Could Nigel Farage end up a great British political leader?

[User removed 4]

We fought 2 world wars to keep fascism at bay and fought both in alliance with our European neighbours as equal allies.

Your rhetoric is the kind of jingoistic fear mongering that is exactly the opposite of the real issues people should be discussing regarding the actual economic, and political benefits of being within Europe.

No we didn't , we fought the first world war in response to German and austro hungarian territorial ambitions, the Nazi party didn't even exist in 1914, and I'd say the same about the second world war when you really analyse the lead up, the British people may not have been big fans of fascism but memories of the horrors of the western front were far too fresh in the nations mind for them to want to go to war against it, your rhetoric , whilst also being factually incorrect , is the kind of empty headed repetition of the lies of career politicians that stifle any meaningful debate on the benefits of being part of the EU, there are certainly some economic benefits , but political ? Don't make me laugh, you only have to look at that nonentity baroness Ashton to how seriously EU foreign policy is NOT taken.

 

[Napper]

Farage being on tv all the time keeps the hate going whilst the current lot continue to push forward the privatisation and money stealing elsewhere . The media are a mouthpiece for the bankers . Don't take everything you read and see as the only thing to think about .

 

[Bold Seagull]

No we didn't , we fought the first world war in response to German and austro hungarian territorial ambitions, the Nazi party didn't even exist in 1914, and I'd say the same about the second world war when you really analyse the lead up, the British people may not have been big fans of fascism but memories of the horrors of the western front were far too fresh in the nations mind for them to want to go to war against it, your rhetoric , whilst also being factually incorrect , is the kind of empty headed repetition of the lies of career politicians that stifle any meaningful debate on the benefits of being part of the EU, there are certainly some economic benefits , but political ? Don't make me laugh, you only have to look at that nonentity baroness Ashton to how seriously EU foreign policy is NOT taken.

We'll agree then that the wars have no place in a debate about the EU! (Which was the point I was making regardless of how inaccurate you felt it was).

 

[sahel]

No we didn't , we fought the first world war in response to German and austro hungarian territorial ambitions, the Nazi party didn't even exist in 1914, and I'd say the same about the second world war when you really analyse the lead up, the British people may not have been big fans of fascism but memories of the horrors of the western front were far too fresh in the nations mind for them to want to go to war against it, your rhetoric , whilst also being factually incorrect , is the kind of empty headed repetition of the lies of career politicians that stifle any meaningful debate on the benefits of being part of the EU, there are certainly some economic benefits , but political ? Don't make me laugh, you only have to look at that nonentity baroness Ashton to how seriously EU foreign policy is NOT taken.

You don't think peace in Europe for the last 70 years is a political benefit or do you think that happened by accident? Germany once again dominates Europe but this time it is peaceful and co-operative and its own prosperity depends on the peace and prosperity of its neighbouring countries. That is the achievement of the EU. The Middle East needs an "EU" and Asia needs an "EU" to stop war breaking out between China and Japan. We have been hugely lucky that far sighted people set up the beginnings of the EU back in the late 40s. You throw it away at your peril

 

[Deleted member 22389]

You don't think peace in Europe for the last 70 years is a political benefit or do you think that happened by accident? Germany once again dominates Europe but this time it is peaceful and co-operative and its own prosperity depends on the peace and prosperity of its neighbouring countries. That is the achievement of the EU. The Middle East needs an "EU" and Asia needs an "EU" to stop war breaking out between China and Japan. We have been hugely lucky that far sighted people set up the beginnings of the EU back in the late 40s. You throw it away at your peril

Listen nobody is against the idea of the EU, some people are against how it is currently being run. At the moment it is not working out as it should do for so many countries in the EU, so it needs change. Look at Greece, Spain, Italy as an example where they still have massive unemployment rates. People need to be listened too.

The same questions are being asked everywhere
http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/03/24/uk-germany-eu-migrants-idUKBREA2N16U20140324

 

[pastafarian]

The EU was established precisely to prevent wars like WW1 and 2

No it really wasnt,but im turning my pedant switch to "on"

You seem to be confused

The original (ECSC) The European Coal and Steel Community which did indeed try to neutralise the threat of war by establishing a common market for natural resourses was established with the Treaty of Paris 1951

The EEC (European Economic Community) was established with the treaty of Rome 1957

The EU(European Union) came into force with the passing of the Maastricht Treaty in 1993

 

[pastafarian]

The Middle East needs an "EU" and Asia needs an "EU" to stop war breaking out between China and Japan. We have been hugely lucky that far sighted people set up the beginnings of the EU back in the late 40s. You throw it away at your peril

You really are confused,i think you mean NATO in the late 40`s

 

[sahel]

Listen nobody is against the idea of the EU, some people are against how it is currently being run. At the moment it is not working out as it should do for so many countries in the EU, so it needs change. Look at Greece, Spain, Italy as an example where they still have massive unemployment rates. People need to be listened too.

The same questions are being asked everywhere
http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/03/24/uk-germany-eu-migrants-idUKBREA2N16U20140324

Unfortunately I think you are wrong. I think lots of people are against the EU in principle - certainly UKIP are. Reform is fine but please don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. Just as much as in 1945 the world needs co-operation and peace not conflict and competition. One day Russia will join the EU and then the whole of Europe will be united in a peaceful society of states. What an ideal to follow!

 

[severnside gull]

Just seen rhis thread title.





Laughed my arse off!

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

He seems passionate and honest, which is more than can be said for the leaders of the three main parties. The problem isn't his personality, it's his politics. No far-right leader can ever become "great" in the modern Western world, they can only be villainous - and rightly so.

I agree he really cares about what he does. He is just wrong about everything. Even he seems to have admitted that their manifesto at the last election was an embarrassment. In my view they don't have the mechanisms or the expertise in any field to put together a sensible set of policies

 

[pastafarian]

He is just wrong about everything.

But there lies the crux of the debate.

He is pushing for example a system like Australia where people are allowed in with skills that we lack.

You say thats wrong.



The debate will be never ending!

 

[Deleted member 22389]

But there lies the crux of the debate.

He is pushing for example a system like Australia where people are allowed in with skills that we lack.

You say thats wrong.

The debate will be never ending!

Exactly. Thanks Nigel for getting me interested and engaged in Politics. For me he has exposed flaws in the system, in the EU that will effect us all if we don't start sorting it out.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

The sensible thing to do would be to address why his supporters(from all political persuasions) feel they need to move to UKIP. Currently the main parties are still choosing to ignore this, instead they still play the ridicule card......this policy doesnt seem to be working if the polls are correct ,it just seems to add to his support.

And therein lies the problem. Instead of dealing with the EU challenge the other parties just name call. It's rather prevalent on here as well - note that anyone who has used the words racist and xenophobia haven't actually put up a coherent argument against UKIP. For me personally UKIP represent the chance of a proper referendum on our membership of the EU - something I want a say on as the Common Market we voted to join has morphed into a political beast that we have never been consulted on. The three main parties just pay lip service to those voters who want out of the EU.

Labour - can't be trusted on the EU. Promised a referendum and then broke that promise.
Tories - have offered a referendum with the condition we put them back in government ( very unlikely to happen ).
Lib Dems - would vote for complete political and fiscal union if they could.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

And therein lies the problem. Instead of dealing with the EU challenge the other parties just name call. It's rather prevalent on here as well - note that anyone who has used the words racist and xenophobia haven't actually put up a coherent argument against UKIP. For me personally UKIP represent the chance of a proper referendum on our membership of the EU - something I want a say on as the Common Market we voted to join has morphed into a political beast that we have never been consulted on. The three main parties just pay lip service to those voters who want out of the EU.

Labour - can't be trusted on the EU. Promised a referendum and then broke that promise.
Tories - have offered a referendum with the condition we put them back in government ( very unlikely to happen ).
Lib Dems - would vote for complete political and fiscal union if they could.

Your right on all three parties there.
As for the name calling, it's boring and so predictable. It proves to me that they don't have the foggiest or care for what is really happening in other parts of the EU. The very thing they support is the very thing that is ruining people lives in Southern parts of Europe. This is forcing people to leave their countries and seek employment in Northern Europe. You add to this migration from Eastern Europe, on top of all the people who are escaping the problems from places like Syria, Africa seriously the whole EU rules about open borders needs to be looked at. If people cannot see this, then they need to look at this situation a bit deeper and start connecting the dots.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

The very thing they support is the very thing that is ruining people lives in Southern parts of Europe.

Strange, Russia invades The Crimea and effectively installs their own government and everyone ( rightly ) claims this to be wrong. There was hardly a peep when the EU forced a change of government in Greece and Italy.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Strange, Russia invades The Crimea and effectively installs their own government and everyone ( right ) claims this to be wrong. There was hardly a peep when the EU forced a change of government in Greece and Italy.

And there we go, something is not quite right here is it.

 

[Simster]

This - I'd rather have people like Farage in politics than the current "career" politicians across both main parties.

I very much agree with this.

Although the flip side is that Farage will never appeal to anyone other than disaffected Tory voters who are either xenophobic or Eurosceptic. For example, Bob Crowe has his ilk were fiercely anti-EU, but would never vote for Farage and his little party.

 

[Biscuit]

He leads a pressure group, no more.

 

[fat old seagull]

Having watched Nick Clegg putting forward his views in 'the debate' I have to wonder if he is really up to being deputy PM. I think I'd sooner Mr Blobby on the case !

 

[Theatre of Trees]

Strange, Russia invades The Crimea and effectively installs their own government and everyone ( rightly ) claims this to be wrong. There was hardly a peep when the EU forced a change of government in Greece and Italy.

Can you remind me which local paramilitary units the EU used in these takeovers.