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[Politics] Brexit

If there was a second Brexit referendum how would you vote?

  • Total voters
    1,081


B

Berty23

Well-known member
Jun 26, 2012
3,196
JC Footy Genius said:
Who out of those you named (Farage, Cummings, Gove, Boris, Hannan) are 'falling away' and saying it will be a car crash?
Click to expand...

Back in June Cummings said that Brexit would fail unless downing street and the civil service management was completely reshape to allow his free market minuscule state fantasy to work. It hasn't changed and won't so he has vanished from the scene. Hannon now saying we might leave single market (which is not quite as bad to no deal) and stating to change his tune. Now this chap this week with his acknowledgement.

So who is left? Farage, Boris and Gove. Three politicians - maybe Boris has a final play for PM. Come out and say "this is terrible, I was wrong. Let me lead you as we cancel Brexit."
 




nicko31

nicko31

Well-known member
Jan 7, 2010
17,575
Gods country fortnightly
bashlsdir said:
Just wondered if you are just as vocal against the supermarkets who have priced out our high street over the years, and made it harder for some farmers to make a decent living.
Click to expand...

I am indeed, many of the buyers are parasites. Many don't want to accept ex/rate increases right now
 




5

5ways

Well-known member
Sep 18, 2012
2,217
nicko31 said:
Thanks for the reminder of how the system works. We're not at mob rule just yet

At least May did 2 things yesterday..

a) She is not a bare faced liar, ie saying she'd vote Brexit tomorrow

b) She isn't completely stupid

I can feel another "Enemy of the People" headline from the Mail coming on
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She is in an unprecedented situation and I think years from now people will recognise that she is playing a losing hand as well as she can. Biggest mistake, I think, is to rule out a second referendum. Edit: and triggering article 50 :shrug:
 


JC Footy Genius

JC Footy Genius

Bringer of TRUTH
Jun 9, 2015
10,568
Berty23 said:
Back in June Cummings said that Brexit would fail unless downing street and the civil service management was completely reshape to allow his free market minuscule state fantasy to work. It hasn't changed and won't so he has vanished from the scene. Hannon now saying we might leave single market (which is not quite as bad to no deal) and stating to change his tune. Now this chap this week with his acknowledgement.

So who is left? Farage, Boris and Gove. Three politicians - maybe Boris has a final play for PM. Come out and say "this is terrible, I was wrong. Let me lead you as we cancel Brexit."
Click to expand...

I'll give you Dominic Cummings ... but Farage, Boris, Gove, Fox, Davis, Hannan, Patel, Villiers, Smith and every other MP on any side who voted for Brexit are not saying Brexit will be a 'car crash' as far as I am aware.

No idea who that blog person is I doubt any of you did either until he said something you agreed with.

I read the EU aren't making any preparations for a no deal option, perhaps you should email the commission with your insight to the approaching armageddon. Or Instead of jumping on every twist and turn in a predictably difficult negotiation shouting we're doomed ..perhaps it's best to wait until nearer completion or it's actually broken down?

It's also disappointing many in this thread can't express concern or worry about the process without feeling the need to scaremonger, exaggerate and mislead to make their points. Project fear didn't work during the referendum .. learn the lesson.
 




ManOfSussex

ManOfSussex

We wunt be druv
Apr 11, 2016
14,745
Rape of Hastings, Sussex
JC Footy Genius said:
It's also disappointing many in this thread can't express concern or worry about the process without feeling the need to scaremonger, exaggerate and mislead to make their points. Project fear didn't work during the referendum .. learn the lesson.
Click to expand...

Project Fear not working doesn't seem to have held you back though with your party political posts on behalf of The Conservative & Unionist party and pro-Brexit doctrine, normally complete with links to The Daily Telegraph and Guido Fawkes blog site with pro-Brexit and pro-Tory spin articles and scaremongering, exaggerated, misleading points against Labour or opposition or negative thinking to the ideology of Brexit such as the 'extremist loons' of the Liberal Democrat party as you refer to them.

This thread merely reflects the state of this country at the moment rather accurately at present - a divisive mess.
 


B

Berty23

Well-known member
Jun 26, 2012
3,196
JC Footy Genius said:
I'll give you Dominic Cummings ... but Farage, Boris, Gove, Fox, Davis, Hannan, Patel, Villiers, Smith and every other MP on any side who voted for Brexit are not saying Brexit will be a 'car crash' as far as I am aware.

No idea who that blog person is I doubt any of you did either until he said something you agreed with.

I read the EU aren't making any preparations for a no deal option, perhaps you should email the commission with your insight to the approaching armageddon. Or Instead of jumping on every twist and turn in a predictably difficult negotiation shouting we're doomed ..perhaps it's best to wait until nearer completion or it's actually broken down?

It's also disappointing many in this thread can't express concern or worry about the process without feeling the need to scaremonger, exaggerate and mislead to make their points. Project fear didn't work during the referendum .. learn the lesson.
Click to expand...

You are right, I didn't know (said as much earlier this week). Have since researched him and he falls into the camp with many others who argued vehemently that they need us more than we need them and they can't even be bothered to prepare for no deal as it matters so little for them. You list MPs from a party whose current position is to support Brexit. If you think them not publicly slating it is proof they are happy then you don't understand politics. The other person is Farage who will probably move to Germany to go and engage with the people he ironically and proudly slated with his Dunkirk photo. He will support Brexit to the bitter end. Let's see how this progresses as people realise the reality.
 






nicko31

nicko31

Well-known member
Jan 7, 2010
17,575
Gods country fortnightly
5ways said:
She is in an unprecedented situation and I think years from now people will recognise that she is playing a losing hand as well as she can. Biggest mistake, I think, is to rule out a second referendum. Edit: and triggering article 50 :shrug:
Click to expand...

She knows she's playing a losing hand, turning your back of a free trade deal with 70% of the world, in exchange for the rest that includes the USA with Trump in power is never going to deliver a better outcome

Slowly but surely its unravelling, little wonder Brexiteers want out as soon as possible before the penny drops.

If we do crash out we definitely need a second ref, tough I would have a 2nd ref on whatever the deal is. Then the country can move on whatever the outcome
 


D

Deleted member 22389

Guest
JC Footy Genius said:
I'll give you Dominic Cummings ... but Farage, Boris, Gove, Fox, Davis, Hannan, Patel, Villiers, Smith and every other MP on any side who voted for Brexit are not saying Brexit will be a 'car crash' as far as I am aware.

No idea who that blog person is I doubt any of you did either until he said something you agreed with.

I read the EU aren't making any preparations for a no deal option, perhaps you should email the commission with your insight to the approaching armageddon. Or Instead of jumping on every twist and turn in a predictably difficult negotiation shouting we're doomed ..perhaps it's best to wait until nearer completion or it's actually broken down?

It's also disappointing many in this thread can't express concern or worry about the process without feeling the need to scaremonger, exaggerate and mislead to make their points. Project fear didn't work during the referendum .. learn the lesson.
Click to expand...

Scaremongering has gone completely over the top now, and it's all because some hard remainers still can't accept the result. Scaremonger, exaggerate, and mislead as you point out, that is now what is required to try and create fear and doubt in peoples minds. I'm not having any of it.
 


B

Berty23

Well-known member
Jun 26, 2012
3,196
bashlsdir said:
Scaremongering has gone completely over the top now, and it's all because some hard remainers still can't accept the result. Scaremonger, exaggerate, and mislead as you point out, that is now what is required to try and create fear and doubt in peoples minds. I'm not having any of it.
Click to expand...

Isn't the issue that people are struggling to accept the reality?

E.g.
We will stay in single market (Hannon) - we won't
Trade deals will be easy (fox and Davis) - they won't
They need us more than we need them (most brexiteers) - they don't.
Finance jobs won't leave London (most brexisteers) - becoming clear this isn't the case due to point 1
America will save us (Farage, fox and Davis plus others) - they started a trade war
We can set our own trade rules (nearly all) - we can't. Quality of goods etc is determined by china, us and Eu. All others just comply.
No deal would be fine (many brexiteers and even the PM) - as discussed even vehement leavers realising a problem.
350 million (official campaign which Cummings has said won the vote) - that took one day to vanish
Turkey about to join the EU - Farage - bull.

So all in all what was promised that will actually happen in the real world rather than a fantasy world?
 






Herr Tubthumper

Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
59,523
The Fatherland
bashlsdir said:
Scaremongering has gone completely over the top now, and it's all because some hard remainers still can't accept the result.
Click to expand...

What your seemingly small little mind repeatedly fails to notice is that the argument for many has moved on since the referendum. Many are now debating the governments total and utter inability to deal with the EU. That referendum was 15 months ago with about the same to go before the clock stops ticking. The government has agreed **** all so far. And before you say it's all the EUs fault I'll ask how you expect anyone to believe that when the front bench Tories can't even talk coherently between themselves and given Theresa May's last 3 major speeches the PM appears to be in mental meltdown. Please, listen to her key party conference speech, listen to her radio thing yesterday......you have to remind yourself this is the ****ing British PM speaking!

Whatever anyone thinks of the result the process isn't working. You'd need to be an absolute idiot to think it is. It's time for a cross-party government department to sort this total mess out. The Tories have had long enough. And that cross-party group has to somehow unite the 52 the 48% otherwise the country will be even more divided than it currently is.
 


B

Berty23

Well-known member
Jun 26, 2012
3,196
You could add to that list....

Pound devaluation will help exports ...we have record trade deficit

It goes on and on.
 




pastafarian

pastafarian

Well-known member
Sep 4, 2011
11,902
Sussex
Berty23 said:
Back in June Cummings said that Brexit would fail unless downing street and the civil service management was completely reshape to allow his free market minuscule state fantasy to work. It hasn't changed and won't so he has vanished from the scene. Hannon now saying we might leave single market (which is not quite as bad to no deal) and stating to change his tune. Now this chap this week with his acknowledgement.

So who is left? Farage, Boris and Gove. Three politicians - maybe Boris has a final play for PM. Come out and say "this is terrible, I was wrong. Let me lead you as we cancel Brexit."
Click to expand...

When you said all these people all already admit they got it wrong about wanting to Leave you were talking more fakenews balls then.
You are consistent I will give you that.
 




J

Jim D

Well-known member
Jul 23, 2003
5,249
Worthing
Herr Tubthumper said:
What your seemingly small little mind repeatedly fails to notice is that the argument for many has moved on since the referendum. Many are now debating the governments total and utter inability to deal with the EU. That referendum was 15 months ago with about the same to go before the clock stops ticking. The government has agreed **** all so far. And before you say it's all the EUs fault I'll ask how you expect anyone to believe that when the front bench Tories can't even talk coherently between themselves and given Theresa May's last 3 major speeches the PM appears to be in mental meltdown. Please, listen to her key party conference speech, listen to her radio thing yesterday......you have to remind yourself this is the ****ing British PM speaking!

Whatever anyone thinks of the result the process isn't working. You'd need to be an absolute idiot to think it is. It's time for a cross-party government department to sort this total mess out. The Tories have had long enough. And that cross-party group has to somehow unite the 52 the 48% otherwise the country will be even more divided than it currently is.
Click to expand...

I fully agree with you regarding the cross-party Brexit department. However, the membership should consist of brexiters only - to avoid unintentional (or not) sabotage. Unfortunately this would rule out most of the Labour front bench.
 


nicko31

nicko31

Well-known member
Jan 7, 2010
17,575
Gods country fortnightly
Herr Tubthumper said:
What your seemingly small little mind repeatedly fails to notice is that the argument for many has moved on since the referendum. Many are now debating the governments total and utter inability to deal with the EU. That referendum was 15 months ago with about the same to go before the clock stops ticking. The government has agreed **** all so far. And before you say it's all the EUs fault I'll ask how you expect anyone to believe that when the front bench Tories can't even talk coherently between themselves and given Theresa May's last 3 major speeches the PM appears to be in mental meltdown. Please, listen to her key party conference speech, listen to her radio thing yesterday......you have to remind yourself this is the ****ing British PM speaking!

Whatever anyone thinks of the result the process isn't working. You'd need to be an absolute idiot to think it is. It's time for a cross-party government department to sort this total mess out. The Tories have had long enough. And that cross-party group has to somehow unite the 52 the 48% otherwise the country will be even more divided than it currently is.
Click to expand...

Probably would actually be a wise move for the Tories to share the blame, Brexit could well break their party forever
 




ManOfSussex

ManOfSussex

We wunt be druv
Apr 11, 2016
14,745
Rape of Hastings, Sussex
Berty23 said:
You could add to that list....

Pound devaluation will help exports ...we have record trade deficit

It goes on and on.
Click to expand...

The domino effect - Austria, Netherlands, France etc would all be leaving The EU - An old friend of mine in Vienna told me last week the TV news, in a rare foray into actually reporting Brexit as they're not that bothered about it, was just full on comedy in it's reporting of The British Government, May and Brexit. We really are up the creek when we're being laughed at by Austrians.

Live on Sky News on Monday, when Barnier turned up in Brussels, Mark Stone reported there was no other European country's press corp there, just British media.

Still, they need us more than we need them and all that.
 
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