Got something to say or just want fewer pesky ads? Join us... 😊

Register Log in

[News] Hamas/Gaza/Israel



R

rippleman

Well-known member
Oct 18, 2011
4,580
Pavilionaire said:
Revenge is a powerful motivator. And how much of Israel's over-reaction is due to the wounds lying deep in the psyche from the Holocaust and centuries of persecution? Netanyahu's own father was born in Poland in 1910 and was a hawkish Zionist who believed in the expulsion of the Arabs from the new Jewish homeland. He lived to be 102. It is not surprising Bibi is as tenacious and zealous as he is.

I would say the Israeli actions will have guaranteed instability in that region for another 40 years minimum, as well as losing Western goodwill for another 20 years minimum.
Click to expand...
If every descendant of somebody killed in the Holocaust behaved in the same way as Netanyahu the world really would be in bother. Fortunately, it is only Netanyahu and his small, but influential cabel of right-wing extremists (aided and abetted by us and the USA arming the Israeli state) that are committing the atrocities in Gaza. So let's not come up with "excuses" for him.

In any event, wouldn't it be odd for somebody whose family suffered in the Holocaust, to commit genocide himself? The nazis wanted to remove the Jewish peoples from the earth and decided the best way was to kill and starve them. The State of Israel wants to remove the Palestinian people from Gaza and has decided that the best way is to kill and starve them. Different scale, but exactly the same aim.
 




fly high

fly high

Well-known member
Aug 25, 2011
1,317
in a house
A1X said:
Yes it would appear so. All those destitute and orphaned kids we see on our screens in Gaza today will be an extremely fertile breeding ground for the Hamas (or whoever replaces Hamas) terrorists of the future. It is why ultimately a peaceful two-state solution backed by multiple international partners is the only outcome which stands a chance at bring peace.
Click to expand...
Sadly the hard part is convincing both sides to sign up for a two state solution. The hatred & distrust is even more entrenched than it was. I can't see it happening in this current century how ever much some may want it, the extremists on both sides will make sure it doesn't happen.
 
  • Like
Reactions: cjd


Zeberdi

Zeberdi

Brighton born & bred
NSC Patron
Oct 20, 2022
4,896
Pavilionaire said:
Revenge is a powerful motivator. And how much of Israel's over-reaction is due to the wounds lying deep in the psyche from the Holocaust and centuries of persecution? Netanyahu's own father was born in Poland in 1910 and was a hawkish Zionist who believed in the expulsion of the Arabs from the new Jewish homeland. He lived to be 102. It is not surprising Bibi is as tenacious and zealous as he is.
Click to expand...
Sorry but I take some exception to this and it is a little offensive that you would even suggest such a thing …. It is rather offensive too, especially for a non-Jewish person to be making generalised assumptions about a ‘Jewish psyche’ being responsible for the humanitarian catastrophe in Gaza. (I know you are not deliberately trying to insult Jews btw!)

There is nothing in the Jewish psych as you put it, to make Jewish people have a propensity to become war criminals or carry out the abhorrent treatment of Palestinians that we are seeing in Gaza. That is all Netanyahu’s political and religious extremism that has a very specific and geo-political agenda and also designed to keep him personally in power. Holocaust memories may make Israelis and Jews elsewhere more concerned for their security and after extreme and brutal extermination of over 5 million Jews in Nazi occupied Europe, this is understandable, but it doesn’t turn us into a heartless race of people bent on reaping revenge on helpless women and children in their thousands.

If you knew anything about the Jewish religion/character, you would know it has at it’s heart, as codified by the Torah, the welcoming of strangers and the highest form of charitable consciousness (which is to create a world where no one needed to rely on charity) . The spirit of generosity not ‘revenge’ is integral to Torah consciousness.

What is happening in Gaza, the Israeli government’s overreaction, is all to do with one man and his extremist minions’ pursuit of a Greater Israel, his obsession with avoiding corruption charges if he was voted out of power, and his own willingness to get into bed with far-right fascists to further his political and personal agenda.

Do not judge or think you can psychoanalyse the Jewish faith or being a Jew based on what you see unfolding in the news about Netanyahu’s war on the Gazan people.

’Israelis’ want Netanyahu out of power. The majority have absolutely NO desire for the destruction of Gaza nor desire mass civilian casualties - they see Netanyahu’s security forces as a failure and his war on Hamas, to get the hostages released, also failing.

TLDR? - it is not ‘ being Jewish’ that makes people revengeful monsters and war criminals but land grabbing greed, a desire for military power over others and political extremism.
 


Westdene Seagull

Westdene Seagull

aka Cap'n Carl Firecrotch
NSC Patron
Oct 27, 2003
21,045
The arse end of Hangleton
aolstudios said:
She hijacked planes (plural) for a bunch of murderous psychopaths.
Are we supposed to be impressed?
Or something else?
Seriously
Click to expand...
Yet she didn't actually kill anyone. Unlike, lets use a couple of examples, the terrorists that blew up the King David Hotel in Jerusalem in 1946 or those that murdered British troops - all in the name of creating the state of Israel. Yet those that use the same tactics to create the state of Palestine you don't approve of ?
 






Zeberdi

Zeberdi

Brighton born & bred
NSC Patron
Oct 20, 2022
4,896
Netanyahu, by baiting Iran, is dragging the US and UK further and further toward a direct conflict in the ME - I would argue that has always been his agenda (and said as much right at the beginning of this thread, although was lampooned for being a conspiracy theorist ) - it is not surprising to me that the attack on the Damascus complex happened against the backdrop of Western governments beginning to debate the wisdom of selling arms to Israel 😕. Of course we would not leave Israel unprotected in the face of Iran aggression - if anything, Iran’s promise to retaliate for these repeated attacks has refocussed the debate on needing to ‘defend’ Israel. Well played Netanyahu - changed the debate, got a very public ‘vow of iron clad support’ from a President who was beginning to be a thorn in your side just by bombing the Iran embassy in Damascus. It is solely because of Iran’s reluctance to get dragged into a direct conflict, that Netanyahu has not yet managed to spread this into a wider conflict.

No wonder Israelis political commentators are beginning to regard Netanyahu as the most immediate existential threat to Israel.

news.sky.com

Risks of bigger war rising as Iran intends to hit back over suspected Israeli embassy strike - but Biden knows he can't blink

After an airstrike killed Iranian generals in Syria's capital earlier this month, the risk of the Israel-Hamas war in Gaza escalating across the Middle East has been rising - with the Israeli military preparing for Tehran's retaliation. The US knows weakness will only embolden both sides.
news.sky.com news.sky.com
www.presstv.ir

Greatest existential threat to Israel is Benjamin Netanyahu

The Israeli war in Gaza has brought devastation to the strip, accompanied by the massacre of civilians, mostly women and children; however, it may have another casualty, the state of Israel itself.
www.presstv.ir www.presstv.ir
 


fly high

fly high

Well-known member
Aug 25, 2011
1,317
in a house
Zeberdi said:
Netanyahu, by baiting Iran, is dragging the US and UK further and further toward a direct conflict in the ME - I would argue that has always been his agenda (and said as much right at the beginning of this thread, although was lampooned for being a conspiracy theorist ) - it is not surprising to me that the attack on the Damascus complex happened against the backdrop of Western governments beginning to debate the wisdom of selling arms to Israel 😕. Of course we would not leave Israel unprotected in the face of Iran aggression - if anything, Iran’s promise to retaliate for these repeated attacks has refocussed the debate on needing to ‘defend’ Israel. Well played Netanyahu - changed the debate, got a very public ‘vow of iron clad support’ from a President who was beginning to be a thorn in your side just by bombing the Iran embassy in Damascus. It is solely because of Iran’s reluctance to get dragged into a direct conflict, that Netanyahu has not yet managed to spread this into a wider conflict.

No wonder Israelis political commentators are beginning to regard Netanyahu as the most immediate existential threat to Israel.

news.sky.com

Risks of bigger war rising as Iran intends to hit back over suspected Israeli embassy strike - but Biden knows he can't blink

After an airstrike killed Iranian generals in Syria's capital earlier this month, the risk of the Israel-Hamas war in Gaza escalating across the Middle East has been rising - with the Israeli military preparing for Tehran's retaliation. The US knows weakness will only embolden both sides.
news.sky.com news.sky.com
www.presstv.ir

Greatest existential threat to Israel is Benjamin Netanyahu

The Israeli war in Gaza has brought devastation to the strip, accompanied by the massacre of civilians, mostly women and children; however, it may have another casualty, the state of Israel itself.
www.presstv.ir www.presstv.ir
Click to expand...
I have thought for some time Netanyahu is the biggest danger to Israel along with his extremist partners in power.
 






Zeberdi

Zeberdi

Brighton born & bred
NSC Patron
Oct 20, 2022
4,896
Bozza said:
Reports Iran has launched a load of kamikaze drones at Israel.
Click to expand...
😕 The signs have been for the last 24 hrs this was imminent - US and EU pulling out non essential embassy staff and restricting travel etc Israel had all their combat fighters in the air it was reported earlier, presumably to ‘protect them’ from being targeted at the air bases - so sad for everyone involved that it’s all come to this - 🙁

eu.usatoday.com

Iran launches dozens of drones at Israel as Mideast tensions soar: Live updates

Iran has threatened to retaliate for an April 1 attack on the Iranian consulate in Damascus that killed seven of its military commanders.
eu.usatoday.com eu.usatoday.com

Israel has their ‘iron dome’ and amazing defence capabilities so hopefully the drones will be intercepted - CNN reporting White House committing US to Israel’s defence but expecting this will unfold over hours which gives Israel and US time to prepare.
 
Last edited:




Zeberdi

Zeberdi

Brighton born & bred
NSC Patron
Oct 20, 2022
4,896
NorthstandRacoon said:
All over shite fake religious beliefs and land. f***ing hate it.
Click to expand...
Please don’t attack Judaism or Islam - This is the results of Extremist ideology on both sides which as you say is about land and expansionist policies by a government supported by fascists to run Palestinians off their land..🙁.

The real concern is that Israel could ratch this up even further with a retaliatory attack on Iran‘s retaliation to the Embassy bombing

CNN - CRUISE missiles reportedly fired at Israel from Iran according to Israeli media - US now directly involved 😳 Middle Eastern airspace being shut down as drones head for Israel. Military targets most likely.
 






E

Exilegull

Well-known member
Mar 14, 2024
347
Iran Israel war would be world war like event 10 drones tho sound like state of intent more than declaration of war hope it stays at that
 


Zeberdi

Zeberdi

Brighton born & bred
NSC Patron
Oct 20, 2022
4,896
Exilegull said:
Iran Israel war would be world war like event 10 drones tho sound like state of intent more than declaration of war hope it stays at that
Click to expand...
Actually about 100 now reportedly - plus Cruise missiles. It’s a significant attack but depending the on targets/ warnings, still measured. Israel needs not to respond with a direct attack on Iran - otherwise with Netanyahu in charge, it will be difficult to keep a lid on it.
 




N

NorthstandRacoon

Well-known member
Aug 1, 2017
1,910
Withdean. Just behind the theatre of trees.
Zeberdi said:
Please don’t attack Judaism or Islam - This is the results of Extremist ideology on both sides which as you say is about land and expansionist policies by a government supported by fascists to run Palestinians off their land..🙁.

The real concern is that Israel could ratch this up even further with a retaliatory attack on Iran‘s retaliation to the Embassy bombing

CNN - CRUISE missiles reportedly fired at Israel from Iran according to Israeli media - US now directly involved 😳 Middle Eastern airspace being shut down as drones head for Israel. Military targets most likely.
Click to expand...

Religion is the cause if most major wars. It is bought into every conflict. Religion causes extremism based on harsh ideologies. It is a load of bollocks that in this day and age, people suffer because of one’s beliefs when it’s quite obvious it is all based on stories rather than fact. I hate it. Why can’t we live in peace ffs.
 


A1X

A1X

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Sep 1, 2017
17,905
Deepest, darkest Sussex
Obviously, and it shouldn’t need saying, Iran are ****s and this is just pointless savagery. But did the west really think Israel blowing up the Iranian embassy in Damascus was something Iran was just going to accept and move on from? It’s like poking an angry dog in the eye and saying “don’t you dare bite him”, it’s clearly not going to work.

Israel has been trying to provoke Iran for months, through targeting Hezbollah bigwigs and now Iranian ones, this was only going to be a matter of time. If Israel had it’s embassy blown up by the Iranians I doubt they’d just sit back and let it lie either.
 




G

GingerBeerMan

3-0
Dec 29, 2011
8,029
Mod edit title to include Iran? A small chance this is the start of WW3, let's have it clear for people visiting the site can quickly find it.
 






Zeberdi

Zeberdi

Brighton born & bred
NSC Patron
Oct 20, 2022
4,896
NorthstandRacoon said:
it’s quite obvious it is all based on stories rather than fact.
Click to expand...

I guess it’s all about one’s own world view - IMO When you deconstruct the reasons why humans have gone to war since time immemorial- it’s nearly always over territory and resources:

I don’t think it is religion ‘causing wars‘ per se IMO as much as religion being appropriated as an excuse to justify wars against different/neighbouring community over finite resources. But of course on an online forum where it’s popular to be morally outraged at the moralists that argument is probably too nuanced for most people. Billions of religious people do good in the world by charitable works and humanitarian aid, and campaigning for peace - people forget that when condemning religion.

As for Israel interests in the occupied territories , Gaza is rich in sea gas, the West Bank sitting on oil reserves and East Jerusalem having access to the most important water source in the region, the River Jordan, a region that is desperately short of water.

When you start unpacking it, it is too ‘simple’ to blame Netanyahu’s war on Gaza on religion. He is all about staying in power and relying on far right extremists to keep him there. This is a tragically self-fufilling prophecy of his own making because he has for years refused to recognise the rights of Palestinians to self-determination, pursued settlement policies and cruelly oppressed a nation of people enforcing extreme humanitarian suffering. Because Israel and the West are allies, his overreaction in Gaza and continual baiting of Iran has led us all to the edge of the Abyss 😡

NorthstandRacoon said:
I hate it. Why can’t we live in peace ffs.
Click to expand...
No one could argue with that 🙁

But it could be extremely difficult to stop Israel responding to this with an even stronger direct attack on Iran.
 
Last edited:


You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Albion and Premier League latest from Sky Sports


Top
Link Here