[Politics] Brexit

[pastafarian]

The British Medical Association and the Lancet both say the same thing. You can have Brexit or the NHS. You can't have both.





[tweet]1058651420273053701[/tweet]

I have never heard the BMA and Lancet say "you can have Brexit or the NHS. You CANT have both".
Its such a ridiculous thing to say (they would be laughed out of town) i can only believe this is something that is said in the twitter universe for people like you to believe that its possible and then to parrot it forward.
How project fruitcake and desperately running out of ideas do you have to be to believe that when we Brexit and leave the EU we CANT have an NHS anymore.
We had an NHS before we joined the EU and we will have an NHS after we leave the EU.

There are not enough hats

 

[pastafarian]

Indeed .. it is often said that many people voted to leave out of frustration at being continually ignored, belittled, patronised and insulted by politicians/elites which is probably true but it has been a real eye-opener seeing the exact same attitude expressed by a section of our fellow countrymen/women (including nearly all remain participants on this thread). They belong to a rather shameful and embarrassing loon minority that seem to have an inordinate amount of time on their hands to abuse people who disagree with them and/or rubbish this great country and its democratic norms .. all very disappointing and thoroughly unbritish.

Heads up.
Ive been reading some of their twitter nonsense recently and the loon minority on there have been slowly building up steam into an all out frenzied attack on the BBC, who are apparently now a biased pro-brexit alt right corrupt government tool ripe for investigation, with some calling for a ban of their brexit news and boycott of the licence fee.
How mad is that?...........talk about dysfunctional and blind with anger.

 

[nicko31]

Keeping the whole of UK in Customs Union until the non-existent technology appears

https://news.sky.com/story/mays-secret-brexit-deal-avoids-irish-backstop-report-11544422

Its the kind of deal that might gets the votes in parliament.

 

[pastafarian]

Keeping the whole of UK in Customs Union until the non-existent technology appears

https://news.sky.com/story/mays-secret-brexit-deal-avoids-irish-backstop-report-11544422

Its the kind of deal that might gets the votes in parliament.

If the Times report is accurate.

"Under the agreed deal, the EU accepts that regulatory checks on goods can be carried out in factories and shops rather than at the border"

This would be an enormous concession from the EU who have insisted regulatory checks must be carried out at the border. Mogg and his crew have been banging on that these checks dont have to be at the border and can be carried out elsewhere, The EU gave a slight confirmation weeks ago that some checks(ie vetinary) dont have to be at a border post but can be in the vicinity but this would be a huge cave in by the EU for across the board checks.

A Downing Street spokesman called the newspaper report "speculation"..........is probably all you need to know

 

[ManOfSussex]

Keeping the whole of UK in Customs Union until the non-existent technology appears

https://news.sky.com/story/mays-secret-brexit-deal-avoids-irish-backstop-report-11544422

Its the kind of deal that might gets the votes in parliament.

The Sunday Times also says May is now under pressure to publish the legal advice on any deal - 9 cabinet ministers are also reported as saying they wont vote for any deal until Geoffrey Cox gives it his backing. Steve Baker is also quoted as saying it should basically now be a cabinet decision too, which I found intriguing. There still also appears to be question marks on what happens to Northern Ireland on the exit clause from the UK wide customs union proposal. The final quote from the main report is:

A senior Whitehall source added: “The PM will be able to say there’s no more backstop, we’ve got rid of that — success. It is UK-wide — success. There’s an exit mechanism — success. And you’ve got Canada. The small print is that Ireland is f*****.”

David Davis has also written a piece in The Sunday Times today quoted in the report in which he talks of the potential for 'a Hotel California Brexit' and wants the legal advice published for MP's before a vote, but I'll have to save reading his pearls of wisdom in my paper version in the pub at lunchtime, after the sport section and a few Guinness - it'll be less of head**** that way.

 

[The Clamp]

Obviously I don't particularly think a second vote will make a difference, if the British public are so thick they voted out I don't think we will get any more intelligent but maybe we have got more info now and maybe it will make a difference. Who knows. Personally nothing but a total reversal will satisfy me but it may be the only chance we have of averting total disaster. Either way 70 business's are concerned enough to get this going. I suppose we all have to ignore their legitimate concerns and the fact they were lied to..We're on our way etc.





Business leaders call for second EU vote



The letter concludes: "We are now facing either a blindfold or a destructive hard Brexit.

"Given that neither was on the ballot in 2016, we believe the ultimate choice should be handed back to the public with a People's Vote."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46086336

 

[CHAPPERS]

We had an NHS before we joined the EU and we will have an NHS after we leave the EU.

Simple isn't it. That ****ing simple.

 

[The Clamp]

The NHS as we know it will be dead within 5 years. Corporate U.S has been itching to get it's hands on those contracts for decades and we will hand it to them in a trade deal. No doubt about that. The vile Tories would have sold it off eventually anyway but it is their biggest bargaining chip for trade deals. And it doesn't even belong to them.

This is what a Leave vote meant.

 

[cunning fergus]

The NHS as we know it will be dead within 5 years. Corporate U.S has been itching to get it's hands on those contracts for decades and we will hand it to them in a trade deal. No doubt about that. The vile Tories would have sold it off eventually anyway but it is their biggest bargaining chip for trade deals. And it doesn't even belong to them.

This is what a Leave vote meant.

On the contrary, staying in the EU would have changed the NHS......

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/feb/22/ttip-deal-real-serious-risk-nhs-leading-qc

This is why having trade agreements delivered by our ruling government under the scrutiny of a fully active opposition should prevent this kind of stuff happening.

On the other hand, trade agreements carried output by unelected bureaucrats hidden from the scrutiny of an active opposition will allow this kind of stuff to happen.

 

[cunning fergus]

Obviously I don't particularly think a second vote will make a difference, if the British public are so thick they voted out I don't think we will get any more intelligent but maybe we have got more info now and maybe it will make a difference. Who knows. Personally nothing but a total reversal will satisfy me but it may be the only chance we have of averting total disaster. Either way 70 business's are concerned enough to get this going. I suppose we all have to ignore their legitimate concerns and the fact they were lied to..We're on our way etc.





Business leaders call for second EU vote



The letter concludes: "We are now facing either a blindfold or a destructive hard Brexit.

"Given that neither was on the ballot in 2016, we believe the ultimate choice should be handed back to the public with a People's Vote."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46086336

So the people’s vote is really the corporate globalist Tory capitalist vote.........thanks for letting me know.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Keeping the whole of UK in Customs Union until the non-existent technology appears

https://news.sky.com/story/mays-secret-brexit-deal-avoids-irish-backstop-report-11544422

Its the kind of deal that might gets the votes in parliament.

So that would mean going with what we agreed on 9th December last year in order to sign off Phase 1. This last year's negotiations have gone well then

 

[cunning fergus]

The British Medical Association and the Lancet both say the same thing. You can have Brexit or the NHS. You can't have both.

[tweet]1058651420273053701[/tweet]

Maybe we should have warnings on ballot papers going forward. “Making the wrong democratic choice will damage your health”.

The “we know what’s good for you” approach to governance really works well doesn’t it........

 

[The Clamp]

So the people’s vote is really the corporate globalist Tory capitalist vote.........thanks for letting me know.

You don't really understand things do you.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

So the people’s vote is really the corporate globalist Tory capitalist vote.........thanks for letting me know.

Yay. He’s back. Ah yes, I remember, we’re all “Tory shills”. If you could also knock off your other repeat posts (you know, the transit van one, the one about sugar), tell us multiple times you’re a working class by from Moulscoomb and throw in a few badly translated German slurs we can all move on quickly.

PS always up for a chat on pharmacovigilance though, remember?

 

[The Clamp]

There is clearly an appetite for a 2nd referendum but May will never go for it as if it came out as Remain she would be finished. So, in short, the demise of the UK has come about because one Tory leader then another tried to save their careers at the expense of the UK.

And some people still think this was about their voice being heard. Tragic.

How on earth did we let this happen?

 

[tedebear]

Brexit has completed screwed our small business, infact we're discussing winding it down. Most of our customers were in Europe where they are actually still happy to pay for good workmanship, happy to get a good English engine builder for their competitive English race car, but now they don't want to know us, our orders are nearly non existent, when usually over winter we have rebuild after rebuild. As for UK customers most want to screw us down on price and then when they blow up an engine throw their lawyers at us, to compensate for their inability to drive...Odd that they wax lyrical about Brexit saving our jobs and our english companies....anyone who voted Brexit and didn't think about this type of thing really needs their 2 brain cells examined...

 

[The Clamp]

Brexit has completed screwed our small business, infact we're discussing winding it down. Most of our customers were in Europe where they are actually still happy to pay for good workmanship, happy to get a good English engine builder for their competitive English race car, but now they don't want to know us, our orders are nearly non existent, when usually over winter we have rebuild after rebuild. As for UK customers most want to screw us down on price and then when they blow up an engine throw their lawyers at us, to compensate for their inability to drive...Odd that they wax lyrical about Brexit saving our jobs and our english companies....anyone who voted Brexit and didn't think about this type of thing really needs their 2 brain cells examined...

But as any one of the 3 Leave voters left on this thread will tell you our sovereignty is priority at all costs. Ignoring the fact that we never lost sovereignty , we are on our way, apparently.

Genuinely sorry to hear about your business troubles. I imagine this sort of thing is happening up and down the country. I really do wish the leave voters had thought a bit more about their vote. All so unnecessary too.

I'm sure they will claim they did think about it and decided it was worth it in the end. At what point will that defence crumble? It's starting to look downright silly as it is.

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

Maybe we should have warnings on ballot papers going forward. “Making the wrong democratic choice will damage your health”.

The “we know what’s good for you” approach to governance really works well doesn’t it........

Are you really trying to suggest that we (the collective we) know more about healthcare than trained professionals? The “we’ve has enough of experts” mentality right there... assuming that’s what you’re getting at...

 

[The Clamp]

Are you really trying to suggest that we (the collective we) know more about healthcare than trained professionals? The “we’ve has enough of experts” mentality right there... assuming that’s what you’re getting at...

Do not feed the troll.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Brexit has completed screwed our small business, infact we're discussing winding it down. Most of our customers were in Europe where they are actually still happy to pay for good workmanship, happy to get a good English engine builder for their competitive English race car, but now they don't want to know us, our orders are nearly non existent, when usually over winter we have rebuild after rebuild. As for UK customers most want to screw us down on price and then when they blow up an engine throw their lawyers at us, to compensate for their inability to drive...Odd that they wax lyrical about Brexit saving our jobs and our english companies....anyone who voted Brexit and didn't think about this type of thing really needs their 2 brain cells examined...

I’m very very sorry to hear this. It must be devastating for you. I truly hope you can sort something out.

As an aside, your type of business is exactly the type Britain needs not only to keep, but encourage.