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That's basically inevitable though. Someone campaigning for us to stay in is likely to point out that things are ok now, and say that the economy or security will be much worse if we leave - unless they really have genuine evidence to prove that's the case (and they don't, because no one knows...

If that's all Trump said, we wouldn't all have our jaws on the floor. Sadly everything's a game to politicians.

Not at all. Someone is saying that the terrorists choose to believe in Islam and I'm simply explaining that generally isn't the case. Nothing pedantic about it at all, it's a fairly fundamental point if you want to get a better understanding as to why people commit these atrocities.

It is, it's simply about what you can and can't choose to believe. I assume you believe you are not a human body wired to power cells as in the Matrix. Now try and believe you are. You can't can you, it's impossible, you'd know you're lying to yourself.

You clearly don't. Do you believe you're a human? Do you believe that you're stuck in the Matrix, or do you believe you're free? And do you think you have a choice about those beliefs?

Not at all, but either you don't understand what belief means, or you don't understand what choice means. You think I choose to keep not believing, but I don't, it's not a choice. Just like I don't choose to think I'm a human. It's what I think, and I can't change it, I have no choice.

Yes you did (talking here about believing in god, not blowing themselves up), you said "No they still choose to believe in God". They don't. As children they believe what they're told, so they believe in god. They never have an epiphany that their believe is false, so they keep believing. I...

Young children don't choose what to believe, they believe what they're told. Do you seriously want to debate that?

Well that's a different point to your first. So we've established that they didn't choose to believe in god, they just do. After some brainwashing they're then told by leaders that god wants those who don't believe to be punished, and he will reward those that martyr themselves in paradise, and...

But the EU would be wise to want access to our information, which I imagine is vast compared to that of Switzerland and Norway, so it wouldn't make sense for the EU to delay giving us information. Sadly I suppose that what makes sense can be irrelevant when it comes to EU decision making.

Not necessarily. Children don't choose to believe in Santa, they're told he exists and they believe their parents. They don't think 'shall I believe my parents or not?', they just believe them, because they're kids and kids believe what their parents say. So children born into a strictly...

I wasn't specifically expecting an answer from you, let alone an apology. It was an open question to all. Exactly. We are all god's children, even atheists like me, and although I've been very disrespectful of him at times, I'm still his son and he loves me. He doesn't want his better children...

My only experience is seeing those who are described as hate preachers on the news, and little seems to be done about it.

Why aren't these hate preachers in prison? It is a crime to preach hate isn't it?

Either way I'd rather be dead. Which would probably suit them just fine.

So have a thread that says it's for respect and reflection, no politics please. Yes I heard you, but it's inevitable that one will lead to the other.

You'd really need the thread title changed - perhaps start your own one that is specifically to pay respects etc. I know there is, but it's almost inevitable that one will lead to the other. You start by discussing security, was it good enough and what can be done to improve it, and if someone...

There are over a thousand people murdered in the world every single day. There are presumably victims from this attack who are currently in hospital fighting for their lives. We should always be respectful of those that have been murdered, but I don't think we need to stop discussing the...

Oh I so hope that's accurate. There must be so many Muslims in this country who are sick of having their faith dragged through the mud by these mentalists, but I imagine most of think there's nothing they can do. I'd like to see more done to watch what Imams preach, and prosecute those that...

How could anyone in mainland Europe have any sense of security right now? I don't get it.