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IS destroys the ancient city of Nimrud



beorhthelm

beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,340
Nibble said:
I think you seem to be missing my point. My ENTIRE point is that Hitler wasn't a Christian. Just as IS claim to be doing the prophet's work to achieve what they believed to be a righteous state the Nazis used Christianity for the same end. Religion or politics, same result.
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and ignoring the difference that the ISIL chaps are muslims and doing what they think it required for they faith as instructed by an interpretation, not "using it", their faith demands it. unless you are comparing them directly as members of the cohort of mass murdering fukheads, then i see the connection.
 






J

jimbob5

Banned
Sep 18, 2014
2,697
beorhthelm said:
and ignoring the difference that the ISIL chaps are muslims and doing what they think it required for they faith as instructed by an interpretation, not "using it", their faith demands it. unless you are comparing them directly as members of the cohort of mass murdering fukheads, then i see the connection.
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Yes there might be some vague comparisons apart from the obvious ones that both are/were evil, and both relied on brainwashing and ignorance but the Nazis did not pretend to be part of Christianity and certainly were not looking to form a Christian world. They might have initially got in to bed with Christians who at best did not have the benefit of foresight, but it was more a type of marriage of convenience. The convenience of the Nazis to further their own aim.
 


T

ThePompousPaladin

New member
Apr 7, 2013
1,025
symyjym said:
Religion just makes it easier to control the masses.
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Some religions can be used in that way as many belief systems can. Nationalism for example was used to motivate many countries during WW2, and continues to motivate today.

Personally i believe the best way to tackle extreme belief systems is with moderate ones. Religion mostly cannot be replaced with a vacuum.

"If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him."
 


Megazone

Megazone

On his last warning
Jan 28, 2015
8,679
Northern Hemisphere.
jimbob5 said:
Yes there might be some vague comparisons apart from the obvious ones that both are/were evil, and both relied on brainwashing and ignorance but the Nazis did not pretend to be part of Christianity and certainly were not looking to form a Christian world. They might have initially got in to bed with Christians who at best did not have the benefit of foresight, but it was more a type of marriage of convenience. The convenience of the Nazis to further their own aim.
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The Nazi movement resulted in more than 250,000 languished in displaced persons camps for years after the war ended.
Many displaced persons unable or unwilling to return to their former homes in Europe and with restrictions to immigration to many western countries remaining in place, Palestine became the primary destination for many Jewish refugees.

Amazing coincidence, that Hitler was a descendant of the Jews and now Israel (a result of Hiter) is at the heart of a new world crisis.

But, yeah. Blame it on Religion.
 




J

jimbob5

Banned
Sep 18, 2014
2,697
ThePompousPaladin said:
Some religions can be used in that way as many belief systems can. Nationalism for example was used to motivate many countries during WW2, and continues to motivate today.

Personally i believe the best way to tackle extreme belief systems is with moderate ones. Religion mostly cannot be replaced with a vacuum.

"If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him."
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Nazis did not believe in God, nor is there any evidence as far as I'm aware that they pretended to. However, during their uprising in the 30s they would have been conscious of the fact that a high percentage of Germans at the time were Christians.
 




symyjym

symyjym

Banned
Nov 2, 2009
13,138
Brighton / Hove actually
ThePompousPaladin said:
Some religions can be used in that way as many belief systems can. Nationalism for example was used to motivate many countries during WW2, and continues to motivate today.

Personally i believe the best way to tackle extreme belief systems is with moderate ones. Religion mostly cannot be replaced with a vacuum.

"If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him."
Click to expand...

When our soldiers die we use religion and God in the ritual which can be very powerful even if you don’t believe. With war there are lots of deaths so religion becomes even more prevalent. Death is the food for religion and wars cause death.
 




Nibble

Nibble

New member
Jan 3, 2007
19,238
I see your points about Nazis not trying to make a Christian Utopia, I meant it more as a comparison between two groups trying to convince the world that what they are doing is righteous and the world should bow to it. Be it a God or a political ideal. Both believed people who did not live up to their ideals should die.
 




T

ThePompousPaladin

New member
Apr 7, 2013
1,025
jimbob5 said:
Nazis did not believe in God..
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If you're talking about individuals, some did, some didn't. If you're talking about the nazi party, i'm not sure an organisation can have 'faith' as such, but i'm sure there was a party line.

My point was about belief systems though, nationalism was used in pretty much all countries in europe during that period, often under the guise of patriotism.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationalism

I wonder how much IS is motivated by nationalism.
 






Megazone

Megazone

On his last warning
Jan 28, 2015
8,679
Northern Hemisphere.
Can't we just secretly replace the ancient remains with all our broken Ikea equipment before IS get there?

Not only would we keep hold of important ancient history, IS will most probably resort to suicide due to the many attempts at fixing the Ikea equipment.
 






Tyrone Biggums

Tyrone Biggums

Well-known member
Jun 25, 2006
13,498
Geelong, Australia
daveinprague said:
Being of a left wing mindset isnt a religion. Its REAL life. Is it based on ancient fairy tale, or the realisation that the world is unequal?
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Sorry, but a lot of left wing ideology and ideals are fairy tales. So much of it is not based on any kind of reality. It's based on a belief.

#1 on that list is the good old "we're all the same or we're all equal". A pie in the sky fairy tale style thought process which requires no scientific evidence from the person stating it to back it up.


I dont come from a left wing family. My father was an officer in the Northumberland Fusiliers, and my mother a non political nurse.
My father was protestant. My mother comes from Jewish family. Im obviously not religious.
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Doesn't mean someone didn't brain wash you.

Or are all people who came from a non-religious back grounds and found a faith now not brain washed? Did they reach their conclusions through inward critical assessment?
 


D

daveinprague

New member
Oct 1, 2009
12,572
Prague, Czech Republic
Tyrone Biggums said:
Sorry, but a lot of left wing ideology and ideals are fairy tales. So much of it is not based on any kind of reality. It's based on a belief.

#1 on that list is the good old "we're all the same or we're all equal". A pie in the sky fairy tale style thought process which requires no scientific evidence from the person stating it to back it up.




Doesn't mean someone didn't brain wash you.

Or are all people who came from a non-religious back grounds and found a faith now not brain washed? Did they reach their conclusions through inward critical assessment?
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I was brainwashed by life experience. Not a fantasy book.
 


Nibble

Nibble

New member
Jan 3, 2007
19,238
Tyrone Biggums said:
Sorry, but a lot of left wing ideology and ideals are fairy tales. So much of it is not based on any kind of reality. It's based on a belief.

#1 on that list is the good old "we're all the same or we're all equal". A pie in the sky fairy tale style thought process which requires no scientific evidence from the person stating it to

Doesn't mean someone didn't brain wash you.

Or are all people who came from a non-religious back grounds and found a faith now not brain washed? Did they reach their conclusions through inward critical assessment?
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I'm sorry but left wing ideology categorically does NOT state that we are all the same or equal what it tries to convey is that we are all different but that a fair society should offer the opportunity for people of all capabilities to offer something of equal importance to society and that they all have something of equal importance to offer and in return should all be afforded the same rights.

This of course rarely works in practice but is a worthy ideal to aspire to.
 










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