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That's not how I want to see multiculturalism. So here I am in lovely Hove - what is it that we don't believe? And like you, I don't like the way some communities are segregated, so why would I call you a name? Maybe it's your other views that lead to people calling you names.

Thousands of years ago, most tribes would fight other nearby tribes to the death, despite the fact that they were the same race - so that wasn't even racism, that was tribalism. Can you not see how far humans have come in that time?

So what is it all about?

I don't think I am. What we're disagreeing about is whether he's allowed to say things that would be illegal were it not for his Quran. My point is that if it's illegal to do something in the UK, it doesn't become legal if it's ok within the Quran. You disagree with me. I don't see where being...

A cop out of what? What are you talking about? I wasn't asked a question that I failed to respond to, I was just pointing out that saying I think we'd be better off without religion is like Choudry saying everywhere would be better off being ruled by sharia - the point being, it's not illegal to...

I have. I am happy to say that I think everywhere would be better off if there was no religion. I am not suggesting anyone is killed. As long as he was vague about what those rules were, he's not clearly telling people to go and kill. If he had said it's ok for Muslims to kill any non believer...

That's not correct, it's not ok to say things just because they're in a holy book, if they are inciting others to commit crimes. If his holy book says people should go and kill non believers, and he tells people to do that, he can't get off just because it's in his book.

The Imam who is speaking out against the Islamic scriptures went with the news crew to western Sydney and was spat on and sworn at by a lot of the locals. Welcome to Australia.

Presumably the things he was saying were illegal, as he got put away for it.

I haven't watched it, what happened (happens)? (not the premise of the show, but with these gangs)

How many do you know?

And that has to stop. We need people to not be xenophobic towards Muslims in general, so we can crack down on those that are really causing the problems without becoming intolerant or losing our liberties.

Agreed, but I'm responding to the idea that Choudry did nothing wrong in teaching ultra conservative Islam. If someone tells people here that they the Quran says that Muslims should fight us, then that is incitement in my view, and should be punishable.

We don't have free speech in this country, you're not allowed to be racist, homophobic, anti-disabled, or preach hate. Free speech exists in the US, our tighter rules don't seem to have made us more right wing than the US.

Can you give some examples of the text he preached?

Total guess work here, but maybe some close to him knew, and others whom he was affiliated with didn't :shrug: Presumably they'd tell as few people as possible, to keep the risk of being stopped to a minimum.

It depends if the authorities are allowing it so that they can gather information on those marching with it. If they're not, and it's just us being tolerant, then no, I don't think it's acceptable, and in my view it breaks the law of preaching hate. But I imagine our security services can use...

I think you mix sensible points with religious xenophobia, so your constructive debate gets lost.

Ban people! How many people are 'known to the security services' and how many of them know they are known? If it's a handful, it's manageable to be a bit draconian, but if it's thousands it's not easy to lock them all up without some proper evidence.

Mary did. But then so did the guy that shagged her.