[Help] Child mental health

All good advice on dealing with the underlying issues of this but in terms of trying to deal with the meltdowns I have found that this is a brilliant resource.

https://www.zonesofregulation.com/index.html

Basically, it divides how a child is feeling into four colours, green being the optimal one. Then it offers strategies to get back to green depending on where the child at. Ultimately once a child is melting down (red zone) what you can do is very limited, for example, they are too far gone for breathing exercises. The trick is to train your child to recognise when they are moving out of the green zone and acting early to return - breathing exercises are brilliant here. With my kids the challenge has always been the speed in which they fly into red zone so it can be tricky to get them to recognise the indicators. However, this comes with practice and learning.

If this is something that you would like more information on please PM me I am happy to assist.

As an aside, before I found this resource I created a crude colour coded chart of my own for both my son and a kid in my class. On one end was white and the other black. This worked okay until I found myself yelling out of my back door 'you are behaving like a black boy"! I quickly changed the colours.

atomised said:

Been begging for a GP referral for a while CAMHS assessed him at the hospital and it's only because we pushed they have passed it to the community team. Hopefully we will finally get somewhere with that

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Doc Lyman is right, you have to keep trying different people until you find someone who 'gets it' can, and will help. Once you find that person hold on to them with everything you've got.

I went through "difficulties" with my daughter between the ages of 5 and 16 when she left home.
I found CAMHS utterly useless [in Shropshire], I really hope the team where you are will be better.
I wished I'd spent the money and gone private to get her the help she needed but couldn't afford to at the time. She was always in denial that she has a problem.
Don't believe people when they tell you they will grow out of it - my daughter is 25 now and still difficult, just in a more grown-up way.

Good luck ...

I just wanted to say all the best, and to give this a bump.

Weststander said:

I found the school, hopefully you have a caring person there taking control, do the work for you in getting the CAMHS ball rolling.

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CAMHS where worse than useless for my son. We paid privately in the end. Problem we had was the authority wanted to take us to court for school non attendance.

Ended up getting a letter of apology from the judge.

All the best and keep fighting

Appreciate your a loving and caring stepfather but what is his relationship like with his real father.No matter how civilised the breakup was between his mum and dad he is bound to be suffering from a sense of abandoment.How is he doing at school, as we all know kids can be cruel and verbal bullying such as "your dad left you then" could be going on although as his only 8 you would hope not.Sometimes the things we dont talk about are the things that gnaw away at us.Hope it works out for you,having suffered mental issues and now in a better place you have my sympathy,dont forget to look after yourself and your wife.

FIVESTEPS said:

Appreciate your a loving and caring stepfather but what is his relationship like with his real father.No matter how civilised the breakup was between his mum and dad he is bound to be suffering from a sense of abandoment.How is he doing at school, as we all know kids can be cruel and verbal bullying such as "your dad left you then" could be going on although as his only 8 you would hope not.Sometimes the things we dont talk about are the things that gnaw away at us.Hope it works out for you,having suffered mental issues and now in a better place you have my sympathy,dont forget to look after yourself and your wife.

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It's not great. He has supervised contact with his father and it's challenging at best. The extended maternal family are a massive issue but school wise he does ok and seems to have a decent friendship group

Making sure he has the number for Childline is important: https://www.childline.org.uk/ they provide an invaluable service for young people who have suicidal ideations.

Kooth is also a good online counselling service for young people. He might feel more comfortable initially texting something like that as opposed to seeing psychiatrist/counsellor straight away. It is also good for reading about shared experiences of other young people going through something similar. https://www.kooth.com/

Young minds have a lot of information for parents/carers in a similar position: https://youngminds.org.uk/find-help/for-parents/parents-survival-guide/

A 14 year old girl Bella Greer killed herself whilst waiting for CAMHS/NHS to get their arses into gear.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/03/08/bullied-bella-greer-14-suicide-nhs-mental-health-delays/
The background, the almost inevitable bullying at school.

I’m so hoping the Labour manifesto make a huge and immediate investment in this area a big priority. I may lobby Rachel Reeves and Wes Streeting.

Weststander said:

A 14 year old girl Bella Greer killed herself whilst waiting for CAMHS/NHS to get their arses into gear.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/03/08/bullied-bella-greer-14-suicide-nhs-mental-health-delays/
The background, the almost inevitable bullying at school.

I’m so hoping the Labour manifesto make a huge and immediate investment in this area a big priority. I may lobby Rachel Reeves and Wes Streeting.

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So sad. CAMHS were absolutely useless for us, it was only after the transition to adult services that something useful started to happen. Not sure money was the primary issue though - getting appointments wasn’t a problem, the whole way the support was structured was shambolic

dazzer6666 said:

So sad. CAMHS were absolutely useless for us, it was only after the transition to adult services that something useful started to happen. Not sure money was the primary issue though - getting appointments wasn’t a problem, the whole way the support was structured was shambolic

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We had some success …. infamously suicide needs to be mentioned. But there’s chaos eg when someone moves between age group services of CAMHS to Wellbeing the kid can be literally forgotten! Things in general have deteriorated since your experience in that the bloody Lockdowns have led to a huge leap in numbers of children who are deeply unwell. There aren’t the CAMHS clinical psychologists and consultant psychiatrists to cope.

We saw a heart wrenching thing whilst in the waiting room at CAMHS, it will live in the memory

Weststander said:

A 14 year old girl Bella Greer killed herself whilst waiting for CAMHS/NHS to get their arses into gear.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/03/08/bullied-bella-greer-14-suicide-nhs-mental-health-delays/
The background, the almost inevitable bullying at school.

I’m so hoping the Labour manifesto make a huge and immediate investment in this area a big priority. I may lobby Rachel Reeves and Wes Streeting.

Click to expand...

there has also been a very recent incident in East Sussex involving a 14 year old taking his own life. I have no idea whether CAMHS were involved but based on my stepsons continuing issues I doubt they were much help..
By way of an update on my situation he is massively struggling now he's transitioned to secondary school. they seem completely unwilling to deal with the issues instead leaving him even more isolated and punishing him when he's become distressed

atomised said:

there has also been a very recent incident in East Sussex involving a 14 year old taking his own life. I have no idea whether CAMHS were involved but based on my stepsons continuing issues I doubt they were much help..
By way of an update on my situation he is massively struggling now he's transitioned to secondary school. they seem completely unwilling to deal with the issues instead leaving him even more isolated and punishing him when he's become distressed

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Last few weeks there’s been another in West Sussex, a lad. My wife knows through her NHS role.

Some schools can be bloody awful at truly dealing with bullying, never, ever believe their anti bullying policy. Judge by deeds!

atomised said:

there has also been a very recent incident in East Sussex involving a 14 year old taking his own life. I have no idea whether CAMHS were involved but based on my stepsons continuing issues I doubt they were much help..
By way of an update on my situation he is massively struggling now he's transitioned to secondary school. they seem completely unwilling to deal with the issues instead leaving him even more isolated and punishing him when he's become distressed

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The school in our case was similarly useless (and as you intimate actually made things worse). Massive sympathy to anyone going through some like this - it’s hugely distressing.

Weststander said:

Last few weeks there’s been another in West Sussex, a lad. My wife knows through her NHS role.

Some schools can be bloody awful at truly dealing with bullying, never, ever believe their anti bullying policy. Judge by deeds!

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it's so frustrating. the other week he acted very out of character. ran from class, attempted to send an admittedly unpleasant message to a pupil who has been horrible to him ever since he moved to the school and he ended up with a 90 minute detention for it and still the school (incidentally commended for their anti bullying stance in a recent Ofsted) refuse to engage with us about what caused the outburst and how to manage things better.
you are so right about judging my deeds and right now with his spiralling as he did before the last major episode those deeds are distinctly lacking

atomised said:

it's so frustrating. the other week he acted very out of character. ran from class, attempted to send an admittedly unpleasant message to a pupil who has been horrible to him ever since he moved to the school and he ended up with a 90 minute detention for it and still the school (incidentally commended for their anti bullying stance in a recent Ofsted) refuse to engage with us about what caused the outburst and how to manage things better.
you are so right about judging my deeds and right now with his spiralling as he did before the last major episode those deeds are distinctly lacking

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I’m guessing I’m further down the parenting line than you, mine are 21 and 19?

Be there for him when he wants it, keep lines of communication open with him (it sounds like you are), as boys especially hide their anguish but that doesn’t underplay issues for girls too. We moved schools, once for each, for our girl she begged us and eventually I listened …. she was so right in that decision.

Weststander said:

I’m guessing I’m further down the parenting line than you, mine are 21 and 19?

Be there for him when he wants it, keep lines of communication open with him (it sounds like you are), as boys especially hide their anguish but that doesn’t underplay issues for girls too. We moved schools, once for each, for our girl she begged us and eventually I listened …. she was so right in that decision.

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I've got a daughter whose in her 30s but new relationship and stepsons aged 12 and 9.
the 12 year old has spent years masking, been abused by wider family and struggles daily we are considering pursuing a fresh start in a new location but certainly a change of school very much feels on the cards

atomised said:

I've got a daughter whose in her 30s but new relationship and stepsons aged 12 and 9.
the 12 year old has spent years masking, been abused by wider family and struggles daily we are considering pursuing a fresh start in a new location but certainly a change of school very much feels on the cards

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I’m envious of our neighbours, they’re switched on (there’s greater knowledge now) and take their kid each day (age 5 or 6?) to a woodland school near Uckfield. It costs. They admire the Finnish system where kids are given a rounded childhood.

I was lucky in that school overall was okay for me in the end, but it’s a one size fits all.

I wish we’d known and done something like that woodland school for my daughter, she’d have thrived.

In addition big numbers of kids are on the spectrum or have ADHD, but this is completely missed.

atomised said:

I've got a daughter whose in her 30s but new relationship and stepsons aged 12 and 9.
the 12 year old has spent years masking, been abused by wider family and struggles daily we are considering pursuing a fresh start in a new location but certainly a change of school very much feels on the cards

Click to expand...

I'm really sorry to hear this, and massively sympathise with you. CAMHS were absolutely bloody terrible with us. The transition from junior to senior was horrendous, for both ourselves and our daughter being sold on a senior school with nice fresh paint, ipads etc.
During an offsite PE day in year 9, our daughter was violently attacked in an unprovoked incident, having her hair ripped out. This was after she had called us crying from the toilet, as knew something may happen. It was all pre-mediated, with a group waiting outside for her.
It was all caught on camera, and we proceeded with a police case. The investigating officers went for prosecution, but it got thrown out. The reason being the other girl being a refugee, and despite lots of evidence, it wouldn't be good for the attackers wellbeing.
The School were horrendous too, with me at one stage breaking down in a meeting, due to the focus being on the attackers well being and not our daughters. There was no care for our daughter, just for the attacker.
She moves to a free school (want to be private school) who were terrible with mental health. This follows a move to a new senior School which is in an area that is not great, but support team were brilliant. So a lesson to see through all the talk on open days.
CAMHS were a joke, around 3 years for an ADHD and PTSD diagnosis, so no support plan and years of education lost due to incompetence. You also need the diagnosis to prescribed medication, so too little too late there.
Only 6 months back we were told the trauma therapy is ready, over 3 years since referral.
We had paid for a councilor privately which didn't really help tbh.
Life was hell. Any parent of a child with complex mental health will know. Something else happened, which as a father I won't say the word, but again dropped by prosecution due to not enough evidence to prosecute the scumbag who had done the same to another girl.
We had self harm, suicide attempts, meltdowns etc and the impact on our youngests anxiety is very sad to see.
It hasn't got any easier, cocaine and so much other stuff. We now have a grandchild who was in NICU for months following a severe brain bleed at birth. Very likely to have longterm disabilities, but he is alive, and that is enough, given they mentioned switching off support. Both me and my wife are on anti depressants, everything got too much and I was picked up by the the chaplaincy at Beachy head last year. I have PTSD too, and talking about why also helped me.
The chaplaincy team were amazing, I can't stress enough to say speak with others. I did take me months to start feeling positive, and I'm in a better place.
Tbh I'm definitely on the spectrum, but feel a diagnosis won't help, I just learn to live with it.
This is the reason I am a massively advocate not targeting individuals on this forum. I previously referred to knowing someone on the forum attempting suicide, that person was me. I now speak about men talking about mental health whenever I can. It is something not to be embarrassed about.
Honestly make notes of everything re your children, dates and times etc and pile the pressure on CAMHS. We were probably guilty of not pushing them enough, we were just surviving. I was a bit pissed off the see a NI cut in the budget, when critical services like CAMHS need better funding, the cut benefits me financially, but not as much as it would benefit others.
Make sure you look after yourself, don't be embarrassed to talk and go to your GP to get help. As Roberto would say; it takes balls, big balls! Crying is ok too!
I've found excercise massively helps my state of mind.

As strange as it may sound, that's why I feel a little low when the Albion lose, all the build up and excitement, then a low if it doesn't go our way. Yep seems silly, but that's what happens when the wires at birth got mixed up.
If you or anyone ever needs advice or a chat, drop me a message, even if you'd like me to review anything you send onto CAMHS.
There are more of us going through this than you'd think.

Excuse typos etc!

brighton_dave said:

I'm really sorry to hear this, and massively sympathise with you. CAMHS were absolutely bloody terrible with us. The transition from junior to senior was horrendous, for both ourselves and our daughter being sold on a senior school with nice fresh paint, ipads etc.
During an offside PE day in year 9, our daughter was violently attacked in an unprovoked incident, having her hair ripped out. This was after she had called is crying as knew something may happen.
It was all caught on camera, and we proceeded with a police case. The investigating officers went for prosecution, but it got thrown out. The reason being the other girl being a refugee, and despite lots of evidence, it wouldn't be good for the attackers wellbeing.
The School were horrendous too, with me at one stage breaking down in a meeting, due to the focus being on the attackers well being and not our daughters. There was no care for our daughter, just for the attacker.
She moves to a free school (want to be private school) who were terrible with mental health. This follows a move to a new senior School which is in an area that is not great, but support team were brilliant. So a lesson to see through all the talk on open days.
CAMHS were a joke, around 3 years for an ADHD and PTSD diagnosis, so no support plan and years of education lost due to incompetence. You also need the diagnosis to prescribed medication, so too little too late there.
Only 6 months back we were told the trauma therapy is ready, over 3 years since referral.
We had paid for a councilor privately which didn't really help tbh.
Life was hell. Any parent of a child with complex mental health will know. Something else happened, which as a father I won't say the word, but again dropped by prosecution due to not enough evidence to prosecute the scumbag who had done the same to another girl.
We had self harm, suicide attempts, meltdowns etc and the impact on youngest anxiety is very sad to see.
It hasn't got any easier, cocaine and ao much other stuff. We now have a grandchild who was in NICU for months following a severe brain bleed at birth. Very likely to have longterm disabilities, but he is alive, and that is enough, given they mentioned switching off support. Both me and my wife are on anti depressant, everything got too much and I was picked up by the the chaplaincy at Beachy head last year. I have PTSD too, and talking about why also helped me.
The chaplaincy team were amazing, I can't stress enough to say speak with others. I did take me months to start feeling positive, and I'm in a better place.
Tbh I'm definitely on the spectrum, but feel a diagnosis won't help, I just learn to live with it.
This is the reason a massively advocate not targeting individuals on this forum. I previously referred to knowing someone on the forum attempting suicide, that person was me. I now speak about men speaking out whenever I can. It is something to be embarrassed about.
Honestly make notes of everything re your children, dates and times etc and pile the pressure on CAMHS. We were probably guilty of not pushing them enough, we were just surviving. I was a bit pissed off the see a NI cut in the budget, when critical services like CAMHS need better funding, the cut benefits me financially, but not as much as it would benefit others.
Make sure you look after yourself, don't be embarrassed to talk and go to your GP to get help. As Roberto would say; it takes balls, big balls! Crying is ok too!
I've found excercise massively helps my state of mind.

As strange as it may sound, that's why I feel a little low when the Albion lose, all the build up and excitement, then a low if it doesn't go our way. Yep seems silly, but that's what happens when the wires at birth got mixed up.
If you ever need advise of a chat, drop me a message, even if you'd like me to review anything you send onto CAMHS.
There are more of us going through this than you'd think.

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sorry to read all that it's so difficult, the biggest problem I see is that those with complex mental health needs get so skilled at covering it up until they hit that tipping point

thank you though I will drop you a quick message tomorrow. it's good to know there are others going through this until I started this thread back in 2020 I was blissfully oblivious that an 8 year old boy could have such severe mental health issues to deal with.