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What Muslims believe CH4 last night



T

ThePompousPaladin

New member
Apr 7, 2013
1,025
Buzzer said:
An interesting sidepoint is that Luther kicked off a Reformation that has led to a liberal, tolerant West and most serious observers acknowledge that Islam is in desperate need of a similar Reformation so they can move away from their medieval views on women, homosexuals, atheists, apostates and justice.
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Well some and some. As i understand it, the rise of different branches of protestantism led to literal interpretations of the bible, Calvinism etc.
The Catholics had the Pope as their authority, the proddies could only claim the bible. So, the rise of modern fundamentalist christianity can be tied to this too.
 




Kalimantan Gull

Kalimantan Gull

Well-known member
Aug 13, 2003
12,924
Central Borneo / the Lizard
pastafarian said:
hosted by Trevor Phillips who said "I thought Europe's Muslims would gradually blend into Britain's diverse landscape. I should have known better.

Usually these sort of surveys are dismissed and the conversation is quashed

however this survey was in depth and some of the findings were very shocking.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...homosexuality-should-be-illegal-a6978091.html

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/lat...-muslims-want-ban-gay-homosexuality-attitudes

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/...-british-muslims-shows-we-need-to-defend-our/


for balance the survey has been ridiculed by the BBC and Guardian

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/apr/12/what-do-muslims-think-skewed-poll-wont-tell-us

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-trending-36016708


can we afford to bury our heads in the sand over this issue any longer?
even the most ardent supporter of multiculturism must surely now admit something is very very wrong.
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Its a two-way thing. As much as its easy and convenient to say that they are not integrating, it is clearly true that we haven't welcomed them as well as we could have, and it is clear from this thread that there are many non-muslim British people who actively dislike muslims. Its natural to blame the other side for the problems.

Living in a muslim country it is obvious to me that there is nothing wrong with muslims per se, they're just people. As someone who lives in a part of Britain with almost no muslims, I found it telling and somewhat surprising (to me at least) on our trip to Birmingham last week how, contrary to what one may read in the Mail, the Islamic women in the city centre were dressing in the same decadent and stylish way that Jakarta girls do.

But marginalise a section of society and some will inevitably rebel and strengthen those beliefs that differ from the rest of us. A lack of acceptance and a sense of persecution, right or wrong, leads some people along a path of fundamentalism that is unfortunately open to them.
 


JC Footy Genius

JC Footy Genius

Bringer of TRUTH
Jun 9, 2015
10,568
Kalimantan Gull said:
Its a two-way thing. As much as its easy and convenient to say that they are not integrating, it is clearly true that we haven't welcomed them as well as we could have, and it is clear from this thread that there are many non-muslim British people who actively dislike muslims. Its natural to blame the other side for the problems.

Living in a muslim country it is obvious to me that there is nothing wrong with muslims per se, they're just people. As someone who lives in a part of Britain with almost no muslims, I found it telling and somewhat surprising (to me at least) on our trip to Birmingham last week how, contrary to what one may read in the Mail, the Islamic women in the city centre were dressing in the same decadent and stylish way that Jakarta girls do.

But marginalise a section of society and some will inevitably rebel and strengthen those beliefs that differ from the rest of us. A lack of acceptance and a sense of persecution, right or wrong, leads some people along a path of fundamentalism that is unfortunately open to them.
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It's easy and convenient to say things when the evidence points in that direction rather than remain self delusional to a point beyond parody. We could have done more like continue to turn a blind eye to mass systematic rape and sexual assault of vulnerable white children in several British cities for fear of upsetting local cultural/religious sensibilities. That got knocked on the head eventually despite the best efforts of people with a turn a blind eye mindset. But at least we allow religious freedom so intolerance, misogyny, homophobia, anti semitism can thrive in our society. Mosques used to number a couple of hundred now nearing 2000 suggests the Muslim community are doing fine despite our poor welcome. Incidentally where is the evidence for this sub standard welcome?

If you had been identified as being Gay or Jewish you might not have had such a pleasant experience living in any Muslim country. Plus of course keep the Mo jokes to a minimum. Your trip to Birmingham was interesting how did you know they were Muslim women? There are of course other examples where parts of UK cities resemble downtown Baghdad.

Yes yes of course it's our fault nothing to do with being indoctrinated into a medieval belief system in direct conflict with liberal western values. Accepting the unacceptable in the name of 'tolerance' is not a virtue ... it is a betrayal of our values and those Muslims seeking to break free from religious and cultural oppression.
 


pastafarian

pastafarian

Well-known member
Sep 4, 2011
11,902
Sussex
Kalimantan Gull said:
Its a two-way thing. As much as its easy and convenient to say that they are not integrating, it is clearly true that we haven't welcomed them as well as we could have, and it is clear from this thread that there are many non-muslim British people who actively dislike muslims. Its natural to blame the other side for the problems.

Living in a muslim country it is obvious to me that there is nothing wrong with muslims per se, they're just people. As someone who lives in a part of Britain with almost no muslims, I found it telling and somewhat surprising (to me at least) on our trip to Birmingham last week how, contrary to what one may read in the Mail, the Islamic women in the city centre were dressing in the same decadent and stylish way that Jakarta girls do.

But marginalise a section of society and some will inevitably rebel and strengthen those beliefs that differ from the rest of us. A lack of acceptance and a sense of persecution, right or wrong, leads some people along a path of fundamentalism that is unfortunately open to them.
Click to expand...

out of interest If they were dressing decadently (yet stylish) in Birmingham how did you come to the conclusion they were muslims? and not say decadent yet stylish Sikh,hindu,buddhist or even christian for that matter?
 


Triggaaar

Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
50,206
Goldstone
Kalimantan Gull said:
Its a two-way thing. As much as its easy and convenient to say that they are not integrating, it is clearly true that we haven't welcomed them as well as we could have, and it is clear from this thread that there are many non-muslim British people who actively dislike muslims. Its natural to blame the other side for the problems.
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How many is many? How many people in this thread actively dislike Muslims? This isn't about being easy or convenient. Do you think we should have Sharia Law in this country? Do you think suicide bombings are ok?

Living in a muslim country it is obvious to me that there is nothing wrong with muslims per se, they're just people.
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Well obviously. Are you suggesting that we don't know that, that we somehow thing they're not human? Of course they're just people. It's some of the teachings of Islam that many are questioning.

As someone who lives in a part of Britain with almost no muslims, I found it telling and somewhat surprising (to me at least) on our trip to Birmingham last week how, contrary to what one may read in the Mail
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Stop reading the Mail.

But marginalise a section of society and some will inevitably rebel and strengthen those beliefs that differ from the rest of us.
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I think blaming the British for marginalising people is just lazy.
 




H

Hastings gull

Well-known member
Nov 23, 2013
4,635
Kalimantan Gull said:
Its a two-way thing. As much as its easy and convenient to say that they are not integrating, it is clearly true that we haven't welcomed them as well as we could have, and it is clear from this thread that there are many non-muslim British people who actively dislike muslims. Its natural to blame the other side for the problems.

Living in a muslim country it is obvious to me that there is nothing wrong with muslims per se, they're just people. As someone who lives in a part of Britain with almost no muslims, I found it telling and somewhat surprising (to me at least) on our trip to Birmingham last week how, contrary to what one may read in the Mail, the Islamic women in the city centre were dressing in the same decadent and stylish way that Jakarta girls do.

But marginalise a section of society and some will inevitably rebel and strengthen those beliefs that differ from the rest of us. A lack of acceptance and a sense of persecution, right or wrong, leads some people along a path of fundamentalism that is unfortunately open to them.
Click to expand...


So where do you live? I have read all through this thread and found no evidence that people actively dislike muslims, rather concern themselves with the questioning of medieval practices. Your last para is so sadly typical of those who wish to bury their heads in the sand. This country offers huge opportunities to those who wish to grab them, and the idea that a group is consciously marginalised is nonsense.
 


looney

looney

Banned
Jul 7, 2003
15,652
Sam Ovett said:
That is worrying. It's clear that leaders in the Muslim community need to curb this extremism but it seems a tall order considering the ease with which anyone can communicate with anyone in the digital age.
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When you are hell bent on conquest why assimilate? It is an islamic obligation, just a question of how an when?

Its like being 2-0 up and the oppo have just had a player sent of then they askif you will settle for a draw?

I'm on page 2, is it worth reading al this whinnning and nobody got the cahooners to post an end product?
 


BadFish

BadFish

Huge Member
Oct 19, 2003
17,124
Kalimantan Gull said:
Its a two-way thing. As much as its easy and convenient to say that they are not integrating, it is clearly true that we haven't welcomed them as well as we could have, and it is clear from this thread that there are many non-muslim British people who actively dislike muslims. Its natural to blame the other side for the problems.

Living in a muslim country it is obvious to me that there is nothing wrong with muslims per se, they're just people. As someone who lives in a part of Britain with almost no muslims, I found it telling and somewhat surprising (to me at least) on our trip to Birmingham last week how, contrary to what one may read in the Mail, the Islamic women in the city centre were dressing in the same decadent and stylish way that Jakarta girls do.

But marginalise a section of society and some will inevitably rebel and strengthen those beliefs that differ from the rest of us. A lack of acceptance and a sense of persecution, right or wrong, leads some people along a path of fundamentalism that is unfortunately open to them.
Click to expand...

Great post from someone who lives with Muslims.
 






Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
50,169
Faversham
ThePompousPaladin said:
It's going to be a slower process to integrate when there are an increasing number of faith schools.
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Faith schools is why I resigned from the labour party. Idiocy.
 


Two Professors

Two Professors

Two Mad Professors
Jul 13, 2009
7,617
Multicultural Brum
pastafarian said:
out of interest If they were dressing decadently (yet stylish) in Birmingham how did you come to the conclusion they were muslims? and not say decadent yet stylish Sikh,hindu,buddhist or even christian for that matter?
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Probably the beards gave them away :eek:
 




looney

looney

Banned
Jul 7, 2003
15,652
KZNSeagull said:
It is bad, so we have to help the 77% to educate the 23%. Particularly the women. Women hold the key to solving this problem, I reckon.
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Women imo are one of a few groups who for this it will not end well for. Short reason is low birth rates. which is more reasoning than you have provided
 


G

goldstone

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
7,125
Pinkie Brown said:
Whilst that is fair logic, there's plenty of migrants living overseas who make no effort to speak the language, accept local customs, are a drain on local health services, make no effort whatsoever to integrate with the local community and live within their own (usually gated) communities - like many Brit ex pats on the Costa Del Sol for example?
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In which case I would fully support them being sent home.
 
















Triggaaar

Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
50,206
Goldstone
Kalimantan Gull said:
As someone who lives in a part of Britain with almost no muslims, I found it telling and somewhat surprising (to me at least) on our trip to Birmingham last week how, contrary to what one may read in the Mail, the Islamic women in the city centre were dressing in the same decadent and stylish way that Jakarta girls do.
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Kalimantan Gull said:
they were wearing jilbabs
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If they were wearing jilbabs, how were dressing in as as decadent and stylish a way as the Jakarta girls? Sounds like an oxymoron.
 




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