the state subsidies on cross border operations that the EU are trying to stop.
      Last edited by WATFORD zero; 08-07-2018 at 17:03.
    • #51959
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      Quote Originally Posted by sir albion View Post
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      So you're saying that nobody can leave the European Union because Brussels have all the cards and power to do as they wish?
      Isn't this the reason why most voted "out" as no organisation should not have this kind of power it's just bloody ridiculous.The reason why it's a mess is because...
      Internal bickering and moaning from remainer politicians
      A government leader incapable of being strong and direct
      Constant votes on what we can and can't do in parliament
      The EU telling us to do everything while they do fack all as always
      Big business wants uncontrolled immigration as it suits their need and the liberals also want this even though our infrastructure is creaking at the seems.For a better quality of life you need less people instead of saturating the country with low earners and a poor quality of life.

      Just get on with it and leave fully and then we can then start to progress as a nation !!
      People are doing everything they can to sabotage it and these politicians are paid by the tax payer and we voted democratically to LEAVE and if they can't do what the voters voted for then they need to be outed ASAP so we can actually do what is required.

      What's so great about Europe at the moment or years gone by as it's in a terrible state and is declining at a rate of knots.
      The problem with Brussels is that year after year they've gained to much control to quickly and the sooner it's abolished the better Europe will be.
      Erm. No. I am saying that you can't undo a country's entire legal and physical infrastructure in a few months. This is because before triggering article 50 you need a plan but leavers were demanding it. The EU understood how long it would take so now knows that they can simply refuse anything that is not in their interest because we don't have an option. No deal is simply not an option. I would suggest a lack of understanding about what leaving entailed led to people calling for article 50 trigger before we were ready - in fact read Cummings on this.
    • #51960
      Stupid IDIOT Ernest's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by WATFORD zero View Post
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      I have to say, I'm surprised that an organisation that has a vast majority of state owned railways would make it illegal. Do you know what Germany are going to do about their 100% state owned railways?
      They have private companies running in competition on some routes, way different from what we do

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